canada-marlin24 Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 I guess 2017 is our year then, boys! Ozuna and Yelich have sucked this team dry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bret Hart Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Next vs. Dodgers matchups Brett Anderson vs Justin Nicolino Clayton Kershaw vs Tom Koehler Zack Greinke vs Jose Urena #sweptagain? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schnellders Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 This really could be a 0-9 homestand (bullpen will blow Jose's start). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackRubysDog Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 I gave up watching when we went 0-4 to save myself some pain. When I saw the final score I thought at least Stanton got another homer. Laughed myself silly when I found out it was Hech. What's the betting DJ now moves Hech to hit fourth? From tomorrow I am away for a few days in a place with no broadband, so I can't watch the games. I am quite looking forwards to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SongInTheAir Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Similar situation here as the games will be blacked out for me on MLB.tv. I know about proxies, but that takes more effort than any Marlin has shown this season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fish14 Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 I went to the game last night and my oh my was that fucking boring. Just a pathetic team. We need two legitimate middle of the order hitters for us to become even an average hitting team. As it currently stands we have Gordon and Stanton and a bunch of bad singles hitters with like 3 black holes in the lineup. I hope they don't count on realmuto to be the starter next year with no competition. It's so hard not to be a horrible hitting team with realmuto hech and a pitcher playing every day Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fish14 Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Hech has been better than expected and has been a little unlucky in June. Realmuto is whatever. Catcher position. It wouldn't be a big deal if ozuna, yelich, morse, and prado were any good. Also, I think people might just be noticing Dee Gordon's regression. He's going to have a good first half, just like last year. We'll see about the second. His June has been a much closer to the type of player he probably is, but his offensive numbers will probably continue to fall. Buddy hasn't walked in June. He's gotta figure something out. The raw ability is there, but 2 months of stupid high babip and being a turd the rest of the way doesn't cut it for a leadoff hitter. I don't care how fast he is. Im sick of the Hech argument. Stop grading him on the curve of his previous ineptness. Just because he has improved with the bat doesnt make him a good hitter. If he is now around a .700 OPS guy that doesnt make him any better than any other .700 OPS guy just because he used to be a .600 OPS guy. Don't get me wrong, he should definitely be on the team and starting for us. Im just sick of people overrating his improvements. You can't just say Realmuto is whatever just because he plays catcher. There are a bunch of quality hitting catchers in the league. Teams that don't have a quality catcher usually don't have holes at 1b, 3b, SS, and underperforming outfielders as well. We have literally 6 spots in our order that have either completely underperformed or have been black holes, and that isn't even including the pitcher spot. As for Gordon, of course he is going to regress. His run was unreal but it was pretty obvious he was going to come back to earth. We will see how far he regresses but his resin is obviously also gonna hurt our team. We literally need at least 2 big power bats. A guy like Upton and Lind would be amazing additions for this team. Its an organizational issue, we don't draft well, we don't spend money on quality international prospects, and we don't spend money at the major league free agent level. No shit we are not good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fish14 Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 On a side note I'm over Marcell Ozuna. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverBullet Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 The fact that I'm looking forward to Morse returning is pretty telling of how poor this team is playing lately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fish14 Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 The fact that I'm looking forward to Morse returning is pretty telling of how poor this team is playing lately. Him being what he was last year would have helped this team tremendously. If I recall he had a great spring too so who the fuck knows what happened. I feel like just the overall aura surrounding this team and ownership and front office will not allow this team to win until Loria sells. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverBullet Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 I know things are bad now but I don't believe in that aura stuff. That's what the fans and media may feel but not the players. They're adults. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fish14 Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 I know things are bad now but I don't believe in that aura stuff. That's what the fans and media may feel but not the players. They're adults. There is clearly a toxic air around this team though. We may be a bad team regardless, but I think just the complete cluster fuck of an organization that we are can definitely be felt within the organization by the players. How many managerial firings has Stanton been through and he's barely 25? That kind of thing takes its toll. Then we have numerous marketing issues, things like the poker night or whatever it is. Individually these are relatively minor but collectively month in and month out we look like a clusterfuck on and off the field and I honestly believe that takes a toll on the players. You could tell when the Jennings stuff came out and we had unnamed players talking off the record it just seems like being in the clubhouse is a burden. Its a shame too because the right team with the right front office and marketing along with the beautiful stadium this team could have a great feeling around it. It really is just a matter of Loria. He needs to go, plain and simple. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fish14 Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Hech is the 5th best SS in baseball right now. So you can keep hating Hech for no reason all you want, but you're just wrong. There aren't a bunch of quality hitting catchers in the league. The ones that are good are expensive and/or under contract. You can't just go and find a great catcher. If realmuto ends up being our one weak position, whatever. Can't have allstars all over the diamond. I never said he isn't a good SS. I said he isn't a good hitter. I think the best thing you can say about his hitting is he is a quality number 8 hitter, which isn't saying much. You guys are just so used to him being a .600 OPS guy but he is now a .700 OPS guy, not .800 as many of you would like to believe. The guy has a .726 OPS which was closer to .700 before the late HR last night, and while that is passable considering his defense, stop making him out to be some hugely improved hitter. Im willing to bet he will end the year under .700 OPS again. I like Hech and he is a good SS, all I'm saying is stop acting as if he is this great and incredibly improved hitter now. That is literally all I'm saying. I never said you could go out and find a great catcher. My point was that we can't have this many black holes in the lineup. Realmuto has been dreadful offensively and hasn't been great for much of his time in the minors hitting wise as well. He was good where everyone is in Greensboro, then had two bad years and was better his second go around in Jacksonville. He might very well be a part of the future, but counting him as a starter of the future isn't a given and I really hope the front office doesnt do that. I like his defense but his bat in combination with a bunch of the other crappy bats we have make our lineup dreadful. And finding a quality hitting catcher isn't as difficult as you and the marlins make it out to be. There are 15 catchers with an OPS of at least .747, albeit a few that have had fewer plate appearances this year due to injury such as Wieters and D'Arnaud. Ya, you can't have all stars all over the diamond, but you can do so much better than what the marlins have put together this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Entendu Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 B-b-b-backtrack Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fish53 Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 The real problem is that there is no FIRE in this clubhouse. Right? Wasn't that the problem?Whose got a match? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fish14 Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Hech is the 9th best offensive SS in baseball. You can't ignore the position he plays. It's easier and cheaper to plug other holes in the team than at catcher and ss. The marlins did a good job in the offseason. They went from 2012 firesale/market correction/whatever to 2015 and people talking about possibly competing. Shit just didn't work out. Before the season people were excited. Actually, many people were only worried about the rotation holding up until Jose returned. Who could have accurately predicted what has gone on with yelich, ozuna, morse, cishek, and prado? If all of those players do what they've done in previous seasons, this team is significantly better. I don't blame the marlins FO for what's gone on with this team at all. I do blame them for hiring shit managers and firing them at will. That's messed up. All of your points are completely unrelated to mine. He may be the 9th best offensive SS in baseball going by whatever measure you are going by. That doesnt make him a good hitter. That is my only point. No shit its easier to find corner infielders or outfielders. My only point was that Hech is still not good offensively and Realmuto should not be guaranteed a spot next year as our starter or we can't expect our offense to be significantly better. Yes it would have been hard to predict those down years but when it happens for 13 straight years you can start to blame the front office i think. The manager thing has nothing major to do with us winning and losing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fish14 Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 On a side note does anywhere know where the visiting teams usually stay because I think the Dodgers are staying at the Four seasons next to my apartment on Brickell unless there was some sort of other event going on. Saw a bunch of UM and dodger hats waiting outside with a big coach bus waiting too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverBullet Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Hech is the 9th best offensive SS in baseball. You can't ignore the position he plays. It's easier and cheaper to plug other holes in the team than at catcher and ss. The marlins did a good job in the offseason. They went from 2012 firesale/market correction/whatever to 2015 and people talking about possibly competing. Shit just didn't work out. Before the season people were excited. Actually, many people were only worried about the rotation holding up until Jose returned. Who could have accurately predicted what has gone on with yelich, ozuna, morse, cishek, and prado? If all of those players do what they've done in previous seasons, this team is significantly better. I don't blame the marlins FO for what's gone on with this team at all. I do blame them for hiring shit managers and firing them at will. That's messed up. this post, I like it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dim Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 I just have to address the argument somebody made somewhere in this thread that there are plenty of catchers we can go after who can hit. The truth of the matter is there isn't. Out of catcher's with at least 150 AB's, there are only eight catchers with an OPS at or above .750. Finding an offensively productive catcher in today's landscape is incredibly incredibly hard. The problem is that Realmuto's bat is actually really bad in comparison to everybody who gets real playing time. Out of catcher's with 190 AB's or more, Realmuto is the third worst catcher is baseball outside of Mike Zunino and Rene Rivera. Realmuto improves in the rankings when defense is accounted for, as he has the 27th highest WAR among catchers in the majors. While I love JT and have advocated for him to get an opportunity, the team needs to get an established catcher in the offseason if they want to fix the lineup. The things that need to occur for the team to get better is finding a long term 1st baseman (Justin Bour is not a long term fix and Morse doesn't have it anymore), catcher (JT just isn't hitting enough to even be a league average catcher), and 3rd base (Prado's defense is excellent but his offense has slipped, and while Dietrich is a decent hitter, we need a real, established third baseman going into next season to compete). Outside of that with the lineup Yelich and Ozuna need to play like 2014 versions of themselves and not this year. The guys who are obviously fine to stay are Hechavarria, Gordon, Stanton, Ozuna, Yelich. Everywhere else needs changes. Hell long term I still think Hechavarria is a problem but given his defense if he can put up somewhere over .700 OPS' for the rest of career he won't be hurting the team. Biggest problem is that we have no prospects to put about in trades to get fixes at 1B/3B/C. The only chance to fix those spots will either be in free agency or using the pieces in the majors we have now and trade them at the deadline to get close to the majors prospects. I still don't believe this offense on paper is as bad as it's playing and is hurt tremendously by Ozuna/Yelich's regression from last year and Hechavarria/Gordon/Bour all falling back down to earth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rydawg Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 I never said he isn't a good SS. I said he isn't a good hitter. I think the best thing you can say about his hitting is he is a quality number 8 hitter, which isn't saying much. You guys are just so used to him being a .600 OPS guy but he is now a .700 OPS guy, not .800 as many of you would like to believe. The guy has a .726 OPS which was closer to .700 before the late HR last night, and while that is passable considering his defense, stop making him out to be some hugely improved hitter. Im willing to bet he will end the year under .700 OPS again. I like Hech and he is a good SS, all I'm saying is stop acting as if he is this great and incredibly improved hitter now. That is literally all I'm saying. If Hech isn't a good hitter then why is he hitting 3rd today? Huh? Riddle me that! LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fish14 Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 If Hech isn't a good hitter then why is he hitting 3rd today? Huh? Riddle me that! LOL Wait is he actually hitting 3rd today? Because that is absolutely ridiculous Edit- Just saw it. This is absurd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 He's coming down to earth, but it's not that absurd based on how much the rest of the lineup sucks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erick Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Hech hasn't been a problem this year. He's not a good hitter in the same sense that Dee's not a good hitter. They're likely to regress but it's gonna be alright especially with the defense they're playing. The problem with the offense continues to be the corner infield. + Yelich & Ozuna have become turds in a baseball uniform. I'd like to think those two are better than this which is why I worry more about the pitching long-term than I do the offense. At least the offense has some guys who have shown flashes of being core players. The pitching has Jose, an injured Alvarez who's been pitching injured and might need surgery one day, and a bunch of replaceable guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Speaking of line-ups, I wish Ichiro would get more starts in LF over Yelich against LHP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackRubysDog Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Absolutely Hech should hit third. Aren't you guys paying attention? He hit a home run last night, so based on that extensive sample size, he is obviously going to gain lots of hits tonight, because that's how baseball works. DJ/Hoff makes Mike Redmond look like Joe Torre. I am so glad I cannot watch tonight's game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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