SilverBullet Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 Its official now. What is? That there's more stupid people on this planet than we thought? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
el_gmac Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 :cry-min: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canada-marlin24 Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 Brutal. Simply brutal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rydawg Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 You know, I keep seeing the people on board with this "Fire Sale" calling the people that are against it dumb. Or, saying that we don't see the big picture. That's far from the case. I understand you're argument and I will agree that on paper these moves make sense. However, the game isn't played on paper. Those are real players that we root for and we become emotionally invested in those players. After all we so spend a lot of our home time watching on TV and going to games. We spend our hard earned money on merchandise. The merchandise doesn't just say Marlins. It has a player's number or name attached to it. So yes, there is an emotional attachment to these players. It's not about being smart or dumb, we are just being emotional. Additionally, this is the 4th rebuild and we are tired of this shit. There's always a good reason and a better plan. The reality is that this ownership group is no better than the last group financially speakiing. Neither had or has any business owning an MLB franchise. You believers want me to trust the same ownership group that seriously over paid for this franchise? Trust the group that is still seeking investors to the tune of $250 Million dollars just two months into their tenure? Trust the group the seriously botched the Stanton trade by not asking him where he preferred to go first? With all of that said, you also want me to trust them to renegotiate a new TV deal and sell the naming rights? Trust them to expand their revenue streams? Who are the dumb ones again? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fish20 Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 People can have different opinions without one side having to be dumb. It is a childish argument to go there and I know others have done it too. coming from the guy calling me an idiot because i thought the SF deal was a good deal given the circumstances. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fish20 Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 You know, I keep seeing the people on board with this "Fire Sale" calling the people that are against it dumb. Or, saying that we don't see the big picture. That's far from the case. I understand you're argument and I will agree that on paper these moves make sense. However, the game isn't played on paper. Those are real players that we root for and we become emotionally invested in those players. After all we so spend a lot of our home time watching on TV and going to games. We spend our hard earned money on merchandise. The merchandise doesn't just say Marlins. It has a player's number or name attached to it. So yes, there is an emotional attachment to these players. It's not about being smart or dumb, we are just being emotional. Additionally, this is the 4th rebuild and we are tired of this shit. There's always a good reason and a better plan. The reality is that this ownership group is no better than the last group financially speakiing. Neither had or has any business owning an MLB franchise. You believers want me to trust the same ownership group that seriously over paid for this franchise? Trust the group that is still seeking investors to the tune of $250 Million dollars just two months into their tenure? Trust the group the seriously botched the Stanton trade by not asking him where he preferred to go first? With all of that said, you also want me to trust them to renegotiate a new TV deal and sell the naming rights? Trust them to expand their revenue streams? Who are the dumb ones again? Im not gonna call you dumb, but running anything emotionally is a terrible idea. You might have an emotional connection to those players and they might be a significant part of your life, but they were nowhere near contention and the team is losing money by the millions. Allowing it to continue on the basis of emotion is a bad way to run any business. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rydawg Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 People can have different opinions without one side having to be dumb. It is a childish argument to go there and I know others have done it too. I agree. I was just trying to make the point that the dumb argument could be made with either point of view. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fish20 Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 Well some things warrant it. That's not a case of an opinion, it is just ignorance and it was coupled with a lot of moronic things from you so you earned it. it is quite literally the definition of an opinion. I think the group of prospects is good given the situation is the definition of an opinion. You not thinking it is a good group of prospects is also the definition of an opinion. So are you admitting you have a childish argument? Because this post and the post quoting rydawg cannot both exist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rydawg Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 Im not gonna call you dumb, but running anything emotionally is a terrible idea. You might have an emotional connection to those players and they might be a significant part of your life, but they were nowhere near contention and the team is losing money by the millions. Allowing it to continue on the basis of emotion is a bad way to run any business. Except I don't own the Marlins. I am simply a fan that is tired of broken promises and getting dicked around. I can afford to be emotional. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fish20 Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 Except I don't own the Marlins. I am simply a fan that is tired of broken promises and getting dicked around. I can afford to be emotional. i have no problem with you being emotional. I would never want my team run that way though. You can be emotional and the team can still be doing the right thing by tearing the team down. They arent mutually exclusive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rydawg Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 i have no problem with you being emotional. I would never want my team run that way though. You can be emotional and the team can still be doing the right thing by tearing the team down. They arent mutually exclusive. Well, I also don't trust the people doing the rebuild for the reasons I stated. It's just more of the same from my point of view. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fish20 Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 Well, I also don't trust the people doing the rebuild for the reasons I stated. It's just more of the same from my point of view. i respect your opinion, and it remains to be seen just how deep they go to rebuild or if it is going to be just money cutting, but i think they deserve at least more than 2 moves to prove their intentions. The team as it was constructed last year was both not good nor was it financially sustainable to anybody but a multi multi multi billionaire. Any owner would be doing this. We'll know more about their intentions when we get to the draft next year as well as IFA, and if they dont spend there, you are absolutely right that it will seem ot be more of the same, but they have literally only made i think 3 trades, 1 of which was minor. I just dont think its right to judge their every move thus far as an indictment on their ownership and think that every single move is going to be done for solely monetary reasons. I think you could possibly have a valid point that it is going to be more of the same, but im willing to withhold judgment until we see their plan for the thing that got us into this mess in the first place: refusing to ever spend money in the draft or in IFA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rydawg Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 i respect your opinion, and it remains to be seen just how deep they go to rebuild or if it is going to be just money cutting, but i think they deserve at least more than 2 moves to prove their intentions. The team as it was constructed last year was both not good nor was it financially sustainable to anybody but a multi multi multi billionaire. Any owner would be doing this. We'll know more about their intentions when we get to the draft next year as well as IFA, and if they dont spend there, you are absolutely right that it will seem ot be more of the same, but they have literally only made i think 3 trades, 1 of which was minor. I just dont think its right to judge their every move thus far as an indictment on their ownership and think that every single move is going to be done for solely monetary reasons. I think you could possibly have a valid point that it is going to be more of the same, but im willing to withhold judgment until we see their plan for the thing that got us into this mess in the first place: refusing to ever spend money in the draft or in IFA. My whole argumentis that this group doesn't have the money to do this right. I think that is easy to see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fish20 Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 My whole argumentis that this group doesn't have the money to do this right. I think that is easy to see. they have enough money. Money isnt the problem for a rebuild. Whether we start spending on major free agents is another issue entirely. Also, spending money on IFA and the draft on the front end leads to havign to spend less on mediocre free agents on the back end, and just about every normal franchise has figured this out except Loria, so im confident they will recognize this too. I dont think they have nearly the small amount of money that oyu think they do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erick Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 We would be a lot better off without the free agents we’ve signed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canada-marlin24 Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 We would be a lot better off without the free agents we’ve signed. The deals given to Volquez, Prado, Tazawa, Ziegler, and Chen have now cost us Dee Gordon and Giancarlo Stanton. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fish20 Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 We would be a lot better off without the free agents we’ve signed. and they were only signed because we completely ignored the draft and IFA for years which left crippling holes in the team that were unable to be replaced like normal teams do with cheap cost controlled talent. There is almost never a reason to have to sign relievers like Tazawa and Ziegler to multi year deals for significant money when developing useful relievers is the easiest thing in the sport to do. There should never be a need to sign a guy like Volquez who has had an average at best career to a multi year deal for 10+ million if you are doing the bare amount of spending you should be doing in IFA and the draft. Prado is a nice player, but you never pay a guy like him the way we did for the amount of production he provides. Simply put, it all goes back to Loria foolishly ignoring these critical areas of team building for nearly a decade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erick Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 Exactly. I’ll have a problem with this ownership if they prove to be as dumb as the last one. In addition to sometimes being cheap, being dumb was a bigger problem for Loria and company. Fwiw, the first move this ownership group made (Cooper/Caleb Smith) demonstrated an ability to attain value without giving up much. That was different. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fish20 Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 Exactly. I’ll have a problem with this ownership if they prove to be as dumb as the last one. In addition to sometimes being cheap, being dumb was a bigger problem for Loria and company. Fwiw, the first move this ownership group made (Cooper/Caleb Smith) demonstrated an ability to attain value without giving up much. That was different. yup. It's little things like that combined with the overall big things of spending smartly and efficiently that need to be done. For all the talk of loria being cheap, he went out and signed a bunch of players to big money deals. His problem was that he was a moron with no consistent and coherent plan and the money he did spend was absolutely spent in the most inefficient ways possible. And i think that first move was low key great. I just want to see the front office for the next 3 years consistently churning the roster and organization to add depth and talent in any way possible. I also want to see us get a few players we like in the rule 5 draft. All about acquiring talent in any way possible for the next few years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Punisher Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 Ughhh my life sucks!!! [ATTACH]1672._xfImport[/ATTACH] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DTrain Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 What a great day Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Punisher Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 If our team remained as-is now with Bour and Ozuna as our power hitters, how do we stack up offense wise?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canada-marlin24 Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 Michael Hill: "We couldn't be happier with the talent we were able to get back in this deal." Honestly, if you really think people are that stupid you deserve to have your fucking face bashed in. What a fucking imbecile. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Punisher Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 LoL. I remember that interview Michael Hill had back in 2005, I knew right than and there that he was a retard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
el_gmac Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 Ughhh my life sucks!!! [ATTACH]1672[/ATTACH] Yeah I hear you "Sprint" sucks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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