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Brad Arnsberg who?

Ramp

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c/o sunsentinel.com
Wayne Rosenthal wasn't put in the easiest position May 11.

Six weeks into the season he took charge of a Marlins pitching staff with a spotty starting rotation that had lost 15 of 24 decisions. He possessed a good working knowledge of Tommy Phelps, Dontrelle Willis and Carl Pavano. Brad Penny and Mark Redman he barely knew.

The numbers say more about the transition than any one player could.

Before Rosenthal, the starters were 9-15 with a 4.12 ERA and 89 walks in 2131/3 innings. With Rosenthal: 20-12 with a 3.62 ERA and 33 fewer walks in 221/3 more innings.

"I think everybody takes to him fine," Phelps said. "He does his thing. They do their thing. Everybody's been throwing the ball really well, so that has to say something."

Added Pavano, who first worked with Rosenthal as a member of the Expos in 1998: "He knows what I need to work on when I get out of whack. He's my eyes. Sometimes you go through a point when you lose that feel a little bit. You need your pitching coach to be your eyes for you so you can get things going. He's helped me, and it looks like he's helping everybody else, too."

The stats may be somewhat skewed from Willis' emergence. Keep in mind Willis has been under Rosenthal's guidance since the Marlins acquired him during spring training 2002. Rosenthal was the organization's minor league pitching coordinator before ascending to his first major league job.

Making the rotation's recent run even more impressive is that Josh Beckett (sprained elbow ligament) has yet to throw a competitive pitch under Rosenthal's watch. In addition, Redman did not come off the disabled list until two weeks into his new pitching coach's tenure.

"The talent was there," Rosenthal said. "I'm not saying I'm the one who brought it out. Maybe the change itself is what brought it out. Maybe it's the nucleus of the team that's starting to click together. I just put my personality into what I do, and I haven't changed what I've done in the past. I'm comfortable. I hope the players are comfortable."

The numbers seem to indicate they are.
 

Ramp

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you gotta like what Wayne Rosenthal has done so far
 

butchy

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Rosenthal has done a GREAT job and has taken very little credit for it.
 

JPierre75sbs

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it sounds like he hasnt done much yet... maybe just a coincedence that since he came up it just started to work with the change to Mckeon and all and now the pitchers got their act together as well as the team. The team just played it out. Pavano is thankful since hes known him for quite a while, but phelps is like whatever.
 

butchy

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it sounds like he hasnt done much yet... maybe just a coincedence that since he came up it just started to work with the change to Mckeon and all and now the pitchers got their act together as well as the team. The team just played it out. Pavano is thankful since hes known him for quite a while, but phelps is like whatever.


While Mckeon has done a great job and has gotten a lot of kudos - but who do u think spends hours working and working with the pitchers - refining tools, fixing mechanics, messaging psyches.. Mckeon isnt out there sweating with the pitchers 6-8 hours before the game, Rosenthal is

Give credit where credit is do. Unlike Arnsberg, Rosenthal is humble and gives all the credit to his pitchers.
 

Marlins2003

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Absolutely Ramp.

If you believed the media after the firings, the Marlins FO were nothing more than agenda-based, vindictive devilworshippers who were hell-bent on destroying the morale and fabric of this team. Time has proven them wrong of course, as it almost always does.

Jack McKeon and Wayne Rosenthal are just what this team needed. Does anyone think we'd be one game under .500 right now with Torborg and Arnie? lol
 

JPierre75sbs

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pitching coaches dont spend as much time as you think with the pitchers. He might be there watching the guy throw and just say some minor things or he can go in depth, be be the guys friend whatever whatever.

Pitching coaches dont spend HOURS AND HOURS with the pitchers like you say. There is only a certain amount of times a guy can throw. If a guy is struggling bad then he has to go in depth, review video w/e but that is not the case with the fish.
Ever since he came he hasnt had to give much advice though. Most of our pitchers like penny and pavano (the only ones that really mess up from time to time) know what they did wrong when they pitch. They say it all the time after the game. No need for coaching there. Maybe a pat on the back but thats all.

The only one that needs fixing is Almanza, but hes always had control probs.

Rosenthal for now hasnt done much. He just peps the players up and pats them on the back. Nothing special. It just so happened that the fish got their act together when everything was shaken up with the torborg and arnie1941(jk dont hurt me arnie) firing
 

JPierre75sbs

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rosenthal hasnt done anything. He didnt "fix" or cause a miracle. The staff would perform like this under most pitching coaches. Its probably good that he steps back and watches more than he fixes though.

You can tell by the way phelps talked, that rosenthal wasnt the real difference. Pavano has known wayne since 98 so its different with him. I bet if you interview the other pitchers they will say the same thing as phelps
 

AJBurnett34

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Rothenthal has done a very good job. Arnie knows alot about pitching but he really didnt do much even though i really liked him alot. Our pitchers have been VERY good and we need to continue for us to be in the wild card...
 

Ramp

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so Rosenthal has nothing to do with the pitcher's recent success?

do you ever give any credit?
 

JPierre75sbs

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arnie didnt do much?? he may have done TOOO MUCH... he constantly tampered with pitchers and I really dont know what he did to be honest... He had good chemistry and could relate to the pitchers well, helped AJ and redman alot it seems although AJ blew up... I dont know much about anything else he has done and none of us do...

Truth is none of us know much about this rosenthal guy either, except that the pitchers are putting up good numbers with rosenthal and they sucked with arnsberg... thats all, dont give the guy any more credit he doesnt deserve because we are all uninformed about this.
 

butchy

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FYI, Just to show Rosenthals work ethic with his pitchers. Last week while I was at Roger dean Stadium in Jupiter (I live there and watch many minor league games), I saw Rosenthal working with Josh Beckett. This was at 10 am , a good 8 hours before game time and good 80 minutes away from Miami.


FYI, Tommy Phelps owes his career to Rosenthal as Rosey was the one to sigh him as a free agent after the Expos released him.

Give credit where credit is due
 

JPierre75sbs

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beckett is a different scenario, he is injured and hasnt pitched in a while and needs to work on his mechanics. Beckett hasnt contributed for the marlins since rosenthal came either so that is irrelevant.

Rosenthal doesnt sign players, beinfest does. Read the article again. Phelps speaks of rosenthal nonchalantly.
 

JPierre75sbs

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dont give me that FYI junk either ... i really hate that phrase. The snobby english majors here love to use it to b*tch, much like you just did
 

butchy

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Rosenthal doesnt sign players, beinfest does. Read the article again. Phelps speaks of rosenthal nonchalantly.
Once again u r wrong. Phelps was signed to a minor league contract by Jim Fleming (who was acting on Rosenthals recommendation )as the director of player development

beckett is a different scenario, he is injured and hasnt pitched in a while and needs to work on his mechanics. Beckett hasnt contributed for the marlins since rosenthal came either so that is irrelevant.
The good job that everyone says Rosenthal is doing covers many factors. Wont u be the first to blame Rosey if Beckett pitches poorly when he returns!!!!!

I"m sorry that u dont like FYI - try to get over it!!
 

CapeFish

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Rosenthal has done a masterpiece of turning around our pitching staff. Last year we gave up to many walks and homeruns, but I believe that this week we only gave up like 5 walks in 7 games. Good Job :w00t
 

JPierre75sbs

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still phelps signing has nothing to do with coaching SINCE HE CAME. Beckett hasnt pitched since he came to the marlins either.

I AM NOT BASHING HIM YOU FOOL. I AM JUST SAYING DO NOT GIVE HIM CREDIT THAT HE DOES NOT DESERVE.

right now the information we got that he deserves credit for IS :
signing phelps
pitching has a lower ERA but we do not know if it is because of him or the managerial shake up that the team was effected with, or just coincedence.. increase in confidence.. point is WHO KNOWS
thats it.

we cant give him a job well done, all we can say is keep up whatever you are doing. He hasnt had to do much though. Everything has been fine since day 1 that he came. and thats because of the whole shake up with the coaching staff.
 

JPierre75sbs

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Rosenthal has done a masterpiece of turning around our pitching staff. Last year we gave up to many walks and homeruns, but I believe that this week we only gave up like 5 walks in 7 games. Good Job :w00t
How do you know.

all we got to base anything on is the ERA of the staff. It could be luck it could be the full moon , who knows
 

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