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Fangraphs Farm Evaluation


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Yeah the farm is incredibly weak after the trades. I don't remember our farm system being this bad since I started watching the team in 2000. To be fair though the farm wasn't all that strong before the trades either. It just took a bottom 12 minor league system in MLB and turned it into bottom 3.

 

 

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I also see they forgot a couple names I think can turn into top 10 Marlins prospects very soon. Mason Davis, our 19th round pick this past draft, absolutely demolished Batavia in his time there. Yes obviously it's not even Greensboro yet and he's a college player at that, but if you've seen some tapes on him he's got a really smooth swing, can hit from both sides of the plate, and shows above average defense at 2B with an ability to play SS in the future, and has a solid Preston Wilson style ability to steal bases. His college numbers suggest to me that he's a player who has a solid hit tool but a lack of power and a lack of plate discipline. He showed both of those things at Batavia, but obviously it's a decent step up to Greensboro and an even bigger step up to Jupiter after that. Not calling him a top prospect now, but he's got some real five tool raw ability that if mentored properly could make him a threat in the minors.

 

Other guy to follow is Ben Holmes, aka the guy Ben Wetzler from Oregon State, aka that guy who got screwed over by the Phillies. 5th Rounder in 2013, after the f*ck up with the Phillies goes back to school, posts a 12-1 record with an ERA under 1 for the season. He got better and better every season he was at Oregon State. He has your basic fastball/slider/changeup combination that he uses effectively, throwing in the low 90s area.

 

The biggest reason teams were scared of Wetzler were mostly character related stuff. Got suspended five games for drunkenly walking into the wrong house, the agent incident, dumb nitpicky things that can obviously change. When you look at his body of work you could see him being a late first or second round talent but fell to the 9th round. He was pretty good in Batavia in his short time with a 2.92 ERA, and Greensboro will be a big test. He's one of a few college pitchers that we drafted this past year that could really be interesting this year.

 

 

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Usually there's someone that we're all waiting for to make it the big because we think they'll be a star (Stanton, Yelich, Heaney, Fernandez, Hermidia, ect.) but i just don't see it.

 

 

I agree. The problem with Kolek is that he probably has high upside, but he's still very raw and far from being MLB ready.

 

 

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The farm is just terrible. No real high upside besides Kolek maybe. Our position players are as average as they come. We just put a lot of emphasis on stacking the MLB roster so now maybe we can hit the ground running with incoming prospects. It's not like we had a great farm system prior to the trades but as of now we have a terrible farm system. Some few possible bright spots Anderson and maybe Davis as stated above but nothing that pops out at you. We have done a decent job in semi recent years in the draft ie. Stanton, Yellich so maybe there is some hope there. Only one 50+ prospect which is considered average what a shame.

 

 

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The farm is just terrible. No real high upside besides Kolek maybe. Our position players are as average as they come. We just put a lot of emphasis on stacking the MLB roster so now maybe we can hit the ground running with incoming prospects. It's not like we had a great farm system prior to the trades but as of now we have a terrible farm system. Some few possible bright spots Anderson and maybe Davis as stated above but nothing that pops out at you. We have done a decent job in semi recent years in the draft ie. Stanton, Yellich so maybe there is some hope there. Only one 50+ prospect which is considered average what a shame.

 

 

 

It is hard to criticize when Heaney, Moran, Marisnick, Kike, Barnes, and compensatory draft picks turned into basically Cosart, D. Gordon, Morris, Wates, and whatever Haren ends up turning into. Maybe that will be a bad trade in hindsight, but can't deny they view those front 3 as big pieces moving forward. The farm would be perceived much differently if those first 3 were still around.

 

Saying that, if they get a 2/3 SP with Kolek, 4/5 SP with Nicolino and Williams (high floor guys), a starting catcher in Realmuto, a starting 2B from Romero/Twine/Anderson (and Dietrich), and develop half a bullpen of solid relievers from Urena, Conley, Dayton, Caminero, etc., that's a real good compliment to what they have and they'll be fine.

 

I'm not that down on this given the MLB control time of the current MLB team. But they should absolutely invest in some international signing this next calendar year and really need to have a strong draft because if they bomb a year or two of talent acquisition with this very limited depth, it could look scary on the 4-5 year plan.

 

 

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I also see they forgot a couple names I think can turn into top 10 Marlins prospects very soon. Mason Davis, our 19th round pick this past draft, absolutely demolished Batavia in his time there. Yes obviously it's not even Greensboro yet and he's a college player at that, but if you've seen some tapes on him he's got a really smooth swing, can hit from both sides of the plate, and shows above average defense at 2B with an ability to play SS in the future, and has a solid Preston Wilson style ability to steal bases. His college numbers suggest to me that he's a player who has a solid hit tool but a lack of power and a lack of plate discipline. He showed both of those things at Batavia, but obviously it's a decent step up to Greensboro and an even bigger step up to Jupiter after that. Not calling him a top prospect now, but he's got some real five tool raw ability that if mentored properly could make him a threat in the minors.

 

Other guy to follow is Ben Holmes, aka the guy Ben Wetzler from Oregon State, aka that guy who got screwed over by the Phillies. 5th Rounder in 2013, after the f*ck up with the Phillies goes back to school, posts a 12-1 record with an ERA under 1 for the season. He got better and better every season he was at Oregon State. He has your basic fastball/slider/changeup combination that he uses effectively, throwing in the low 90s area.

 

The biggest reason teams were scared of Wetzler were mostly character related stuff. Got suspended five games for drunkenly walking into the wrong house, the agent incident, dumb nitpicky things that can obviously change. When you look at his body of work you could see him being a late first or second round talent but fell to the 9th round. He was pretty good in Batavia in his short time with a 2.92 ERA, and Greensboro will be a big test. He's one of a few college pitchers that we drafted this past year that could really be interesting this year.

 

The 2014 draft was intruiging. The prep players like Casey Soltis, Stone Garrett and all those middle infielders should hopefully spurn something. Plus, I'm hoping Brian Anderson breaks out.

 

 

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The farm is just terrible. No real high upside besides Kolek maybe. Our position players are as average as they come. We just put a lot of emphasis on stacking the MLB roster so now maybe we can hit the ground running with incoming prospects. It's not like we had a great farm system prior to the trades but as of now we have a terrible farm system. Some few possible bright spots Anderson and maybe Davis as stated above but nothing that pops out at you. We have done a decent job in semi recent years in the draft ie. Stanton, Yellich so maybe there is some hope there. Only one 50+ prospect which is considered average what a shame.

 

 

 

It is hard to criticize when Heaney, Moran, Marisnick, Kike, Barnes, and compensatory draft picks turned into basically Cosart, D. Gordon, Morris, Wates, and whatever Haren ends up turning into. Maybe that will be a bad trade in hindsight, but can't deny they view those front 3 as big pieces moving forward. The farm would be perceived much differently if those first 3 were still around.

 

Saying that, if they get a 2/3 SP with Kolek, 4/5 SP with Nicolino and Williams (high floor guys), a starting catcher in Realmuto, a starting 2B from Romero/Twine/Anderson (and Dietrich), and develop half a bullpen of solid relievers from Urena, Conley, Dayton, Caminero, etc., that's a real good compliment to what they have and they'll be fine.

 

I'm not that down on this given the MLB control time of the current MLB team. But they should absolutely invest in some international signing this next calendar year and really need to have a strong draft because if they bomb a year or two of talent acquisition with this very limited depth, it could look scary on the 4-5 year plan.

 

 

 

Wish they were in on Moncada but I get why they aren't. But yes, it's looking very, very bad down there.

 

To make matters worse, they throw away guys like Domingo German for some extra dollars.

 

There is a real possibility nobody emerges as a top 100 prospect out of this farm in 2015, besides Kolek by default.

 

 

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The farm is just terrible. No real high upside besides Kolek maybe. Our position players are as average as they come. We just put a lot of emphasis on stacking the MLB roster so now maybe we can hit the ground running with incoming prospects. It's not like we had a great farm system prior to the trades but as of now we have a terrible farm system. Some few possible bright spots Anderson and maybe Davis as stated above but nothing that pops out at you. We have done a decent job in semi recent years in the draft ie. Stanton, Yellich so maybe there is some hope there. Only one 50+ prospect which is considered average what a shame.

 

 

 

It is hard to criticize when Heaney, Moran, Marisnick, Kike, Barnes, and compensatory draft picks turned into basically Cosart, D. Gordon, Morris, Wates, and whatever Haren ends up turning into. Maybe that will be a bad trade in hindsight, but can't deny they view those front 3 as big pieces moving forward. The farm would be perceived much differently if those first 3 were still around.

 

Saying that, if they get a 2/3 SP with Kolek, 4/5 SP with Nicolino and Williams (high floor guys), a starting catcher in Realmuto, a starting 2B from Romero/Twine/Anderson (and Dietrich), and develop half a bullpen of solid relievers from Urena, Conley, Dayton, Caminero, etc., that's a real good compliment to what they have and they'll be fine.

 

I'm not that down on this given the MLB control time of the current MLB team. But they should absolutely invest in some international signing this next calendar year and really need to have a strong draft because if they bomb a year or two of talent acquisition with this very limited depth, it could look scary on the 4-5 year plan.

 

 

 

Not a criticism, you are actually saying the same thing I said. I meant that we got rid of the best pieces in a average farm system which left us with a below average farm but with a more balanced and major league ready team. What we have left in the farm is below average by all standards but we will have an opportunity to build here over the next few seasons. I'm not concerned with 2b situation as you mention that we have so many options here because I feel front office has plans for Gordon to be there for some time. If Gordon can replicate anything similar to what he did last year he is a far better 2b option than anything in the farm. Romero and Dietrich have backup potential on any regular MLB infield and if Anderson or Twine can put it together have the best upside of the 4. I wouldn't be surprised to see Anderson at 3b in the future (plus arm and power potential) and if Twine can make more contact would be a nice option at SS or 2B (he is very very young).

 

 

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The farm is just terrible. No real high upside besides Kolek maybe. Our position players are as average as they come. We just put a lot of emphasis on stacking the MLB roster so now maybe we can hit the ground running with incoming prospects. It's not like we had a great farm system prior to the trades but as of now we have a terrible farm system. Some few possible bright spots Anderson and maybe Davis as stated above but nothing that pops out at you. We have done a decent job in semi recent years in the draft ie. Stanton, Yellich so maybe there is some hope there. Only one 50+ prospect which is considered average what a shame.

 

 

 

It is hard to criticize when Heaney, Moran, Marisnick, Kike, Barnes, and compensatory draft picks turned into basically Cosart, D. Gordon, Morris, Wates, and whatever Haren ends up turning into. Maybe that will be a bad trade in hindsight, but can't deny they view those front 3 as big pieces moving forward. The farm would be perceived much differently if those first 3 were still around.

 

Saying that, if they get a 2/3 SP with Kolek, 4/5 SP with Nicolino and Williams (high floor guys), a starting catcher in Realmuto, a starting 2B from Romero/Twine/Anderson (and Dietrich), and develop half a bullpen of solid relievers from Urena, Conley, Dayton, Caminero, etc., that's a real good compliment to what they have and they'll be fine.

 

I'm not that down on this given the MLB control time of the current MLB team. But they should absolutely invest in some international signing this next calendar year and really need to have a strong draft because if they bomb a year or two of talent acquisition with this very limited depth, it could look scary on the 4-5 year plan.

 

 

 

Not a criticism, you are actually saying the same thing I said. I meant that we got rid of the best pieces in a average farm system which left us with a below average farm but with a more balanced and major league ready team. What we have left in the farm is below average by all standards but we will have an opportunity to build here over the next few seasons. I'm not concerned with 2b situation as you mention that we have so many options here because I feel front office has plans for Gordon to be there for some time. If Gordon can replicate anything similar to what he did last year he is a far better 2b option than anything in the farm. Romero and Dietrich have backup potential on any regular MLB infield and if Anderson or Twine can put it together have the best upside of the 4. I wouldn't be surprised to see Anderson at 3b in the future (plus arm and power potential) and if Twine can make more contact would be a nice option at SS or 2B (he is very very young).

 

 

 

I'm also keeping an eye on Twine. I liked his overall numbers in high school [power and speed wise], so, hopefully he can get things down in the minors. Needs to draw more walks. Only drew 6 in 179 PAs. He also got hit 7 times, maybe he crowds the plate. I'm guessing he'll start in Batavia this coming season.

 

 

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The farm is just terrible. No real high upside besides Kolek maybe. Our position players are as average as they come. We just put a lot of emphasis on stacking the MLB roster so now maybe we can hit the ground running with incoming prospects. It's not like we had a great farm system prior to the trades but as of now we have a terrible farm system. Some few possible bright spots Anderson and maybe Davis as stated above but nothing that pops out at you. We have done a decent job in semi recent years in the draft ie. Stanton, Yellich so maybe there is some hope there. Only one 50+ prospect which is considered average what a shame.

 

 

 

It is hard to criticize when Heaney, Moran, Marisnick, Kike, Barnes, and compensatory draft picks turned into basically Cosart, D. Gordon, Morris, Wates, and whatever Haren ends up turning into. Maybe that will be a bad trade in hindsight, but can't deny they view those front 3 as big pieces moving forward. The farm would be perceived much differently if those first 3 were still around.

 

Saying that, if they get a 2/3 SP with Kolek, 4/5 SP with Nicolino and Williams (high floor guys), a starting catcher in Realmuto, a starting 2B from Romero/Twine/Anderson (and Dietrich), and develop half a bullpen of solid relievers from Urena, Conley, Dayton, Caminero, etc., that's a real good compliment to what they have and they'll be fine.

 

I'm not that down on this given the MLB control time of the current MLB team. But they should absolutely invest in some international signing this next calendar year and really need to have a strong draft because if they bomb a year or two of talent acquisition with this very limited depth, it could look scary on the 4-5 year plan.

 

 

 

Not a criticism, you are actually saying the same thing I said. I meant that we got rid of the best pieces in a average farm system which left us with a below average farm but with a more balanced and major league ready team. What we have left in the farm is below average by all standards but we will have an opportunity to build here over the next few seasons. I'm not concerned with 2b situation as you mention that we have so many options here because I feel front office has plans for Gordon to be there for some time. If Gordon can replicate anything similar to what he did last year he is a far better 2b option than anything in the farm. Romero and Dietrich have backup potential on any regular MLB infield and if Anderson or Twine can put it together have the best upside of the 4. I wouldn't be surprised to see Anderson at 3b in the future (plus arm and power potential) and if Twine can make more contact would be a nice option at SS or 2B (he is very very young).

 

 

 

I'm also keeping an eye on Twine. I liked his overall numbers in high school [power and speed wise], so, hopefully he can get things down in the minors. Needs to draw more walks. Only drew 6 in 179 PAs. He also got hit 7 times, maybe he crowds the plate. I'm guessing he'll start in Batavia this coming season.

 

 

 

They drafted soooo many middle IF's last draft. Twine is a freak but he's arguably the most raw, which is odd considering he was the highest pick of the bunch.

 

Hopefully someone breaks out and we get lucky.

 

 

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The farm is just terrible. No real high upside besides Kolek maybe. Our position players are as average as they come. We just put a lot of emphasis on stacking the MLB roster so now maybe we can hit the ground running with incoming prospects. It's not like we had a great farm system prior to the trades but as of now we have a terrible farm system. Some few possible bright spots Anderson and maybe Davis as stated above but nothing that pops out at you. We have done a decent job in semi recent years in the draft ie. Stanton, Yellich so maybe there is some hope there. Only one 50+ prospect which is considered average what a shame.

 

 

 

 

It is hard to criticize when Heaney, Moran, Marisnick, Kike, Barnes, and compensatory draft picks turned into basically Cosart, D. Gordon, Morris, Wates, and whatever Haren ends up turning into. Maybe that will be a bad trade in hindsight, but can't deny they view those front 3 as big pieces moving forward. The farm would be perceived much differently if those first 3 were still around.

 

Saying that, if they get a 2/3 SP with Kolek, 4/5 SP with Nicolino and Williams (high floor guys), a starting catcher in Realmuto, a starting 2B from Romero/Twine/Anderson (and Dietrich), and develop half a bullpen of solid relievers from Urena, Conley, Dayton, Caminero, etc., that's a real good compliment to what they have and they'll be fine.

 

I'm not that down on this given the MLB control time of the current MLB team. But they should absolutely invest in some international signing this next calendar year and really need to have a strong draft because if they bomb a year or two of talent acquisition with this very limited depth, it could look scary on the 4-5 year plan.

 

Not a criticism, you are actually saying the same thing I said. I meant that we got rid of the best pieces in a average farm system which left us with a below average farm but with a more balanced and major league ready team. What we have left in the farm is below average by all standards but we will have an opportunity to build here over the next few seasons. I'm not concerned with 2b situation as you mention that we have so many options here because I feel front office has plans for Gordon to be there for some time. If Gordon can replicate anything similar to what he did last year he is a far better 2b option than anything in the farm. Romero and Dietrich have backup potential on any regular MLB infield and if Anderson or Twine can put it together have the best upside of the 4. I wouldn't be surprised to see Anderson at 3b in the future (plus arm and power potential) and if Twine can make more contact would be a nice option at SS or 2B (he is very very young).

 

I'm also keeping an eye on Twine. I liked his overall numbers in high school [power and speed wise], so, hopefully he can get things down in the minors. Needs to draw more walks. Only drew 6 in 179 PAs. He also got hit 7 times, maybe he crowds the plate. I'm guessing he'll start in Batavia this coming season.

 

I think the lack of walks is normal right out of high school. Most talented high school hitters get a lot of meatballs and tend to swing (and make contact) often for that reason; most of the opponents just aren't on their level. I remember when my brother had a huge year, what really stood out to me was his 6 walks in 110 plate appearances. What also stood out, though, were the 5 strikeouts. That's a lot of swings almost as much contact... Crazy.

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I don't know why an eventually MLB (or minor league) caliber player would get "a lot of meatballs" in high school. If they're MLB caliber, they are quite a lot better than the high school competition and get intentionally walked or thrown around a lot. I'm sure even guys in the minors with bad walk rates have a super high OBP in high school.

 

This isn't really a good example, but when I saw Rizzo when he played at MSD High he got thrown around a lot because teams knew he was a threat. I'm sure even the bad major league players were thrown around just because there's just that much of a talent disparity between your worst major leaguer and best high schooler.

 

 

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I don't know why an eventually MLB (or minor league) caliber player would get "a lot of meatballs" in high school. If they're MLB caliber, they are quite a lot better than the high school competition and get intentionally walked or thrown around a lot. I'm sure even guys in the minors with bad walk rates have a super high OBP in high school.

 

This isn't really a good example, but when I saw Rizzo when he played at MSD High he got thrown around a lot because teams knew he was a threat. I'm sure even the bad major league players were thrown around just because there's just that much of a talent disparity between your worst major leaguer and best high schooler.

 

 

 

See, that doesn't make much sense to me. Rizzo wasn't even the best hitter on that team until his senior year; Sean Ochinko, David Christensen, and Joey Hage were all bigger threats in that lineup. And none of them really got pitched around. I know this because I saw them all play, a lot, because my brother played with all of them on summer travel teams where it was much more competitive (they were all class of 2006, Rizzo was my class in '07).

 

In high school, at least 6-8 years ago, you were rarely intentionally walked unless it was maybe a district rival that knows you're awesome and is actually smart enough to do it... Reason being there wasn't really tons of social media letting everyone know everything immediately. So a lot of teams didn't really know how good you were until your third or fourth at bat and by then it rarely mattered.

 

Meatballs may have been a bad way to phrase it as well. I didn't mean that pitchers were lobbing it over the plate or anything, I just meant it was common to be facing a team with a guy in the mound who throws 82 with no movement and one off speed pitch, so it wasn't really a challenge. You could get so much to hit that you swung often, and pretty much always put it in fair play.

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Man I forgot we traded Moran. What team is Kolek slotted to play with his year?

 

I haven't been to many grasshoppers game since Yelich and Ozuna were down here. I couldn't name one player on the team at the moment

 

Probably Greensboro to start.

 

 

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