MVPosey Posted September 13, 2004 Share Posted September 13, 2004 Yes, he has a bad record, but he's far ahead in almost every other pitching stat. BAA, ERA, WHIP, strikeouts. That makes up for his 13-13 record. Here are my Cy Young rankings, using a point system that takes into account ranking in strikeouts, ERA, and winning percentage 1. Johnson 20 2. Schmidt 18 3. Clemens 17.5 4. Sheets 17 5. Pavano 15 6. Perez 13 7. Zambrano 12 8. Marquis 9 9. Carpenter 7 10. Milton 7 AL rankings: 1. Santana 27 2. Martinez 24 3. Schilling 23 4. Hudson 13 5. Mulder 12 6. Westbrook 10 7. Garcia 9 8. Escobar 8 9. Buehrle 6 10. Drese 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Accord Posted September 13, 2004 Share Posted September 13, 2004 If The Unit played for ANY other team, he would have had a 20+ win season this year. Besides all his other awesome states, you can't ignore the fact that he pitched a perfect game and that alone is enough to warrant a Cy Young. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heckeroo Posted September 13, 2004 Share Posted September 13, 2004 totally agree Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Juanky Posted September 13, 2004 Share Posted September 13, 2004 Benitez not in the top ten? Well, you included winning percentage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MVPosey Posted September 15, 2004 Author Share Posted September 15, 2004 the Rocket has pulled ahead 1. Clemens 21 2. Johnson 20 3. Schmidt 17 4. Sheets 17 5. Pavano 15 6. Perez 13 7. Zambrano 12 8. Marquis 9 9. Carpenter 7 10. Milton 7 AL: 1. Santana 28 2. Schilling 25 3. Martinez 22 4. Hudson 12 5. Mulder 12 6. Escobar 10 7. Westbrook 9.3 8. Garcia 7 9. Radke 6.5 10. Rogers 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CardsJimEdmonds15 Posted September 15, 2004 Share Posted September 15, 2004 Due to him beating the Cardinals right? He was dealing yet again vs us! Gosh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cobaincola Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 K's??? Who the fvck cares? An out is an out. Johnson doesn't deserve the Cy Young, remember Brown in 96, how about Pedro the last two seasons? If they didn't get the Cy Young because there were people with better records no way in hell Johnson deserves it this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MVPosey Posted September 16, 2004 Author Share Posted September 16, 2004 K's??? Who the fvck cares? An out is an out. Johnson doesn't deserve the Cy Young, remember Brown in 96, how about Pedro the last two seasons? If they didn't get the Cy Young because there were people with better records no way in hell Johnson deserves it this year. 560471[/snapback] Ks> winning percentage Ks> ERA neither one of them dominated the rest of the stats like Johnson. However, his record is the sole reason why he dropped to #2. In the end, it will be between Schmidt and Clemens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugg Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 K > ERA!!!! :lol WOW! Billy Koch has 50 K in 49 IP and a 4.41 ERA. Danny Kolb has 20 K in 53.2 IP and a 2.35 ERA. Koch > Kolb! YAY! Greg Maddux sucks too right? Of course who wouldn't want a guy 200 K and a 6 ERA over a guy with 85 and 2.5 ERA. [/hypothetical] Awesome Cy Young rankings though. I love how Roy Oswalt isn't in the top 10. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mabdul Doobakus Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 No way you deserve a Cy Young with a 13-13 record. I don't care your ERA is 0.29. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitesoxfan Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 AL rankings: 1. Santana 27 2. Martinez 24 3. Schilling 23 4. Hudson 13 5. Mulder 12 6. Westbrook 10 7. Garcia 9 8. Escobar 8 9. Buehrle 6 10. Drese 5 556862[/snapback] Very good list. I completely agree with #7 and #9. :thumbup Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MVPosey Posted September 16, 2004 Author Share Posted September 16, 2004 K > ERA!!!! :lol WOW! Billy Koch has 50 K in 49 IP and a 4.41 ERA. Danny Kolb has 20 K in 53.2 IP and a 2.35 ERA. Koch > Kolb! YAY! Greg Maddux sucks too right? Of course who wouldn't want a guy 200 K and a 6 ERA over a guy with 85 and 2.5 ERA. [/hypothetical] 560577[/snapback] Except Koch has 36 walks. Kolb has 11 walks. Koch K/ BB: 1.39 Kolb K/ BB: 1.82 K/ BB ratio is the only way to judge a player. It balances out velocity, control, and movement. Getting a guy to ground out or popup requires no skill. ERA is team reliant and ballpark reliant. Strikeouts and walks are on their own. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Accord Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 I'm watching the D-Backs vs. Rockies game right now and Randy Johnson just tied and then passed Steve Carlton for 3rd place on the all time strikeout list. Next up is the Rocket, then Nolan Ryan but he's too far out of reach. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Das Texan II Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 If The Unit played for ANY other team, he would have had a 20+ win season this year. Besides all his other awesome states, you can't ignore the fact that he pitched a perfect game and that alone is enough to warrant a Cy Young. 556880[/snapback] do browning should of won cy young the year he pitched his perfect game in i think 90? that is idiotic reasoning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Das Texan II Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 roger clemens will win the cy young period. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SorianoFanHFW Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 how about zambrano? wins are extremely overrated. ideally, randy should win it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Accord Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 If The Unit played for ANY other team, he would have had a 20+ win season this year. Besides all his other awesome states, you can't ignore the fact that he pitched a perfect game and that alone is enough to warrant a Cy Young. 556880[/snapback] do browning should of won cy young the year he pitched his perfect game in i think 90? that is idiotic reasoning. 561103[/snapback] You couldn't be anymore wrong. Tom Browning was the runner up for the Cy Young and would have won it had it not been for Orel Hershiser and his 23 win season on top of a 2.2x ERA and far better stats in every other category. Unlike Tom Browning, Randy Johnson leads in virtually every single category except for wins, and the sports writers know damn well that the Unit would have had a 20+ win season if he was playing on ANY other team. His perfect game cemented his status as the Cy Young this year not to mention his stellar stats in every facet of pitching. Wins are deceiving, countless times this season the Unit has given up just a single run and still ended up losing the game, that would never happen on a consistent basis on any decent team. There is more to winning a Cy Young than just wins and many people in this thread fail to realize this. His stats are already a lot better than Pavano, Clemens, Schmidt, etc. but it seems people base their entire decisions on wins and that is just plain stupid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marlins Phenom Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 If The Unit played for ANY other team, he would have had a 20+ win season this year.? Besides all his other awesome states, you can't ignore the fact that he pitched a perfect game and that alone is enough to warrant a Cy Young. 556880[/snapback] do browning should of won cy young the year he pitched his perfect game in i think 90? that is idiotic reasoning. 561103[/snapback] You couldn't be anymore wrong. Tom Browning was the runner up for the Cy Young and would have won it had it not been for Orel Hershiser and his 23 win season on top of a 2.2x ERA and far better stats in every other category. Unlike Tom Browning, Randy Johnson leads in virtually every single category except for wins, and the sports writers know damn well that the Unit would have had a 20+ win season if he was playing on ANY other team. His perfect game cemented his status as the Cy Young this year not to mention his stellar stats in every facet of pitching. Wins are deceiving, countless times this season the Unit has given up just a single run and still ended up losing the game, that would never happen on a consistent basis on any decent team. There is more to winning a Cy Young than just wins and many people in this thread fail to realize this. His stats are already a lot better than Pavano, Clemens, Schmidt, etc. but it seems people base their entire decisions on wins and that is just plain stupid. 561137[/snapback] Gold :notworthy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mabdul Doobakus Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 Wins can be deceiving, but they are the single most important stat for a pitcher. ERA can be deceiving sometimes as well. A couple bad games can really inflate an ERA, but in the end those are just a couple bad games. I mean if you have a 2.00 ERA in 30 games, and a 20.00 ERA in the other 5, you're going to end up with an ERA around 4.00, but you're still going to be better than the guy who's consitently putting up a 3.50. None of this applies to Johnson, but still 13 losses is just too piss poor to be a Cy Young winner. And he's got an ERA of 3.83 over those 13 losses, which ain't bad, but let's not make it out like he's only letting up a run or two every time. Frankly, I don't think it's even close. I'd have Johnson 4th or 5th on my ballot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Das Texan II Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 you state that a perfect game alone is enough to warrant a cy young. now you add conditions. better yet... david cone in 99 david wells in 98 kenny rogers in 94 did any of them really warrant cy young consideration in those years? i didnt think so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DTrainFan Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 how bout Pavs to win cy young Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marlins Phenom Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 how bout Pavs to win cy young 561222[/snapback] His in second right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MVPosey Posted September 17, 2004 Author Share Posted September 17, 2004 roger clemens will win the cy young period. 561105[/snapback] right now, yes. But it's still a close race. One bad outing or one gem can change everything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DTrainFan Posted September 17, 2004 Share Posted September 17, 2004 roger clemens will win the cy young period. 561105[/snapback] right now, yes. But it's still a close race. One bad outing or one gem can change everything. 561455[/snapback] Clemons had his bad outing in the All Star Game Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MVPosey Posted September 17, 2004 Author Share Posted September 17, 2004 roger clemens will win the cy young period. 561105[/snapback] right now, yes. But it's still a close race. One bad outing or one gem can change everything. 561455[/snapback] Clemons had his bad outing in the All Star Game 562345[/snapback] if it doesn't count against Gagne, it doesn't count against Clemens Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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