If Cishek pitches well for the first four months of the season, do you think the Marlins should trade him for some better talent considering the team lacks talent/the closer's role is overrated, especially on a bad team?

If Cishek pitches well for the first four months of the season, do you think the Marlins should trade him for some better talent considering the team lacks talent/the closer's role is overrated, especially on a bad team?

We could just start a thread called "If anyone at all plays well for the first four months, should we trade him?" But what would be the point? Trade good young talent for good young talent? I can't see where you would go with this.

I have to agree with Year One Marlin Fan here. The Marlins should keep Cishek. He doesn't cost much and he should help the team finish off games that they should win.

You can't just really start this for any player.

 

This team doesn't have many proven players (honestly, how many do we have? Like three, maybe?); Steve Cishek just so happens to be one of them as he's done well for two years now.

 

The point is that our team is bad, or, at the very least, projects to be bad. There's no point in having a closer as one of your best assets ever, but especially on a bad team. If you trade a young player like Cishek and turn him into a young player who could play every day or a young player who could possibly become a starting pitcher one day, the team gets better.

 

And teams tend to overpay for closers at the trade deadline.

I have a hard time with the concept that the way to build a good team is to trade away your young talent as soon they prove themselves, unless you have a surplus.

I have to disagree with you Erick. I think the worst thing for a young team's morale is to blow games in the 9th inning. Cishek should be a guy that's off-limits in trades unless the Marlins are blown away with an offer that they can't refuse.

I have a hard time with the concept that the way to build a good team is to trade away your young talent as soon they prove themselves, unless you have a surplus.

Trading a guy like Cishek and getting value back is how an organization can create a surplus of young talent.

 

I really like Cishek; I liked him before he ever produced for this team, and I like that he's developed nicely. He's basically the only good reliever this franchise has ever developed.

 

With that said, we all know what the state of the franchise is. This organization currently has limited depth up the middle in the infield. 3B? Nothing there. Acquiring those things is much more important than having a good reliever on the team.

Do you really expect to get a proven 3B in trade for Cishek? Seems very optimistic.

Do you really expect to get a proven 3B in trade for Cishek? Seems very optimistic.

I think Erick is aiming for more prospects. That is what they should try to deal Ricky Nolasco for.....not Cishek.

Do you really expect to get a proven 3B in trade for Cishek? Seems very optimistic.

Teams have gotten valuable pieces for far lesser relievers before at the trade deadline. Cishek is also young and cost-controlled. Good strikeout #'s and GB #'s and GM's are now realizing that overpaying free agent closers is probably not the best way to go (Rafael Soriano, for example, not even signed yet despite having a great year last year).

 

Cishek would have very good value at the deadline if he keeps pitching the way he's pitched the past couple of years. There are always contending teams who need relievers.

 

Look at the relievers who have been traded at the deadline over the years and look at the respective returns; the returns are usually pretty nice.

Do you really expect to get a proven 3B in trade for Cishek? Seems very optimistic.

I think Erick is aiming for more prospects. That is what they should try to deal Ricky Nolasco for.....not Cishek.

But Nolasco has no trade value. That's why I started this thread.

 

Of all the players in the organization, who has the most value in a trade?

1. Stanton (franchise player...we all know the situation here)

2-4. Fernandez, Yelich, Turner (guys going nowhere)

5...Cishek?

 

I guess maybe Hechevarria since he's a SS and not much different from Didi Gregorius who had nice value via trade this offseason; either way, Hechevarria is staying too.

At some point the Marlins need to keep some players Erick.

At some point the Marlins need to keep some players Erick.

Especially young proven ones. Give us an example of a player who exemplifies the value you would expect in return for Cishek, Erick.

At some point the Marlins need to keep some players Erick.

Especially young proven ones. Give us an example of a player who exemplifies the value you would expect in return for Cishek, Erick.

Mike Jacobs

 

The Mariners would do that in a heartbeat! LOL!

I have to disagree with you Erick. I think the worst thing for a young team's morale is to blow games in the 9th inning. Cishek should be a guy that's off-limits in trades unless the Marlins are blown away with an offer that they can't refuse.

Matt Mantei-

 

That is all.

 

Erick knows what I'm talking about

well we got Zack Cox for Mujica I guess.

 

I don't know, it's worth thinking about. We all like Cishek but again it's the story where we don't know yet when this group will be ready to contend again. I hope that they can make some noise again by 2014 but whether we have the players yet remains to be seen. I feel like they have enough up-&-coming pitching where we could be okay there, and there's some outfield depth. But the infield is full of question marks.

 

On the other hand he's not even arb-eligible until 2015 so you're getting good performance cheap and that's hard to part with.

 

Personally I'd like to see him stick around, but they should certainly listen to offers. I mean if he's lighting the world on fire and some team with a stacked system thinks he can anchor their pen for the stretch run and offers a really good prospect, then sure that's hard to pass up.

 

Hopefully 4 months from now they'll have a little better idea of where things stand with the current group & the Jax guys and where the holes are.

New strategy. Any player that does well 2 seasons in a row gets traded. Can't lose.

For someone who thinks the team sucks, you're being rather close-minded about this. We're talking about Steve Cishek, not Giancarlo Stanton. Do you think Steve Cishek is an untouchable, irreplaceable core piece?

At some point the Marlins need to keep some players Erick.

Especially young proven ones. Give us an example of a player who exemplifies the value you would expect in return for Cishek, Erick.

I don't know. Things always change in July; every contending team could always use more depth in their bullpen in July.

 

Examples are out there for you to research.

Just in this thread, Matt Mantei was mentioned. We traded Matt Mantei for Brad Penny and others. Would you not make that trade over and over again if you had the opportunity to do so?

 

Is this team good?

When do you expect this team to be competitive?

If you don't expect the current team to be competitive soon, what's the point in a closer being one of your most valuable players? Closers/relievers in general are good for 60-70 innings a year, and, to be fair, while Cishek has proven himself to be a good reliever, he's also not the Craig Kimbrel some in this thread are making him out to be. Furthermore, if the Braves weren't good and had as many holes as we have, I would probably say they should trade Craig Kimbrel, as well.

 

Context matters. If this team was projected to be good, I wouldn't start this thread.

well we got Zack Cox for Mujica I guess.

 

I don't know, it's worth thinking about. We all like Cishek but again it's the story where we don't know yet when this group will be ready to contend again. I hope that they can make some noise again by 2014 but whether we have the players yet remains to be seen. I feel like they have enough up-&-coming pitching where we could be okay there, and there's some outfield depth. But the infield is full of question marks.

 

On the other hand he's not even arb-eligible until 2015 so you're getting good performance cheap and that's hard to part with.

 

Personally I'd like to see him stick around, but they should certainly listen to offers. I mean if he's lighting the world on fire and some team with a stacked system thinks he can anchor their pen for the stretch run and offers a really good prospect, that's hard to pass up.

 

Hopefully 4 months from now they'll have a little better idea of where things stand with the current group & the Jax guys.

 

All good points.

Steve Cishek is not an important part of the team's core or future. Absolutely you trade him if we get a nice offer.

Steve Cishek is not an important part of the team's core or future. Absolutely you trade him if we get a nice offer.

Exactly- although we need more stirrups on this team- you trade him if the return is similar to the Matt Mantei trade in 1998 or even what Texas got for Urbina in 03.

 

Good cheap closers are worth their own small fortune- this offseason Jonathan Walden was trades for Tommy Hanson.

 

If you get a SP, or a good- great prospect you absolutely do it.

 

His value will be highest in July- move him then if your not in contention.

July 8, 1999: Traded by the Florida Marlins to the Arizona Diamondbacks for a player to be named later, Vladimir Nunez and Brad Penny. The Arizona Diamondbacks sent Abraham Nunez (December 13, 1999) to the Florida Marlins to complete the trade.

Again, I think it all depends on how quickly this team starts contending again. If we're there in two years, you keep Cishek. Farther away, you ship him out. We need to let at least half of 2013 play itself out before making these calls.

 

That said, both Erick and YearOne have valid enough points, I just dont know who's the winner yet.

I have a hard time with the concept that the way to build a good team is to trade away your young talent as soon they prove themselves, unless you have a surplus.

Trading a guy like Cishek and getting value back is how an organization can create a surplus of young talent.

 

I really like Cishek; I liked him before he ever produced for this team, and I like that he's developed nicely. He's basically the only good reliever this franchise has ever developed.

 

With that said, we all know what the state of the franchise is. This organization currently has limited depth up the middle in the infield. 3B? Nothing there. Acquiring those things is much more important than having a good reliever on the team.

I stopped reading this thread after this statement. When people start making up their own "facts" to back up their thoughts, it's time to move on.

I have a hard time with the concept that the way to build a good team is to trade away your young talent as soon they prove themselves, unless you have a surplus.

Trading a guy like Cishek and getting value back is how an organization can create a surplus of young talent.

 

I really like Cishek; I liked him before he ever produced for this team, and I like that he's developed nicely. He's basically the only good reliever this franchise has ever developed.

 

With that said, we all know what the state of the franchise is. This organization currently has limited depth up the middle in the infield. 3B? Nothing there. Acquiring those things is much more important than having a good reliever on the team.

I stopped reading this thread after this statement. When people start making up their own "facts" to back up their thoughts, it's time to move on.

 

What relievers do you have in mind?