What's new

Open letter for those who are critical of Marlins fans

fanfish

Muckdog
Joined
May 4, 2005
Messages
635
Reaction score
0
So you criticize South Florida fans. You wonder why, even after winning two World Series in their first ten years of existence, there is still poor attendance at Marlins games. You even wonder if we deserve to have a baseball team even though we don?t support it. Right?

You want reasons? Well, here is the long version.

In the beginning, in 1993, everything was good. Baseball came to South Florida. We had a new baseball team playing in its owner?s football stadium, Joe Robbie Stadium (now Dolphin Stadium). There were great crowds. No problem.

Then the search began. The search for the baseball-only NEW MARLINS STADIUM (NMS)!

Mr. Owner said that he would build his own stadium in ?Wayne?s World.? Remember? Blockbuster Park was to be built on the Dade-Broward county line, and the NMS was going to be a part of it. Well, Wayne sold Blockbuster and that was the end of that.

Wayne wanted to see, ?if I spend it, will they come?? Big bucks were spent and the 1997 World Series was ours. We celebrated for ONE WHOLE DAY! The axe came down before the confetti hit the ground. The boss thought he spent more than they came. Knowing that public money was not going to be handed to a multi-millionaire to build a stadium, he broke up the team so that he could sell it.

Kevin Brown, Al Leiter, Livan Hernandez, Gary Sheffield, Charles Johnson, Rob Nen, Edgar Renteria, Bobby Bonilla, Greg Counsell, Devon White, and Jeff Conine among others were gone. Read this list again, SLOWLY, so you can BEGIN to feel our pain.

Attendance plummeted. It was 1998.

A very bad season followed. The Marlins went from champs to chumps. They went 54-108. Dead last in the division, finishing 52 games behind the Braves!

For a while, there were no serious takers. Then along came John Henry. Our savior? He even had a white (kind of weird) cowboy hat. We were told of the horrible lease he had at the then Pro Player Stadium (previously known as Joe Robbie Stadium) and that he had to have a NMS. We were told not to worry because if push came to shove, he would build the stadium himself.

They pushed and later shoved. He asked for help anyway. Locations were debated and chosen (by the Miami River). We needed cash. First, Governor Bush said no to a tax on Mickey Arison?s boats, Carnival Cruise Lines, and then the Legislature said, ?No,? to a sales tax rebate of 60 million dollars over 30 years. Strike one.

A few months later, the City of Miami and Miami-Dade County said they had solved the funding problem and agreed on a deal for the NMS, but nobody could find Henry. Where is Henry? Hennnnnnnry! Hennnnnnnnry!

It turns out that our friend Henry got fed up with the whole thing a few months before the solution was found, and he had been talking to his bud, Bud. Bud in turn had been talking to his bud, Loria. The switcharoo was on. And Bud said, ?Henry, you take the Red Sox and give the Marlins to Loria. Loria, you take the Fish and give us the Expos. We?ll move the Expos and sell them later to somebody in D.C.?

In the mean time we had to endure contraction talk. Remember that? We were on the short list of teams that would go ?poof? in the night and disappear.

Attendance plummeted. It was 2002.

In comes Loria. The town, by this time, was very skeptical, to say the least. The media was trying to figure out not ?if,? but ?how? and ?when? Loria would stick it to the fans and South Florida.

A bad season was followed by a World Series season in 2003 that came out of the blue. There was talk of a NMS again. Back to the Legislature in 2004. But???..Strike two.

In early 2005 a site was picked again. The NMS was going to be next to the Orange Bowl. After many months, deadlines, and meetings, the city, county, and team agreed on a plan. Back to the Legislature. Strrrrrrrrrrike Threeeeeeeeee.

Then we heard:
1. The city and county wanted the team to stay but couldn?t give any more money.
2. The team wanted to stay but couldn?t give any more money, wouldn?t give up the retractable roof demands on the NMS and decided to explore their options.
3. Las Vegas vultures were sighted.
4. Then Loria yelled, ?Fire! Fire! Fire!? The 2005 sale was on! Josh Beckett, Mike Lowell, Carlos Delgado, Paul LoDuca, Juan Pierre, Luis Castillo, Alex Gonzalez , Juan Encarnacion, AJ Burnett, Jeff Conine, and Todd Jones among others were gone. Carl Pavano, Pudge Rodriguez and Derrick Lee had gone the year before. Read this list again, slowly, to REALLY feel our pain. Are you getting the idea?


Attendance plummeted. It was 2005.

Then the team asked and got permission from MLB to look around and see where they could move. They packed their lunches and went on a road trip to Las Vegas, Portland and San Antonio. They talked to Virginia, Charlotte and others. Talks became ?very serious? with San Antonio to the point that the owner, Mr. Loria, asked a San Antonio group, Mr. Wolff and his pack, to sit with him at the 2006 opening-day game in Houston. Marlins fans were expected to take it in stride and support ?our? team while on TV we watched ?our? owner cuddling up with the San Antonio dudes. Needless to say, that didn?t help attendance either.

Surprisingly we had a decent year in 2006 with Miguel Cabrera, Dontrelle Willis and a bunch of rookies. But by now, the general population had had enough of fire sales #1 and #2. They had had enough of contraction talk and relocation talk.

Oh, and did I tell you there is a threat of rain practically every night in South Florida during the summer? So, we are expected to disregard everything that has gone on and take a chance of sitting through rain delays and getting soaked! Oh, and did I tell you that you can fry steaks (not just eggs) on anybody?s head on day games at the stadium (even while wearing a hat!!!!)? Coupled with 99.9% humidity, it is a delight witnessing a bunch of rookies play day games on Sundays while we slowly dehydrate and burn under the mid-day tropical sun.

In 2006 we began to hear of a plan to build the NMS with a retractable roof in Hialeah, a mostly blue-collar city just northwest of Miami. Mr. Robaina, the mayor of Hialeah, spearheaded the effort, but many obstacles remained. In order for the stadium to be built in the chosen Hialeah site, the Urban Development Boundary had to be moved. This ?boundary? is an arbitrary line drawn on the map to prevent construction too close to the Everglades. Environmentalist-tree-huggers popped out of the woodwork! They didn?t want to give an inch even if the stadium were to be built east of the Florida Turnpike. (The Everglades are to the west of the Turnpike) You really can?t see the alligators from there. Believe me! Well, after several months and more than a few colorful meetings and discussions, the boundary was moved. Mr. Robaina was to meet with the MLB brass in New York, but for different reasons the meeting was canceled several times. It turns out that MLB wanted the NMS in downtown Miami but the Marlins big shots were not on speaking terms with the City of Miami dudes. After the Orange Bowl site plan fell through in 2005, the city manager had a very public falling-out with the Marlins? president; there has been bad blood between the city and the team ever since, even though there is now a new manager for the City of Miami.

Enter downtown Miami. Two areas were originally identified as potential sites for the NMS. The first, just south of the now abandoned Miami Arena, and the second, just north of the Government Center.

In order to help with the finances, the Mayor of Miami, Mr. Diaz, floated the idea of tapping into the coffers of the Community Redevelopment Agency (CRA) which handles the funds that are intended to aid residents and businesses located in blighted areas of the city. Well, wouldn?t you know it, the proposed sites are close but not within the boundaries encompassed by that agency. Can?t you just see trouble brewing over that?

But wait. Hooooold your horses. The Orange Bowl site came back to life! It seems that several Miami-Dade County commissioners were not as happy with the downtown sites after all. You see, there were plans for some sort of juvenile court to be built right where second base was supposed to go. So the plans for a downtown NMS might not even get to first base after all. At about the same time, it became known that the Hurricanes (of the University of Miami fame) were thinking of moving their home football games from the Orange Bowl to Dolphin Stadium (previously known as Pro Player Stadium, that was previously known as Joe Robbie Stadium) A new idea surfaced: If the Hurricanes move out of the Orange Bowl, the old stadium could be demolished (if it doesn?t collapse by itself first) and the NMS could be built on that site at a lower cost and much more comfortably rather than trying to ?shoehorn? it at the much smaller downtown site. That scenario would also save the City of Miami a bunch of millions it had intended on spending to remodel the Toilet Bowl, excuse me, I mean the Orange Bowl. Well, everything was placed on hold while UM decides where they will play.

Without a definite site being chosen, the city, the county, the team and MLB agreed on a financial plan for the NMS that left a short fall of 30 million dollars. Sound familiar yet? So what?s the next step? You guessed it! Back to Tallahassee, of course! Reportedly, there is a better chance of passage this time since there are more Marlins friendly state legislators in powerful positions. We?ll see.

Meanwhile, we fans wonder and wait for the next piece of news. Personally I?m tired. They?ve been talking, discussing and meeting about the NMS for about ten years and still nothing. I consider myself a huge Marlins fan, and personally, I?m very tired.

I wonder for how much longer we will be asked to emotionally back a team if we don?t know if they will be staying? How much longer will we be asked to accept losing our established and familiar players year after year?
I wonder also how many fans would go to see the Yanks, Cubs, Cardinals or Red Sox if they had to endure everything we have tolerated and still tolerate.

And still Marlins fans get criticized for their ?lack of support.? GIVE ME A BREAK!
 

louiecastillo1

Muckdog
Joined
Aug 2, 2005
Messages
4,780
Reaction score
0
Isn't lack of fan support the reason why we're going through the stadium issues in the
first place? Crater face sold the team because of the not so good crowds and
supposedly losing thirty million a year. I think the douche bags in tallahassee
have been reluctant to give us money not only because they'd be giving
millions to billionaires, but because they see a lack of interest by the
fans themself with the 40,000+ empty seats they see on t.v. all the
time.

I don't think the fans here are bad just because of the marlins situation, no.
You look at teams like the dolphins and heat and the crowds aren't so great
either when they aren't doing so good. During the heat's lean years in the
early 2000's you could almost hear a pin drop inside the AAA. This is
supposed to be a football town right? I can remember twice dolphins
playoff games were blacked out locally because the games didn't
sellout on time. Only here would something like that happen.
face it, most of the fans here with the exception of a few like
us here on this board are bandwagon fans. Oh, and another
excuse you left out is because almost everyone that lives
here is from somewhere else and roots for their home
team.
 

rferry

Muckdog
Joined
Aug 17, 2003
Messages
13,158
Reaction score
0
There's those reasons and many more, but none will fully absolve fans their share of holding the Marlins back. Which is lost on some fans, who are caught up all in the woe is me, to note that they can do anything to fix the situation aside from blaming everyone but themselves. The problems the Marlins face will not be fixed by blaming any one, fan, owner or city officials. It will be convincing those people, and businesses and state officials, that the Marlins are a worthy investment.
 

BroncoBob27

Muckdog
Joined
Jun 22, 2004
Messages
5,853
Reaction score
0
I stopped reading this excuse after you failed to mention how we were still near or dead last in attendance from '03 to the present time while we had winning seasons and/or competitive teams. But on a positive note I did get past how you failed to mention attendance steadily dropped from about '94 until '97, and only when it was apparent we were going to the playoffs in '97 did attendance perk up. I almost puked...but I got past it. It got to be another prime example of "It's not my fault. It's the traffic flow", type of attitude.
Under 15K a game last year. 5K in season ticket packages. ROY winner on the team with many ROY candidates beside him, many MLB and Marlins records broken, in the WC race right up until the final week, after a World Championship and then 2 more winning seasons. That is humiliating no matter how many excuses you can come up with. Might as well put on a red and blue hat and start blaming farm animals.
In other words... Stop making excuses of why you don't go to the games and start dreaming up excuses of why you want to go to the games. It's all in the attitude.
Read that last paragraph again. SLOWLY So you can begin to understand.
 

fanfish

Muckdog
Joined
May 4, 2005
Messages
635
Reaction score
0
I stopped reading this excuse after you failed to mention how we were still near or dead last in attendance from '03 to the present time while we had winning seasons and/or competitive teams. But on a positive note I did get past how you failed to mention attendance steadily dropped from about '94 until '97, and only when it was apparent we were going to the playoffs in '97 did attendance perk up. I almost puked...but I got past it. It got to be another prime example of "It's not my fault. It's the traffic flow", type of attitude.
Under 15K a game last year. 5K in season ticket packages. ROY winner on the team with many ROY candidates beside him, many MLB and Marlins records broken, in the WC race right up until the final week, after a World Championship and then 2 more winning seasons. That is humiliating no matter how many excuses you can come up with. Might as well put on a red and blue hat and start blaming farm animals.
In other words... Stop making excuses of why you don't go to the games and start dreaming up excuses of why you want to go to the games. It's all in the attitude.
Read that last paragraph again. SLOWLY So you can begin to understand.
1. I am a season ticket holder.
2. These are not MY excuses. I go to a ton of games every year.
3. You may call them "excuses", but many fans call them reasons.
4. I remember all of your excuses not to go to games when and if the Marlins move to Miami.
5. It seems you got up on the wrong side of the bed this morning. So aggressive, so early. Take a pill, settle down or you may indeed puke all over yourself.
 

Eddie Altamonte

Muckdog
Joined
Dec 31, 2005
Messages
5,231
Reaction score
0
Great synapsis but I have to say it understates the local political environment which has been a significant barrier. Also the ineptitude of the present FO in the negotiation of the NMS endeavors. We are presently closer than any other time in finally making a reality the staduim. There is still a pessimistic feeling that permeates even amongst the most die hard fans let alone the casual fans. Would a staduim make a difference? Absolutely! Revenue-wise, ambiance-wise and community-wise as well..."If you build it they will come...For it's money they have and peace they want"...or whatever it says in the movie
 

anotherrealfan

Muckdog
Joined
Dec 5, 2005
Messages
1,448
Reaction score
0
I stopped reading this excuse after you failed to mention how we were still near or dead last in attendance from '03 to the present time while we had winning seasons and/or competitive teams. But on a positive note I did get past how you failed to mention attendance steadily dropped from about '94 until '97, and only when it was apparent we were going to the playoffs in '97 did attendance perk up. I almost puked...but I got past it. It got to be another prime example of "It's not my fault. It's the traffic flow", type of attitude.
Under 15K a game last year. 5K in season ticket packages. ROY winner on the team with many ROY candidates beside him, many MLB and Marlins records broken, in the WC race right up until the final week, after a World Championship and then 2 more winning seasons. That is humiliating no matter how many excuses you can come up with. Might as well put on a red and blue hat and start blaming farm animals.
In other words... Stop making excuses of why you don't go to the games and start dreaming up excuses of why you want to go to the games. It's all in the attitude.
Read that last paragraph again. SLOWLY So you can begin to understand.
Bob, we agree on many things and on some we do not. This is one area I always get a defensive of as it relates to the first fire sale and that is Marlin fans did not support that team. Sure, it wasn't Red Sox, Cub like 38000 every game but the average attendance was close to 29,000. There was a solid base to build on that had accepted baseball and got used to going to the games as part of their routine entertainment. The issue I always have a problem with is the cheap shots others take at S. Florida when they say "heck they didnt support the team in 97 before the excuse of fire sales". Fact is this area, as diverse and unsupportive as it is because of all the "residents" who wear other team hats all around town, supported this team BETTER than the recent White Sox championship. Supported this team better than attendance in Philly before their new stadium, supported this team as well as or equal to Atlanta (which by the way, is as bad a sports town as S. Florida except for the Braves and I know you remember the pre 1991 crowds of 1500-2000-I used to fly to Atlanta to watch baseball, there were more bugs than fans in the stands at the old stadium). Our fan support was fine, AND I CLEARLY BELIEVE along with many others that this area was poised to really jack up in 1998. Remember this place was Marlin crazy. Forget the boat parade after 2003, we had 70,000 people at the Stadium in 97 for a pep rally after winning the series. While this area was so happy with the 03 title, there was so much skepticism about the future. This skepticism did not exist in 97, only positivism (I think that is a word, but you get the idea)

Now, you can believe this or not, but one of the Marlin Execs from 97 who went to Atlanta shortly after told a business associate of mine and his in Atlanta that Wayne is a very smart man who took bad advice in 97. Remember, the players begged Wayne to keep the team together and they would extend contract payments etc. It was all there for the taking.

None of this excuses the 04 and 05 attendance, the team deserves better. You and I go and went in 98 watching that minor league team. But even with Loria extending himself (albeit with contracts he never intended on fulfilling), it never felt right. Samson even admitted at the ticket holder event after 05 that even if attendance was 38,000 a game, there would still have been a fire sale-so fans have a right to be cynical. There is blame and reason and excuses all around-but my initial point, the sharp criticism of fans here about 97 and would have been and should have been is unwarranted. Oh, don't forget cleveland before the Jake, San Francisco before the new stadium, these were the dregs of MLB attendance. Even Cleveland two years ago, with a wild card team right up till the last weekend, barely outdrew us-yet there was no criticism of attendance-yet they had nothing like the crap we have going on here with politicians and ownership and a pervert team president.

See you at the games.
 

cliffsgirl30

Muckdog
Joined
May 24, 2006
Messages
65
Reaction score
0
I stopped reading this excuse after you failed to mention how we were still near or dead last in attendance from '03 to the present time while we had winning seasons and/or competitive teams. But on a positive note I did get past how you failed to mention attendance steadily dropped from about '94 until '97, and only when it was apparent we were going to the playoffs in '97 did attendance perk up. I almost puked...but I got past it. It got to be another prime example of "It's not my fault. It's the traffic flow", type of attitude.
Under 15K a game last year. 5K in season ticket packages. ROY winner on the team with many ROY candidates beside him, many MLB and Marlins records broken, in the WC race right up until the final week, after a World Championship and then 2 more winning seasons. That is humiliating no matter how many excuses you can come up with. Might as well put on a red and blue hat and start blaming farm animals.
In other words... Stop making excuses of why you don't go to the games and start dreaming up excuses of why you want to go to the games. It's all in the attitude.
Read that last paragraph again. SLOWLY So you can begin to understand.


I agree...the excuses are reeeediculous...but it isn't just Marlins "fans", it happens in all the other sports here too...its just the South Floridia culture in general I guess and it's SO sad
 

BroncoBob27

Muckdog
Joined
Jun 22, 2004
Messages
5,853
Reaction score
0
I stopped reading this excuse after you failed to mention how we were still near or dead last in attendance from '03 to the present time while we had winning seasons and/or competitive teams. But on a positive note I did get past how you failed to mention attendance steadily dropped from about '94 until '97, and only when it was apparent we were going to the playoffs in '97 did attendance perk up. I almost puked...but I got past it. It got to be another prime example of "It's not my fault. It's the traffic flow", type of attitude.
Under 15K a game last year. 5K in season ticket packages. ROY winner on the team with many ROY candidates beside him, many MLB and Marlins records broken, in the WC race right up until the final week, after a World Championship and then 2 more winning seasons. That is humiliating no matter how many excuses you can come up with. Might as well put on a red and blue hat and start blaming farm animals.
In other words... Stop making excuses of why you don't go to the games and start dreaming up excuses of why you want to go to the games. It's all in the attitude.
Read that last paragraph again. SLOWLY So you can begin to understand.
1. I am a season ticket holder.
2. These are not MY excuses. I go to a ton of games every year.
3. You may call them "excuses", but many fans call them reasons.
4. I remember all of your excuses not to go to games when and if the Marlins move to Miami.
5. It seems you got up on the wrong side of the bed this morning. So aggressive, so early. Take a pill, settle down or you may indeed puke all over yourself.


Good to see you are a seson ticket holder, but blaming ownerships for poor attendance are excuses. If they are for you or someone else is irrelevant. And pretty poor since it is all one sided. meaning they can't be explained when the team is winning and attendance is still near or at the bottom of the list. Plain and simple. And it seems as if you don't remember my "excuses" as well as you put it out. I said I would keep my season tix for at least the first year to see how it goes but would probably have to downgrade to a week end package by the second year. And it hurts me to no end to have to do that. Work has a way of interfering with my personal life.
Someone else hit it a little better. It's the fan base here. Not any other reason. And using the Dolphins as an example was perfect. Because I also remember a play off game blacked out, a Monday night game blacked out, and I lost count on how many other games would have been blacked out if not for the media buying up the remaining tix just so they could telecast the games. About 4 million people in the tri county area and we can't get 15K average in that place is...well...inexcuseable.
Point has been made and backed up. If you are looking for excuses of why attendance is so low all the time just tell people to stop looking outward and instead look into a mirror. Because the "It's not my fault" method just isn't right. In any way.
 

BroncoBob27

Muckdog
Joined
Jun 22, 2004
Messages
5,853
Reaction score
0
I stopped reading this excuse after you failed to mention how we were still near or dead last in attendance from '03 to the present time while we had winning seasons and/or competitive teams. But on a positive note I did get past how you failed to mention attendance steadily dropped from about '94 until '97, and only when it was apparent we were going to the playoffs in '97 did attendance perk up. I almost puked...but I got past it. It got to be another prime example of "It's not my fault. It's the traffic flow", type of attitude.
Under 15K a game last year. 5K in season ticket packages. ROY winner on the team with many ROY candidates beside him, many MLB and Marlins records broken, in the WC race right up until the final week, after a World Championship and then 2 more winning seasons. That is humiliating no matter how many excuses you can come up with. Might as well put on a red and blue hat and start blaming farm animals.
In other words... Stop making excuses of why you don't go to the games and start dreaming up excuses of why you want to go to the games. It's all in the attitude.
Read that last paragraph again. SLOWLY So you can begin to understand.
Bob, we agree on many things and on some we do not. This is one area I always get a defensive of as it relates to the first fire sale and that is Marlin fans did not support that team. Sure, it wasn't Red Sox, Cub like 38000 every game but the average attendance was close to 29,000. There was a solid base to build on that had accepted baseball and got used to going to the games as part of their routine entertainment. The issue I always have a problem with is the cheap shots others take at S. Florida when they say "heck they didnt support the team in 97 before the excuse of fire sales". Fact is this area, as diverse and unsupportive as it is because of all the "residents" who wear other team hats all around town, supported this team BETTER than the recent White Sox championship. Supported this team better than attendance in Philly before their new stadium, supported this team as well as or equal to Atlanta (which by the way, is as bad a sports town as S. Florida except for the Braves and I know you remember the pre 1991 crowds of 1500-2000-I used to fly to Atlanta to watch baseball, there were more bugs than fans in the stands at the old stadium). Our fan support was fine, AND I CLEARLY BELIEVE along with many others that this area was poised to really jack up in 1998. Remember this place was Marlin crazy. Forget the boat parade after 2003, we had 70,000 people at the Stadium in 97 for a pep rally after winning the series. While this area was so happy with the 03 title, there was so much skepticism about the future. This skepticism did not exist in 97, only positivism (I think that is a word, but you get the idea)

Now, you can believe this or not, but one of the Marlin Execs from 97 who went to Atlanta shortly after told a business associate of mine and his in Atlanta that Wayne is a very smart man who took bad advice in 97. Remember, the players begged Wayne to keep the team together and they would extend contract payments etc. It was all there for the taking.

None of this excuses the 04 and 05 attendance, the team deserves better. You and I go and went in 98 watching that minor league team. But even with Loria extending himself (albeit with contracts he never intended on fulfilling), it never felt right. Samson even admitted at the ticket holder event after 05 that even if attendance was 38,000 a game, there would still have been a fire sale-so fans have a right to be cynical. There is blame and reason and excuses all around-but my initial point, the sharp criticism of fans here about 97 and would have been and should have been is unwarranted. Oh, don't forget cleveland before the Jake, San Francisco before the new stadium, these were the dregs of MLB attendance. Even Cleveland two years ago, with a wild card team right up till the last weekend, barely outdrew us-yet there was no criticism of attendance-yet they had nothing like the crap we have going on here with politicians and ownership and a pervert team president.

See you at the games.

Okay. We are just going to have to disagree on this. This is also a touchy topic with me. The excuses just get to me after all these years. I wouldn't mind sitting down at a game with ya and furthering this discussion. Heck, I'll buy the first round.
 

fanfish

Muckdog
Joined
May 4, 2005
Messages
635
Reaction score
0
BroncoBob,

I believe that poor attendance at Marlins games has a great deal to do with the two fire sales and with the uncertainty about the team remaining in South Florida.

We will never know how this area would have responded if the 1997 season would have been the beginning of a winning tradition. The failure to build a baseball only stadium in the area may not guarantee wins, but it would certainly calm the fears of losing the Marlins. A winning team, coupled with the feeling of permanence of the team, would have allowed a true fan base to develop much more readily, thus improving attendance. I think most would agree with this.

My intention was not to offer excuses. I simply wanted to explain what we have had to endure to the constant critics of the Marlins' attendance. Most out of town critics are not familiar with the details of our problems. I wanted to remind them of the players that we've lost, the contraction talk, the relocation experience, and the new stadium nightmare we have had to endure for ten years. These were real events. Call them excuses, consequences, reasons....call them what you want, but we Marlins fans have had to put up with them nevertheless.

Someday, hopefully soon, we may be able to put all this behind us.
 

BullDurham

Muckdog
Joined
Oct 30, 2003
Messages
1,501
Reaction score
0
The difference between media criticism of the Marlins and the Pirates: the media rightly criticizes the Pirates' ownership (well, everyone except Pirates' Pravda, the Pittsburgh Tribune-Review).
 

rferry

Muckdog
Joined
Aug 17, 2003
Messages
13,158
Reaction score
0
The Pirates' owners have been found using revenue sharing checks to pay debt service on their stadium. The Marlins' owners have been accused of everything and found guilty of nothing. Thus the contempt towards the Marlins' owners.
 

BroncoBob27

Muckdog
Joined
Jun 22, 2004
Messages
5,853
Reaction score
0
BroncoBob,

I believe that poor attendance at Marlins games has a great deal to do with the two fire sales and with the uncertainty about the team remaining in South Florida.

We will never know how this area would have responded if the 1997 season would have been the beginning of a winning tradition. The failure to build a baseball only stadium in the area may not guarantee wins, but it would certainly calm the fears of losing the Marlins. A winning team, coupled with the feeling of permanence of the team, would have allowed a true fan base to develop much more readily, thus improving attendance. I think most would agree with this.

My intention was not to offer excuses. I simply wanted to explain what we have had to endure to the constant critics of the Marlins' attendance. Most out of town critics are not familiar with the details of our problems. I wanted to remind them of the players that we've lost, the contraction talk, the relocation experience, and the new stadium nightmare we have had to endure for ten years. These were real events. Call them excuses, consequences, reasons....call them what you want, but we Marlins fans have had to put up with them nevertheless.

Someday, hopefully soon, we may be able to put all this behind us.

Neither one of us is going to change the other one's opinion on this. So be it. We ought to just change this thread into every excuse there is for not going to the games so we can get past the "It's not my fault" phase.
Meanwhile I'll just wait on that delivery truck to pull up in front of my house.
 
Joined
Dec 23, 2003
Messages
5,868
Reaction score
18
What I find funny is that the majority of people who call these reasons 'excuses' or say 'south florida fans suck' are out of staters. Truth is attendance in 03 was up from 02, and in 04 it was up from 03, and 05 was up from 04. So, yes after the first fire sale, the base was slowly, even without a new stadium and even after losing pudge and trading lee, was returning. Then firesale 06 happens and we need to start over.
 

Top Bottom