Admin Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 I think Beinfest is a great GM for a low payroll team, but I agree that some new blood could be beneficial to the organization. I don't think I'd go as far as to call him "great." He's certainly not awful, though. His draft performance (critical for a small market team) is average at best. He has a fairly respectable reputation when it comes to trades, but that Cabrera/Willis return is a massive albatross. Most importantly he seems a little too reluctant at times to conduct arbitration buyouts. That's not really a wise approach for a small market club. All of these weaknesses are probably the reason he hasn't produced a playoff team in 9 seasons. I think that a "great" small market GM would have put up better results than that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mystikol87 Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 Bob always equals Bob: fact. Backwards AND forwards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gizmo Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 I think Beinfest is a great GM for a low payroll team, but I agree that some new blood could be beneficial to the organization. I don't think I'd go as far as to call him "great." He's certainly not awful, though. His draft performance (critical for a small market team) is average at best. He has a fairly respectable reputation when it comes to trades, but that Cabrera/Willis return is a massive albatross. Most importantly he seems a little too reluctant at times to conduct arbitration buyouts. That's not really a wise approach for a small market club. All of these weaknesses are probably the reason he hasn't produced a playoff team in 9 seasons. I think that a "great" small market GM would have put up better results than that. I'll give you his weak drafting, sure, but I don't blame him for the Cabrera trade at all. At the time, Maybin/Miller were the best prospects in the game. Not many other GMs would have turned down that offer. But that has been debated to death. He's always managed to string together a decent team though with what little money he was given to spend. Better than Beane at that , IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mystikol87 Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 At what point do Michael Hill and Admin Beinfest go even with them seemingly having lifetime contracts. If we don't make the playoffs this year that will be 9 straight years. Most teams would have gone through 2-3 GMs by then. They aren't getting it done. I've said this before and gotten roasted by some on this board. Thank God I am not alone anymore. Thank God, indeed. I've been praying for the very same, and I am so grateful He listened. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erick Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 To be honest, everyone in the front office should've been fired on Opening Day for not letting Lenny Harris throw the first pitch. What we're experiencing now is karma. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 I think Beinfest is a great GM for a low payroll team, but I agree that some new blood could be beneficial to the organization. I don't think I'd go as far as to call him "great." He's certainly not awful, though. His draft performance (critical for a small market team) is average at best. He has a fairly respectable reputation when it comes to trades, but that Cabrera/Willis return is a massive albatross. Most importantly he seems a little too reluctant at times to conduct arbitration buyouts. That's not really a wise approach for a small market club. All of these weaknesses are probably the reason he hasn't produced a playoff team in 9 seasons. I think that a "great" small market GM would have put up better results than that. I'll give you his weak drafting, sure, but I don't blame him for the Cabrera trade at all. At the time, Maybin/Miller were the best prospects in the game. Not many other GMs would have turned down that offer. But that has been debated to death. He's always managed to string together a decent team though with what little money he was given to spend. Better than Beane at that , IMO. To say he deserves "no blame at all" for the Cabrera trade is silly. Yes, Maybin and Miller were highly regarded at the time, but they were also so underdeveloped at the time that they carried a tremendous amount of risk. Under such circumstances, he should have tried to strip away more developed talent from one of the LA teams. And this isn't just speaking from hindsight. I think that Beane has had much more success than Beinfest has had. Beinfest's only postseason team already had much of its core assembled by the previous GM too. I'd say he's pretty average for a small-market GM. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Out of the Past Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 Beinfest has done well picking up guys off the scrap heap like Uggla, Ross and Cantu but besides scrap heap transactions he's mediocre at best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Timer Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 On a more serious note, I wish two things would happen in the offseason: 1.) Loria/Samson should make a greater attempt to stay out of baseball decisions. Putting all of the pieces together, I get the impression that Loria was pretty integral in several of the free agent signings, especially Buck and Bell. I suppose it's Loria's money to waste, but when you start accumulating a lot of dead weight contracts, your hands can be tied. 2.) Beinfest/Hill should leave the organization. I don't think they've been terrible in the slightest, but I would like to see some fresh blood. I'm pretty dissatisfied with the current core of players and think that a fresh perspective would go a long ways in restocking the farm system and simulaneously fielding a competitive team. It would be pretty cool if they could bring someone in who's more statistically oriented. OMG.....Hell just froze over. El Penguino and I agree on something...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giancarlo Stanton Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 At what point do Michael Hill and Admin Beinfest go even with them seemingly having lifetime contracts. If we don't make the playoffs this year that will be 9 straight years. Most teams would have gone through 2-3 GMs by then. They aren't getting it done. I agree with you completely Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Timer Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 I think Beinfest is a great GM for a low payroll team, but I agree that some new blood could be beneficial to the organization. I don't think I'd go as far as to call him "great." He's certainly not awful, though. His draft performance (critical for a small market team) is average at best. He has a fairly respectable reputation when it comes to trades, but that Cabrera/Willis return is a massive albatross. Most importantly he seems a little too reluctant at times to conduct arbitration buyouts. That's not really a wise approach for a small market club. All of these weaknesses are probably the reason he hasn't produced a playoff team in 9 seasons. I think that a "great" small market GM would have put up better results than that. I'll give you his weak drafting, sure, but I don't blame him for the Cabrera trade at all. At the time, Maybin/Miller were the best prospects in the game. Not many other GMs would have turned down that offer. But that has been debated to death. He's always managed to string together a decent team though with what little money he was given to spend. Better than Beane at that , IMO. To say he deserves "no blame at all" for the Cabrera trade is silly. Yes, Maybin and Miller were highly regarded at the time, but they were also so underdeveloped at the time that they carried a tremendous amount of risk. Under such circumstances, he should have tried to strip away more developed talent from one of the LA teams. And this isn't just speaking from hindsight. I think that Beane has had much more success than Beinfest has had. Beinfest's only postseason team already had much of its core assembled by the previous GM too. I'd say he's pretty average for a small-market GM. There was a report that the Dodgers had offered Kemp and someone else for Cabrera, and Beinfest turned it down. Think of an outfield and lineup with Kemp and Stanton next to each other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 There was a report that the Dodgers had offered Kemp and someone else for Cabrera, and Beinfest turned it down. Think of an outfield and lineup with Kemp and Stanton next to each other. No, Kemp would have been a bust cause it was Beinfest who traded for him. :| Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AeroFishOne Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 I seriously hope some of you never invest in the stock market. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 I seriously hope some of you never invest in the stock market. I do and am doing pretty well. :thumbup Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 OMG.....Hell just froze over. El Penguino and I agree on something...... I have been critical of Beinfest for a long time now, but I don't take it to the absurd level that you do. You say that Beinfest is a bottom of the barrel GM when it comes to the draft and that any player he touches is likely to be a bust. I say that Beinfest has been average at best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piazza31 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 I seriously hope some of you never invest in the stock market. I do and am doing pretty well. :thumbup But are you a UF Graduate married to the woman of your dreams with 2.5 children, a 4 bedroom/3 bath Colonial and a white fence? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AeroFishOne Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 I seriously hope some of you never invest in the stock market. I do and am doing pretty well. :thumbup Lol, while we don't always see eye to eye, I respect your baseball opinions and your pretty level headed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 I seriously hope some of you never invest in the stock market. I do and am doing pretty well. :thumbup Lol, while we don't always see eye to eye, I respect your baseball opinions and your pretty level headed. CanesCop, bro. You're. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AeroFishOne Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 I seriously hope some of you never invest in the stock market. I do and am doing pretty well. :thumbup Lol, while we don't always see eye to eye, I respect your baseball opinions and your pretty level headed. CanesCop, bro. You're. Dude, I need to borrow Piazzas cat picture for my response. Not one f*** will be given, lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 I seriously hope some of you never invest in the stock market. I do and am doing pretty well. :thumbup Lol, while we don't always see eye to eye, I respect your baseball opinions and your pretty level headed. CanesCop, bro. You're. Dude, I need to borrow Piazzas cat picture for my response. Not one f*** will be given, lol I gave a f*** once. I lent it to Spiderman. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fishes on the Pond Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 To be honest, everyone in the front office should've been fired on Opening Day for not letting Lenny Harris throw the first pitch. What we're experiencing now is karma. That's a blast from the past. I always thought they should have done something for him in the organization. It seems like we hire everyone back in some capacity. Now I truly know that is an EXAGGERATION, but I would think he could do some clinics, if nothing else, with those who come in to pitch hit. He truly had that figured out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marlinfan24 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 Before you all jump to conclusions after a pretty torrid June of baseball, let's wait and see the rest of the season play out. Beinfest/Hill have never put a team together with such a high payroll. Putting together a team with payroll in the top third of MLB is completely different that putting together a team with the lowest payroll in all of baseball. Beinfest/Hill have done pretty decent job in the past of fielding teams that were average and above average when the team's payroll was at the bottom of the barrel. Beinfest/Hill are not the best front office in MLB but they are far from the worst. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 Putting together a winning team with a higher payroll is substantially easier, though. It shouldn't matter if they've never managed a $100 million+ payroll before now. If the Marlins aren't in serious competition for a season with this payroll and where there is a second wild card spot and the Phillies are a mess, that's a pretty embarrassing failure. However, in their defense, I don't think that any sane person would have expected Buck and Gaby to suck this much. I also think it's reasonable to have expected more out of Reyes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobbob1313 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 Putting together a winning team with a higher payroll is substantially easier, though. It shouldn't matter if they've never managed a $100 million+ payroll before now. If the Marlins aren't in serious competition for a season with this payroll and where there is a second wild card spot and the Phillies are a mess, that's a pretty embarrassing failure. However, in their defense, I don't think that any sane person would have expected Buck and Gaby to suck this much. I also think it's reasonable to have expected more out of Reyes. I was thinking about this the other day. All things considered, Mark Buehrle, Carlos Zambrano, Hanley Ramirez, Giancarlo Stanton and Omar Infante are just about the only players on the team that have not disappointed this season. It's been pretty bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 I don't think that Bonifacio (when healthy) and Nolasco have really been disappointments. They've performed at about the level I expected. Buck and Gaby are the huge mindf***s. I think everyone knew that they weren't premium talent, but it's hard to expect them sucking this hard. Even people like me who were firmly against the Bell signing never would have expected his early season struggles. He's improved a lot since then, but those bad outings cost the team wins. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobbob1313 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 The entire bullpen with the exception of Cishek has been a major disappointment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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