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Convince Me: Roger Clemens Shouldn't Win The CY


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To get some actual baseball talk going in here and not just news updates or another god forsaken poll, I pose this challenge to you guys:

 

Convince me that Roger Clemens is not the Cy Young Award winner right now.

 

(I will not discount any other opinion just because it does not go with my own, Id just like to get some good old fashioned baseball talk going...)

 

My Argument:

 

Roger Clemens, at age 43, is having the best individual pitching season in the last 5 years, and the NL Cy Young award race is his for the taking right now.

 

The Numbers: (NL Rank)

 

Wins - 11 (6th)

ERA - 1.38 (1st)

SO - 139 (4th)

BAA - .191 (2nd)

OBA - .252 (2nd)

WHIP - 0.96 (2nd)

H/9 - 6.12 (1st)

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Guest Juanky

I'm voting for Chris Carpenter.

 

Wins - 16 (1st)

ERA - 2.26 (2nd)

SO - 161 (3rd)

BAA - .211 (3rd)

OBA - .258 (3rd)

WHIP - 0.98 (3rd)

H/9 - 6.78 (3rd)

That's my vote right now.

 

He's Top 3 in every category and though Clemens' ERA is lower Carpenter has 5 more wins. Now, normally, wins don't qualify as who is a better pitcher or not, and Roger has had weak run support. However, when talking about the Cy Young and talking about two guys that are pretty close to each other in almost every category, you have to give wins a significant amount of weight to give a nod one way or another. If Clemens finishes with less than 15 wins and Carpenter finishes with 20+, can you honestly deny Chris the Cy Young?

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Yes, I can.

 

I factor in Clemen's age largely in my opinion...43. At 43 years of age, only Nolan Ryan has sniffed the success Clemens has.

 

His road ERA....0.38 is absurd. 0.38!!! If he pitched in a pitcher friendly ball park, his ERA would be under 1.

 

He beats Carpenter in all but two categories. And Wins is a very bad stat to judge pitching success.

 

I think Clemens gets 16 wins and leads the Astros to the wildcard, giving him some motivation to bear down even harder over the last 50 or so games.

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Guest Juanky

Yeah, don't get me wrong Clemens is having a heck of a year. But I personally can't bring myself to deny someone who was the winning pitcher in probably 22 of his team's victories the Cy Young. I just can't. Especially in a year where I believe he could very well be the only one that gets there (even though I'm rooting hard for Trelle).

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The fact that he has a 2.28 ERA at Minute Maid Park, of all places, is pretty ridiculous in itself...

 

....but a 0.37 ERA on the road?!? Are you freaking serious?!

 

....a .095 BAA with RISP? That's unheard of.. just unbelievable.

 

 

We're not going to see a season like he's having for quite some time, if ever.

 

 

 

...and I hope I'm jinxing it, for the Marlins' sake. ;)

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I vote for Carpenter and here's why....

 

For Cy Young, there's 3 major categories that are more important than other pitching stats. Wins, CG's & Shutouts.

 

Carpenter is first in wins, tied for first in CG, and tied for first in shutouts. The reason those 3 stats are more important is because those three mean that pitcher is consitantly going out there, dominating and winning his games.

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I really see no way how you can argue Clemens shouldn't win.

 

It's not his fault he had no bullpen or offense helping him early in the season, give him that Cardinals team to help out like Carpenter has, and Clemens has 20 wins or very close to it already.

 

Cy Young is the for the BEST PITCHER OVERALL in his league, and that is Clemens without a doubt.

 

And Passion, saying this is the best pitching year in 5 years is being very conservative, it's been way longer than that since we've seen something like this IMO...

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Well, maybe it will be when it is all said and done...but in my lifetime the season's Pedro had in '99 and '00 are two of the most dominant in history, let alone my life.

 

So, I still contend that this is the best year since '00. In the NL, this is probably the best years since like 94 or beyond...

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Well, maybe it will be when it is all said and done...but in my lifetime the season's Pedro had in '99 and '00 are two of the most dominant in history, let alone my life.

 

So, I still contend that this is the best year since '00. In the NL, this is probably the best years since like 94 or beyond...

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Yeah, Pedro in 1999 especially was ridiculous, I guess i'm biased towards Clemens since he's 43 and Pedro in 1999 was like 27 or something I think.

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Maybe if you are referring to the Cy OLD.? The Rocket pulled a Michael Jordan and I lost all respect for him.

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What a foolish statement...

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Not at all. Everyone saw him get rocked in his last career start. People took pictures of his last pitch. Next thing you know, he is a Houston Astro. If you are going to convince the world you are retiring, RETIRE.

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Guest Juanky

First off, he didn't get rocked.

 

Second off, the man was honestly going to retire. Andy Petitte begged and pleaded for him to pitch for Houston.

 

Third, who cares that he came back? He plays because he can, and he obviously has plenty left. Why the hate, because he's better at 43 than most are at their primes?

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