sgleason02 Posted November 13, 2010 Share Posted November 13, 2010 Seems like one of the great unknowns is whether Coghlan will really be anywhere near as good as he was in 2009. Unless I missed it, I haven't seen much discussion about that on these boards, and I'm a little uneasy about assuming he'll actually become the excellent player we think he can be. Right before he got injured, he was back to his 2009 self. The first two months is what really hurt him. June and July: .312 AVG, .394 OBP, .480 SLG, .874 OPS errrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr! (annoying buzzer noise) WRONG!! He had a terrible March, April, May, and July, and an amazing June, which shows no pattern of improvement. Simply suck, suck, suck, oh look what I found, suck, hurt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Entendu Posted November 13, 2010 Share Posted November 13, 2010 Seems like one of the great unknowns is whether Coghlan will really be anywhere near as good as he was in 2009. Unless I missed it, I haven't seen much discussion about that on these boards, and I'm a little uneasy about assuming he'll actually become the excellent player we think he can be. Right before he got injured, he was back to his 2009 self. The first two months is what really hurt him. June and July: .312 AVG, .394 OBP, .480 SLG, .874 OPS errrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr! (annoying buzzer noise) WRONG!! He had a terrible March, April, May, and July, and an amazing June, which shows no pattern of improvement. Simply suck, suck, suck, oh look what I found, suck, hurt. Calm down, bro. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mystikol87 Posted November 13, 2010 Share Posted November 13, 2010 I like how you add in March to emphasize your point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poptart Posted November 13, 2010 Share Posted November 13, 2010 When was the last time we had an actual left fielder playing left field? Billy McMillon? 2004. Miguel Cabrera Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabbethan Posted November 13, 2010 Share Posted November 13, 2010 When was the last time we had an actual left fielder playing left field? Billy McMillon? 2004. Miguel Cabrera He was a 3B and not very good in LF at all. I'd say 2008 though, by then Hammer had become a pretty decent LFer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroncoBob27 Posted November 13, 2010 Share Posted November 13, 2010 By the way, I'm not a fan of this move. This means Morrison is going to be playing LF next year. I would've just left Coghlan, there. If Uggla signs, it's pretty much the same lineup as last year. That's not a bad thing in terms of offense, but defensively, I don't see how the team is improving, by any means. It's only the middle of November. I still expect LoMo to be playing 1B next season. But I think it all depends on the Uggla negotiations. If he signs, and I do expect that to happen, then Gaby's bat does become expendable. If Uggla dosen't then it all comes down to what we get in trades whether or not Gaby is here next year. I keep saying that you can't keep giving up defense for bats. But it works the other way too. You can't give up a majority of your bats. The Padres being a good example. Great pitching and defense, but only 1 real bat. Without taking into account what we would be getting in return with both being traded, we would still have Cogs', Hanley's, and Stanton's bats in the line up, but that's not enough. And 2 of those bats being relatively unproven, not a comfortable way to head into the season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroncoBob27 Posted November 13, 2010 Share Posted November 13, 2010 Seems a little premature with the Uggla negotiations going so poorly. Then again, if Coghlan is going to start working on his 3B defensive game he needs to start as soon as possible, or before the Marlins have a more definite answer on Uggla's future. If they can't extend his contract, hopefully they have decided on if they will trade him or let him walk after 2011. The comments Uggla made after winning the SS makes me feel just the opposite of this. The $$$ seems right, it's just a matter of that 5th year. I feel pretty confident a compromise will happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroncoBob27 Posted November 13, 2010 Share Posted November 13, 2010 By the way, I'm not a fan of this move. This means Morrison is going to be playing LF next year. I would've just left Coghlan, there. If Uggla signs, it's pretty much the same lineup as last year. That's not a bad thing in terms of offense, but defensively, I don't see how the team is improving, by any means. And his name is........PERRY....HILL!!!!!!!! Perry Hill can improve player positioning, but he can't improve someone's range. And the reason why I don't like this move is because they'll end up moving Coghlan again, anyway. Perry believes positioning trumps range. I agree with that. And being quicker to the ball means better throws to 1B, which would make Gaby look better. I doubt it would raise him above "average at best" defensively, but it would help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gizmo Posted November 13, 2010 Share Posted November 13, 2010 I like how you add in March to emphasize your point. I think his January was pretty bad too, and I heard he didn't have a very good Christmas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mystikol87 Posted November 13, 2010 Share Posted November 13, 2010 I like how you add in March to emphasize your point. I think his January was pretty bad too, and I heard he didn't have a very good Christmas. Blame it on the eggnog IMO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sgleason02 Posted November 13, 2010 Share Posted November 13, 2010 I like how you add in March to emphasize your point. I think his January was pretty bad too, and I heard he didn't have a very good Christmas. Blame it on the eggnog IMO I just didn't feel that "suck, suck, oh look what I found, suck, hurt" did it as much justice as "suck, suck, suck, oh look what I found, suck, hurt." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Posted November 13, 2010 Share Posted November 13, 2010 Seems a little premature with the Uggla negotiations going so poorly. Then again, if Coghlan is going to start working on his 3B defensive game he needs to start as soon as possible, or before the Marlins have a more definite answer on Uggla's future. If they can't extend his contract, hopefully they have decided on if they will trade him or let him walk after 2011. The comments Uggla made after winning the SS makes me feel just the opposite of this. The $$$ seems right, it's just a matter of that 5th year. I feel pretty confident a compromise will happen. No, the award just made things more difficult. It only increased his value, which means that some other team might actually want to sign him to a five year deal. Doing so would be idiotic and Beinfest seems smart enough not to cave into something like that. It's a matter of that 5th year, yes, but the Marlins under no circumstance should give it to him. So the only real compromise we need is for Uggla to come to his senses, but with the Silver Slugger award and Cody Ross probably barking into Uggla's ear about the joys of playing in front of a full crowd on a playoff team, there is more uncertainty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Entendu Posted November 13, 2010 Share Posted November 13, 2010 Seems a little premature with the Uggla negotiations going so poorly. Then again, if Coghlan is going to start working on his 3B defensive game he needs to start as soon as possible, or before the Marlins have a more definite answer on Uggla's future. If they can't extend his contract, hopefully they have decided on if they will trade him or let him walk after 2011. The comments Uggla made after winning the SS makes me feel just the opposite of this. The $ seems right, it's just a matter of that 5th year. I feel pretty confident a compromise will happen. No, the award just made things more difficult. It only increased his value, which means that some other team might actually want to sign him to a five year deal. Doing so would be idiotic and Beinfest seems smart enough not to cave into something like that. It's a matter of that 5th year, yes, but the Marlins under no circumstance should give it to him. So the only real compromise we need is for Uggla to come to his senses, but with the Silver Slugger award and Cody Ross probably barking into Uggla's ear about the joys of playing in front of a full crowd on a playoff team, there is more uncertainty. But there's just so many things I don't understand about that. Does anyone following/playing on this team not expect better crowds at the new stadium (especially short term) and the ability to compete for a playoff spot? I mean, we aren't exactly going into that new stadium grasping at straws. This team has a legitimate chance at relevancy maybe as early as 2011. Uggla's help build that. I'd really want to stick it through if I were him, even at the price of one less year of security. 2014 should be long enough to see this whole thing through. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miamimarlinswin Posted November 15, 2010 Author Share Posted November 15, 2010 deleted post Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TXBoy Posted November 15, 2010 Share Posted November 15, 2010 if i remember correctly isn't Coughlan a 2B, Morrison a 1B and Dominguez a 3B so we should let them take over their natural positions and trade Sanchez and (i really hate to say it) Uggla for as much "pitching, speed and defense" as possible. If Skipworth isn't ready then a catcher too. Uggla is the soul of this team but a silly contract will hurt this team as much or more than these stupid trades the FO has been making (Boni for Olsen and Hammer and Miggy to Det). When does the confidence run out on Beinfest?? He's becoming a deteriment to this team as well/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miamimarlinswin Posted November 16, 2010 Author Share Posted November 16, 2010 if i remember correctly isn't Coughlan a 2B, Morrison a 1B and Dominguez a 3B so we should let them take over their natural positions and trade Sanchez and (i really hate to say it) Uggla for as much "pitching, speed and defense" as possible. If Skipworth isn't ready then a catcher too. Uggla is the soul of this team but a silly contract will hurt this team as much or more than these stupid trades the FO has been making (Boni for Olsen and Hammer and Miggy to Det). When does the confidence run out on Beinfest?? He's becoming a deteriment to this team as well/ OMG :blink: I feel for you bro. There are going to be some on this board that will want you hog-tied, quartered, flogged, burned at the stake and then what's left sent though a meat grinder for saying this. Don't you know its against the law around here not to worship the ground Beinfest walks on ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobbob1313 Posted November 16, 2010 Share Posted November 16, 2010 if i remember correctly isn't Coughlan a 2B, Morrison a 1B and Dominguez a 3B so we should let them take over their natural positions and trade Sanchez and (i really hate to say it) Uggla for as much "pitching, speed and defense" as possible. If Skipworth isn't ready then a catcher too. Uggla is the soul of this team but a silly contract will hurt this team as much or more than these stupid trades the FO has been making (Boni for Olsen and Hammer and Miggy to Det). When does the confidence run out on Beinfest?? He's becoming a deteriment to this team as well/ OMG :blink: I feel for you bro. There are going to be some on this board that will want you hog-tied, quartered, flogged, burned at the stake and then what's left sent though a meat grinder for saying this. Don't you know its against the law around here not to worship the ground Beinfest walks on ? All Beinfest drafted team right now: C: Brett Hayes, Brad Davis 1B: Gaby Sanchez 2B: Chris Coghlan SS: Ozzie Martinez 3B: Matt Dominguez LF: Logan Morrison CF: Scott Cousins RF: Mike Stanton SP: JJ, Volstad, Sanabia, Sean West RP: Ceda, Marinez, whatever That team is maybe not the worst team in baseball, and that's just with the guys he's drafted. He's missed on the Cabrera trade and the Willingham trade, but as has been discussed hundreds of times, Willingham's value was really low. He's killed the minor league FA and non-roster invitees over the last few years with guys like Uggla, Cantu, Ross, and some of the relievers like Nelson, Waechter, and those types of guys. You've been hammering this home over the last few weeks, but there's really no evidence. He's got some good trades (destroyed the Cubs on the Pierre trade), some trades for good value for good value (Hanley), and he's missed some. but more than not, he's been a positive for this franchise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miamimarlinswin Posted November 16, 2010 Author Share Posted November 16, 2010 if i remember correctly isn't Coughlan a 2B, Morrison a 1B and Dominguez a 3B so we should let them take over their natural positions and trade Sanchez and (i really hate to say it) Uggla for as much "pitching, speed and defense" as possible. If Skipworth isn't ready then a catcher too. Uggla is the soul of this team but a silly contract will hurt this team as much or more than these stupid trades the FO has been making (Boni for Olsen and Hammer and Miggy to Det). When does the confidence run out on Beinfest?? He's becoming a deteriment to this team as well/ OMG :blink: I feel for you bro. There are going to be some on this board that will want you hog-tied, quartered, flogged, burned at the stake and then what's left sent though a meat grinder for saying this. Don't you know its against the law around here not to worship the ground Beinfest walks on ? All Beinfest drafted team right now: C: Brett Hayes, Brad Davis 1B: Gaby Sanchez 2B: Chris Coghlan SS: Ozzie Martinez 3B: Matt Dominguez LF: Logan Morrison CF: Scott Cousins RF: Mike Stanton SP: JJ, Volstad, Sanabia, Sean West RP: Ceda, Marinez, whatever That team is maybe not the worst team in baseball, and that's just with the guys he's drafted. He's missed on the Cabrera trade and the Willingham trade, but as has been discussed hundreds of times, Willingham's value was really low. He's killed the minor league FA and non-roster invitees over the last few years with guys like Uggla, Cantu, Ross, and some of the relievers like Nelson, Waechter, and those types of guys. You've been hammering this home over the last few weeks, but there's really no evidence. He's got some good trades (destroyed the Cubs on the Pierre trade), some trades for good value for good value (Hanley), and he's missed some. but more than not, he's been a positive for this franchise. How many division titles have his draft picks won ? How many playoff games ? Sure seems the chief FO guys on other teams can do it. Schuerholtz in Atlanta is one great example of how to build a team. They finished behind the Marlins 2 years in a row, and completely changed their team and won a playoff spot this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobbob1313 Posted November 16, 2010 Share Posted November 16, 2010 Nate Szhuerholtz in Atlanta is one great example of a GM who had $40 million more to work with than Beinfest. You can't be this dense, can you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mystikol87 Posted November 16, 2010 Share Posted November 16, 2010 So you're saying that Beinfest has had better results 2/3 years than a guy with a much bigger payroll? Yeah. Or do you want a complete roster overhaul anytime you don't win the World Series? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Entendu Posted November 16, 2010 Share Posted November 16, 2010 My lord, every topic is now about Beinfest! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mystikol87 Posted November 16, 2010 Share Posted November 16, 2010 SHEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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