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Where Do We Go From Here?


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Shields will be 33 next season. 4/75 with option is way more than I'd like to see the Marlins spend.

 

 

 

I agree with this as well. Three years would really be ideal. Hell, Jake Peavy and two years really sounded great, but three years of Shields is fine.

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Yeah if this happens, I'd love to finally see the Marlins make a big money move with having to "steal from Peter and borrow from Paul" (is that how the saying goes?)... My point is we've done enough money saving I'd hope one day we can actually make a big move that we pay straight up for. I don't know if I'd want Shields if we'd again have to make salary clearing moves.

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Lou, you're always giving second to none insight... But Cishek isn't being traded. Disney recently released a big hit, "Let it go".

 

McGehee wasn't going to get traded either.

 

Cishek (and obviously Haren) is how they clear salary to make a Shields/Max move. Can't imagine them not clearing something if they intend to go big with either of them.

 

Likewise, it's been the Marlins modus operandi for years to attach a valuable property (Cishek) to a lesser one (Haren) to get a deal done. i.e., how they keep dumping the Lowells, Bucks, Dontrelles, etc. when they are deemed expendable.

 

 

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Lou, you're always giving second to none insight... But Cishek isn't being traded. Disney recently released a big hit, "Let it go".

 

McGehee wasn't going to get traded either.

 

Cishek (and obviously Haren) is how they clear salary to make a Shields/Max move. Can't imagine them not clearing something if they intend to go big with either of them.

 

Likewise, it's been the Marlins modus operandi for years to attach a valuable property (Cishek) to a lesser one (Haren) to get a deal done. i.e., how they keep dumping the Lowells, Bucks, Dontrelles, etc. when they are deemed expendable.

 

 

 

Who do you suggest for closer, then? I don't really trust anyone else at the moment.

 

 

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Lou, you're always giving second to none insight... But Cishek isn't being traded. Disney recently released a big hit, "Let it go".

 

McGehee wasn't going to get traded either.

 

Cishek (and obviously Haren) is how they clear salary to make a Shields/Max move. Can't imagine them not clearing something if they intend to go big with either of them.

 

Likewise, it's been the Marlins modus operandi for years to attach a valuable property (Cishek) to a lesser one (Haren) to get a deal done. i.e., how they keep dumping the Lowells, Bucks, Dontrelles, etc. when they are deemed expendable.

 

 

 

Who do you suggest for closer, then? I don't really trust anyone else at the moment.

 

 

 

Who cares. Someone from Ramos, Morris, Crow, Koehler/Phelps (the other would be the #5 SP), or Capps would emerge.

 

 

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The Marlins should just keep Cishek and spend the money to get Shields. That makes this a non issue.

 

This is my point. Its about time the Marlins get a free agent or two without having to cut corners to get it done.

Exactly. Moving Cishek to acquire Shields doesn't make the team that much better. It also defeats the purpose of free agency, might as well make a trade. Adding Shields without subtracting would make the team much better.

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The Marlins should just keep Cishek and spend the money to get Shields. That makes this a non issue.

 

This is my point. Its about time the Marlins get a free agent or two without having to cut corners to get it done.

 

 

 

something something spending money is bad something something

 

 

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The Marlins should just keep Cishek and spend the money to get Shields. That makes this a non issue.

 

This is my point. Its about time the Marlins get a free agent or two without having to cut corners to get it done.

 

 

 

Fully agree if the price is right. No reason to overpay for anyone just to say we spent money

 

 

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The Marlins should just keep Cishek and spend the money to get Shields. That makes this a non issue.

 

This is my point. Its about time the Marlins get a free agent or two without having to cut corners to get it done.Exactly. Moving Cishek to acquire Shields doesn't make the team that much better. It also defeats the purpose of free agency, might as well make a trade. Adding Shields without subtracting would make the team much better.

 

Your statement that replacing Cishek with Shields wouldn't make the team that much better is wrong.

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The Marlins should just keep Cishek and spend the money to get Shields. That makes this a non issue.

 

 

This is my point. Its about time the Marlins get a free agent or two without having to cut corners to get it done.

Exactly. Moving Cishek to acquire Shields doesn't make the team that much better. It also defeats the purpose of free agency, might as well make a trade. Adding Shields without subtracting would make the team much better.

 

Moving Cishek to acquire Shields makes the team MUCH better.

 

210 innings of Shields and 65 innings of someone like Capps (plus trade assets for Cishek), is better than 275 innings of Cishek, and the SP options of Phelps, Hands, Nicolino, Williams, Vagabond FA SP, etc.

 

 

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The Marlins should just keep Cishek and spend the money to get Shields. That makes this a non issue.

 

This is my point. Its about time the Marlins get a free agent or two without having to cut corners to get it done.

 

 

 

This would be nice and ideal, but signing Shields for $90-110 becomes easier if they clear out $17 million with Haren and Cishek - each of whom the Marlins do not really need. The bullpen will be fine. Capps is your Cishek replacement, who will be in AAA with the current roster.

 

This isn't an argumentative point

 

 

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The Marlins should just keep Cishek and spend the money to get Shields. That makes this a non issue.

 

This is my point. Its about time the Marlins get a free agent or two without having to cut corners to get it done.Exactly. Moving Cishek to acquire Shields doesn't make the team that much better. It also defeats the purpose of free agency, might as well make a trade. Adding Shields without subtracting would make the team much better.

 

Moving Cishek to acquire Shields makes the team MUCH better.

 

210 innings of Shields and 65 innings of someone like Capps (plus trade assets for Cishek), is better than 275 innings of Cishek, and the SP options of Phelps, Hands, Nicolino, Williams, Vagabond FA SP, etc.

 

This is assuming the best case scenario for Cishek's replacement. What happens if, say, Capps like you proposed pitches like he did in Seattle and can't close a door? Or he loses another couple months with elbow trouble and Ramos falters under the pressure?

 

Everyone says closers are so replaceable, and they are to an extent. But what happens when the alternatives fail? Then you wasted that great 7+ inning start by your man Shields because you couldn't protect him and that 2-run lead.

 

It's a great idea in theory, but this is why the closer role exists. Because it's just not that easy.

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The Marlins should just keep Cishek and spend the money to get Shields. That makes this a non issue.

 

 

This is my point. Its about time the Marlins get a free agent or two without having to cut corners to get it done.

Exactly. Moving Cishek to acquire Shields doesn't make the team that much better. It also defeats the purpose of free agency, might as well make a trade. Adding Shields without subtracting would make the team much better.

Moving Cishek to acquire Shields makes the team MUCH better.

 

210 innings of Shields and 65 innings of someone like Capps (plus trade assets for Cishek), is better than 275 innings of Cishek, and the SP options of Phelps, Hands, Nicolino, Williams, Vagabond FA SP, etc.

 

This is assuming the best case scenario for Cishek's replacement. What happens if, say, Capps like you proposed pitches like he did in Seattle and can't close a door? Or he loses another couple months with elbow trouble and Ramos falters under the pressure?

 

Everyone says closers are so replaceable, and they are to an extent. But what happens when the alternatives fail? Then you wasted that great 7+ inning start by your man Shields because you couldn't protect him and that 2-run lead.

 

It's a great idea in theory, but this is why the closer role exists. Because it's just not that easy.

 

No, it is really easy if the decision has to be financial and they have to shed payroll for someone like Shields.

 

A dominant # 2 SP who is going to pitch 210 innings is more valuable than any reliever in baseball who is going to pitch 65 innings. Period.

 

Even more so when the alternative is a 5th SP of some collection of Phelps/Hand/Nicolino (which is a hope and prayer until Fernandez is back), versus being able to insert someone as the 5th RHP on the team like Capps or Dyson (which is really solid at a minimum. Ramos, Morris, Crow, and Koehler/Phelps would all get more important innings and be fine).

 

Respectfully, stop it. We all like Cishek. Really, we do. But he is a luxury on a bottom 5 payroll team and a legitimate SP is worth significantly more than him to this team right now. If the choice is keep Cishek, or trade him for salary to sign Shields, it's an absolute no brainer. And that's not including they would get a pretty good player for Cishek too.

 

 

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not to mention if Cishek's replacement flopped they've got a half-dozen other guys they can try in the role. Hell if they're still in the running once Jose comes back they could even use someone like Koehler or Phelps. Or acquire someone at the trade deadline.

 

 

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not to mention if Cishek's replacement flopped they've got a half-dozen other guys they can try in the role. Hell if they're still in the running once Jose comes back they could even use someone like Koehler or Phelps. Or acquire someone at the trade deadline.

 

 

How many playoff teams are hosting tryouts for their closer role during the season?

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