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Fish Fillet

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What went wrong? :eek: nothing went wrong - it all went just as everyone hoped it wouldn't of. Mediocre offense with little power conbined with young, inexperienced and now worn out arms never amounts to anything in MLB, so why should the Marlins be different? :mischief2

I'm sick of hearing comparisons to other small market teams which are "successful". Depends on what you call success. the A's and Twins successful? Last time I checked they've won the same number of World Series as the Marlins in the last 5 years, ZILCH. :p

I'm sick of a befuddled ownership/management that seems to think that just ensuring the existence of a squad in SoFla is an accomplishment in and of itself. Frankly, I'd rather have no team than a pathetic doormat year in and year out, and I've got a feeling all 27 baseball fans left in Tampa would agree. :banghead

I, for one, am finally calling it quits on following the Marlins with anything more than a passing interest. After three long years of false hope (which is worse than the no hope years of 98 and 99) I have to end it and stop buying into the lie like a lemming, you should too. :unsure :
 

Das Texan

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fish....


does this mean this is your one and only post here?




I hope that would not be so...



Sit down and discuss something.....
 

Fish Fillet

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Apologies, needed to vent. Every year when the Fish fall on their faces I say to myself "Myself, no more following the fish. "

Then Spring Training opens 4 months later.

It's like watching a horrible movie at 3AM that you've already seen a thousand times. You don't know why you are doing it, but you swear that you'll damn sure never do it again.

Thne in a month or two your watching the same movie again. :banghead
 

Ramp

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so you join a Marlins board just to quit following the team?....lol


the Marlins pitching has been pretty darn good....do you watch the games?


you dont the Twins or A's are succesful?.... okay sure buddy


and Id rather have a crappy team than no team at all
 

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Welcome to the site, Fish Fillet. I hope you'll decide to stick around and post.

I know it's hard to stay with this team especially after what happened in 98 and then the promise of those prospects turning us into a dynasty only to now look out and see those guys possibly moving on as well.

It's frustrating and giving up on the fish is easier said than done.

I have said it before and I'll stay with my previous sentiments.

As long as the Marlins exist, I will be a fan.

It's hard to be a Marlins fan but that will just make it sweeter when we do win again.
 

Das Texan

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a crappy team or no team at all....



that actually could present an entertaining debate.




why are you a fan of a team?



to see them win?

or to see them constantly fall on their face?


do you follow a team just because you are content to have one to root for....


or because you want to see them win.



hmmmmm
 

Fish Fillet

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Ramp:

1st of all, yes I watch the games....


and yes, the pitching is respectable. Then again. the Tigers have had very good pitching, too. You watch their games?

I'm sick of taking a micro view at the team when searching for a positive or two. I mean, I'm really happy their head trainer won the Florida Trainer's award this week, but that doesn't exactly qualify, does it?

And no, I don't buy the previaling spin that the A's and Twins are successful. Not unless you consider success being "almost the champion".

And as for you rather having a crappy team then no team at all...It's apologists like you that allow managment to keep their sights on mediocrity. I suppose if you lived in Montreal you'd be one of the 2000 people that are real sad to see them go, too.
 

Ramp

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so the Yankees arent succesful in the past 2 years....

and the Braves are never succesful

and the Giants of last year had no success....


i dont understand....



and yes, I do watch the Tigers, and no, their pitching has been nowhere near as productive as our staff


this team has alot of positives but one glaring negative.....AVG W/RISP......
 

Foggy Doggy

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It's an interesting dichotomy being a Marlins fans these days.....

On one hand I want them to lose because I simply HATE the management and hopefully enough losing will make them sell the team (crossed fingers).

But then I also want them to win because they are my team.....after 33 years of following other teams, growing up mostly watching Braves games when cable came on....I finally had a childhood dream come true; MY TEAM...the Marlins.

But it has more of a nightmare than a dream....... :unsure :
 

Ramp

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losing will drive away what little fans we have left, therefore showing Selig that South Fla shouldnt have a team, therefore having Loria and Co, move somewhere else
 

Foggy Doggy

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losing will drive away what little fans we have left, therefore showing Selig that South Fla shouldnt have a team, therefore having Loria and Co, move somewhere else
Ramp.....now you're getting the picture. The intention is not to stay here in South Fla.

Loria has his agenda, and I think that is to get his team closer to his New York home base. Selig also has his agenda, to ruin baseball in South Fla.

Selig is an "Arizona" guy.......remember these tibits :

a) Selig owned the Brewers who have ALWAYS trained in Arizona

b) he owns two homes in Arizona

c) he has gone out of his way to help the Diamondbacks get their stadium and make loans to keep the franchise out of bankruptcy last year, yet has steadfastly refused to help the Marlins franchise out, in getting a new stadium for the team.

I truley believe Selig doesn't care about South Fla, or even Tampa Bay as baseball "territory". He knows the older folks that have retired here will still follow their old teams, and will travel to Spring Games to see them, and never become loyal to the "new" Florida franchises.

Doesn't anyone else see this ?
 

Fish Fillet

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The Marlins have almost the same ERA as the Tigers, but have given up more hits, walks and have a higher WHIP. That's better?


Look, all I'm saying is that although I'm an baseball addict, I can't reconcile the lies and false hopes that have been served up to me for the last 5 years. Do I like to follow several Marlins players? Of course. And I can't wait to see Castillo steal 15 bases this Sept. for the Cards or See Mike Lowell play in the World Series for the Gotham Evil Empire this year. The Marlins are a team with young and exiting players. And those young and exciting players will win at another franchise down the road.

There is not one single hope that this team will win anything with current ownership. And if ownership changes again it'll be to move it out of SoFla. So what exactly is the point of supporting the Marlins organization by paying for tickets, buying merchandise, adding to TV ratings, etc?
 

Ramp

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you see, thats where I disagree...


there has been little proof of Loria having an agenda....

why spend all this money on marketing?

why go out and get Pudge

why raise payroll $10mil

why make a push for Bartolo Colon?


if he has this agenda, why would Loria go out and do all this....

why not just, firesale in spring training? it would have ended the Marlins for good

*anyone on my team out there? :( ...I could use some help
 

Foggy Doggy

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The Marlins have almost the same ERA as the Tigers, but have given up more hits, walks and have a higher WHIP. That's better?


Look, all I'm saying is that although I'm an baseball addict, I can't reconcile the lies and false hopes that have been served up to me for the last 5 years. Do I like to follow several Marlins players? Of course. And I can't wait to see Castillo steal 15 bases this Sept. for the Cards or See Mike Lowell play in the World Series for the Gotham Evil Empire this year. The Marlins are a team with young and exiting players. And those young and exciting players will win at another franchise down the road.

There is not one single hope that this team will win anything with current ownership. And if ownership changes again it'll be to move it out of SoFla. So what exactly is the point of supporting the Marlins organization by paying for tickets, buying merchandise, adding to TV ratings, etc?
Fish Fillet I feel your pain.....it's a shame but it seesm that events are conspiring to doom baseball in South Fla.
 

jonnylons

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Foggy Doggy, I think you may be stitching things together that dont necessarily go together. This is very typical of anti-Loria people, that Loria wants to move this team. Let me start by saying I wish we had a billionaire owner, but we dont. We have to live with who Loria puts in charge and those decisions can be questionable (his stepson as president?) but that is who we have. Personally, I watch the team, not the front office.

To give you my opinion, I have a hard time with this evil-Loria picture people are constantly painting. First, why would he trade his Expos for the Marlins if he was intending to relocate a team? He could have stayed with the Expos and eventually moved them - they have no fan base and were targeted for contraction. The Expos are going to be moved from Montreal and seem to be easier to do than the Marlins.

Also, where in his NY area could Loria move the team? They have the Yankees and Mets, I doubt upstate NY would want or even need a team. I dont see a move being made there and the market is not nearly as good in potential as the S. Fl. market.

Perhaps Loria is evil, but I honestly dont see any reason why he would move the Marlins from S. Fl. The Expos are the next team on the go - and they will go because the other owners do not want to continue to pay for that team - especially when they are beating up on the other teams in the NL! If anything, the Marlins would be contracted and that does not seem to have any interest for Loria who could have achieved this, again, by staying with Montreal.

As for Selig, I dont think he hates FL - he may be limited in his vision of what the Florida market can do, but I dont think he hates it. After all, besides Arizona, Tampa was the other expansion team. I think what is really going on here is that Selig may have some animosity towards Huizenga and vice versa, because of what H-bomb did to the sport of baseball. He embarassed them.

I think the Marlins are here to stay. I think Loria and Co. are honestly trying to build a team that can compete and win - but they have to do so with one of the weakest revenues in all of baseball. This, of course, is the reason why a new stadium is desirable, because Huizenga is going to continue to screw the Marlins with his leases (mostly because Henry signed it in the first place) because the Marlins have no leverage at all. This is not a pretty situation, but something good will come of this I believe. I think so far, the Marlins are making the tough decisions that are necessary for this team to survive right now.
 

Fish Fillet

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Ramp...

You need to go to the nearest window, look outside and tell us all if you are on the same planet as everyone else is.

Raising payroll 10 mil doesn't mean much when it's only 40-50 mil. Still not enough to be competitive.

And it was Colon or Pudge. They would not of signed Pudge (Whose a bust so far, by the way) if Colon took the bait and came down.

Who would have a firesale in Spring when you can wait until your players build value and possible trading teams develop needs?

And the whopper of them all...."Loria without an agenda? I'll give you a big John McEnroe YOU CANNOT BE SERIOUS for that one. Remember how he aquired the marlins? Nothing seedy about that one. Oh, by the way, he gets a healthy check from MLB if the Marlins can't surive in SoFla. You remember that? Kind of a 3-5 year test drive until he rolls under the wheels of contraction or moves the team to a city that can provide him enough revenue.
 

Das Texan

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just FYI....



New York City itself could support another baseball team....



However, MLB restrictions will not allow that.
 

Ramp

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Raising payroll 10 mil doesn't mean much when it's only 40-50 mil. Still not enough to be competitive.
woah....

when your payroll is at $150mil, adding $10mil more doesnt do much


but


adding $10mil to a team that was only at $40mil is HUGE....... Do you understand that?


I know we were only getting Colon or Pudge but the fact that he didnt give up after the Colon deal fell through should tell you something...

He could have traded away everyone in ST..... Lowell's value was big, Castillo was coming off a huge year, AJ Burnett was coming off a brilliant year, even DLee posted some good numbers....

I dont see your reasoning...and yes, I am from Earth :blink:
 

Fish Fillet

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And by the way.... Please stop with mentioning a stadium. If your wondering why go ask someone from Detroit, Texas, Milwaukee or Baltimore why a new stadium isn't the answer.

Loria isn't blind. He, like everyone else in MLB, sees the long-term performance of cities that get new stadiums... And more often than not it doesn't turn out to be the boon everyone thought it would be.

Even if a brand new, state of the art, baseball only facility was built on the shiny shores on Biscayne attendence would still drop after a yar or two as the novelty wore off. Again, see Detroit, Arlington, Milwaukee, etc.

The only way a new facility helps Loria is if it's in a market with high demand (see Washington, New York State, Carolinas, etc). I just hope he turns the lights out before he leaves.
 

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