Italian Marlins Fan Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 http://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/25557502/jt-realmuto-trade-continues-stunningly-sad-marlins-tradition “Of the Marlins' all-time top 25 players, by WAR -- Realmuto ranks 16th -- 23 have now been traded away, rather than held onto until they reached free agency. The other two truly are the exceptions that prove the rule: A.J. Burnett and the Marlins hated each other by the end, but Burnett made it to free agency because the "much-discussed" deal to send him to Baltimore "hit a snag" when the Marlins kept trying to throw more of their players into the swap. The other, Jose Fernandez, died in a boat crash before reaching free agency. The Marlins had tried to trade him too, according to former team president David Samson; it was the other team, Samson claimed recently, that stopped the deal. This is not normal. The Rockies, who debuted as a franchise the same year the Marlins did, have held onto nine of their all-time top 25 through free agency or retirement, and an additional four of those 25 are still on their roster. The expansion Diamondbacks have traded only 14 of their all-time 25, and even the notoriously proactive Rays have kept seven of their all-time top 25 through free agency. The Marlins are genuinely weird. They trade everybody. Every trade tells a story. But these 23 trades together tell three bigger stories. That's the first one: The Marlins are weird, all the time. In their own way they're the most stable franchise in baseball, because their weirdness is a permanent state. Each of these trades, on its own, could be justified for baseball or financial reasons, but none of these trades any longer stands on its own. They're all part of the ongoing story of the Marlins: Whoever owns them, whoever runs them, becomes, by definition, Florida Man.” Do you agree or disagree? I will die a Marlins fan. But good God ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pollythewog Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 really really bad article with a stupid premise. nice charts tho Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Italian Marlins Fan Posted February 8, 2019 Author Share Posted February 8, 2019 really really bad article with a stupid premise. nice charts tho Why do you think it’s a bad article? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pollythewog Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 Why do you think it’s a bad article? it's just a stupid premise that there is some abstract force that is behind this. There's no point to the article. For instance: Beckett and Lowell were traded for Hanley Castillo spent 10+ years with the fish and made majority of his $ as marlin Uggla was rule 5 and absolutely horrible after the trade Since being traded, Nolasco has been worth 5 WAR (after 18 with the fish) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pollythewog Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 If anything, I'd say the article makes the case with it's numbers that the marlins have done pretty well trading these players Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 Yeah, it's stupid. It's an article just to pile on the fish for the sake of piling on, and I'm sad I clicked on the link. Yes, all these trades have happened, for different stated reasons, but they do completely ignore the realities of the latest rebuild and the larger reasons for it. --- If the Marlins didn't have a history of trading players/firesales, articles would've been written in the same light as the Cubs and Astros rebuilds. It's only because it's the Marlins, it's easy to pile on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pollythewog Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 Yeah, it's stupid. It's an article just to pile on the fish for the sake of piling on, and I'm sad I clicked on the link. Yes, all these trades have happened, for different stated reasons, but they do completely ignore the realities of the latest rebuild and the larger reasons for it. the evidence to back up his case (the 25 top WAR players traded) is pure arbitrary and also extremely shoddy. I can keep going down the list (yeluch and cabrera trades obvs terrible) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverBullet Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 It's dwelling on the past and stirring what's in the pot to get clicks. It's lazy writing. It's also slapping the Marlins on the wrist for trading Realmuto as if they're not allowed to trade anyone ever again because of their past trading history. It's like saying someone can't have dinner tonight because they ate dinner yesterday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Italian Marlins Fan Posted February 8, 2019 Author Share Posted February 8, 2019 It's dwelling on the past and stirring what's in the pot to get clicks. It's lazy writing. It's also slapping the Marlins on the wrist for trading Realmuto as if they're not allowed to trade anyone ever again because of their past trading history. It's like saying someone can't have dinner tonight because they ate dinner yesterday. So you don’t think the article has any validity to it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pollythewog Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 So you don’t think the article has any validity to it? I do not. It's flim flam at best. I do really like the charts though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Italian Marlins Fan Posted February 8, 2019 Author Share Posted February 8, 2019 I do not. It's flim flam at best. I do really like the charts though The charts are ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 "Stunningly sad Marlins tradition." How can a TRADITION be "stunning" in any way, shape, or form? Maybe at first for people just being introduced to it, but for those who have seen it time and time again, how can it be a surprise in any form? Silly title. And y'all have dissected the article enough already so I'll leave that be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverBullet Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 So you don’t think the article has any validity to it? The factual stuff yes, like obviously we have traded a shit load of players. The excuses and reasons? Who cares? It's not like Jeter traded all the guys before he got here. I'd rather read an article about what the Marlins are doing now and next instead of another lazy piece telling us what we already know. This article is the journalistic equivalent of beating a dead horse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Italian Marlins Fan Posted February 9, 2019 Author Share Posted February 9, 2019 The factual stuff yes, like obviously we have traded a shit load of players. The excuses and reasons? Who cares? It's not like Jeter traded all the guys before he got here. I'd rather read an article about what the Marlins are doing now and next instead of another lazy piece telling us what we already know. This article is the journalistic equivalent of beating a dead horse. I got you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
legacyofCangelosi Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 I know a lot of people make this argument on here but we really are way too early on the yelich trade to say it’s a bust. Cabrera definitely was a bust. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverBullet Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 How come nobody talks about the Phelps and Gordon trades? Those were excellent! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 How come nobody talks about the Phelps and Gordon trades? Those were excellent! Goes against the narrative. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverBullet Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 Goes against the narrative. Oh yea sorry my bad... The Phelps and Gordon trades were the worst... Jeter is a fraud. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricWiener Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 This just in, the Marlins have a history of trading Talent. In related news, sky, blue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 This just in, the Marlins have a history of trading Talent. In related news, sky, blue. Yeah and we can't know if that will continue longterm with this regime or not. What previous regimes did, doesn't mean anything. The current rebuild was necessary, but we need to see if they continue to build things, add players and retain stars going forward. That is going to tell us if they are different or more of the same. So far, they've done a good job in the draft and international market so there are promising signs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hovertical Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 Yeah, it's definitely old news but it's still semi-relevant and makes a point that the new group didn't try anything different other than dump the bulk of the players to save money - and it was a dump, when Gordon, Yelich, Stanton, Ozuna are traded away and you don't get a single top 100 pick back from all of that? yeah, that's about as big of a dump as possible just to save money. They had a few other options such as keeping a couple of those guys on the team (since none of them were part of the same trade package) and invested in the International draft, they also could have agreed to at least take on some of the contracts in order to net better prospects and hasten the whole rebuild. A year+ later and they finally have a single top 100 prospect after adding Realmuto to that list of dudes that were sent packing. So yeah, the article ain't nothing new, but neither have are the results really, so I feel it's pretty fair at this point. But anyhoo, JT was the last name left on the team. Hopefully they manage to strike gold along the way and absolutely nail a couple drafts and luck out with their picks really shining. At least Sixto is a cool name. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 Weren't Alcantara and Brinson in the top 100, at least? They've come up to the Majors, so I mean. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverBullet Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 Weren't Alcantara and Brinson in the top 100, at least? They've come up to the Majors, so I mean. I checked Fangraphs Top 100 Feb 2018 and Brinson Harrison Guzman and Diaz were all on the list at the time. Yes they've fallen off but when the trades happened they did get Top 100 guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 I checked Fangraphs Top 100 Feb 2018 and Brinson Harrison Guzman and Diaz were all on the list at the time. Yes they've fallen off but when the trades happened they did get Top 100 guys. That's what I thought. Harrison, Guzman, and Diaz could work their way back on. It's not like we have guys that aren't even in like the top 250 or so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
legacyofCangelosi Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 It’s odd that guzman and Diaz dropped out of the top 100. I mean guzman was shaky but Diaz was ok. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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