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Marlins, Hill Parting Ways


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we'll never really know how good/bad Hill really is all things considered....things changed under Jeter but again, he never had full control apparently so his tenure and ultimately, his ability to broker trades, will kinda be a mystery until he goes elsewhere I guess (assuming he gets full authority in his next stop).  Seemed like a super nice guy though and he certainly did a lot better once Loria was gone.

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Just now, hovertical said:

we'll never really know how good/bad Hill really is all things considered....things changed under Jeter but again, he never had full control apparently so his tenure and ultimately, his ability to broker trades, will kinda be a mystery until he goes elsewhere I guess (assuming he gets full authority in his next stop).  Seemed like a super nice guy though and he certainly did a lot better once Loria was gone.

I think this is overstated. Yes in Loria's tenure he had no control, but it sounds like in Jeter's everything was done as a committee. He had say, he just didn't have final say. I am sure everyone had something to bring to the table, and the decisions were nuanced.

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Well that's a shocker coming off the season we just went through.  Ultimately they prob wanted *their own guy* in place.   Hill may have seen the writing on the wall too and felt it best to move on. 

So many ups and downs in Hill's time here, tough to say whether he was in the end a success or failure, when you have a ring during your tenure that's something you can't take away.  And he certainly was constrained by Loria's budget and/or meddling. 

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As a fan, we would never know what happened behind the scenes, we just don't know who have the final say to the decisions in the past three years, but as a fan, we just hope the team would keep making the good and smart decisions no matter who has the final say to it. 

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So when Loria left the story became "Hill never got to do his job without a meddling owner" and now that he went three years looking like an amazing GM we thought "see how good Hill is when he's left to do his job?" Now he leaves and the story suddenly becomes "well Hill was never really in charge under Jeter anyways". 

So what the hell is the real story? 

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2 minutes ago, SilverBullet said:

So when Loria left the story became "Hill never got to do his job without a meddling owner" and now that he went three years looking like an amazing GM we thought "see how good Hill is when he's left to do his job?" Now he leaves and the story suddenly becomes "well Hill was never really in charge under Jeter anyways". 

So what the hell is the real story? 

Well if we believe that report, it would mean Hill never did anything but give input. It would mean Loria was a terrible decision maker and Jeter has been a better one.

Impossible to know the real story.

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What I've read makes me think that Mike Hill had a bigger say in not returning than Jeter did. Hill earned himself the chance to stay but Jeter wanted to restructure baseball ops department and Hill probably just wasn't comfortable with what his new role would be. If so it's a bit of a shame but it's also understandable. Hill earned himself the right to be the top guy but if he couldn't get that he also has every right to back out and Jeter has every right to organize baseball ops the way he wants.

I do like the idea of Hill hopping over to help fix the Reds organization. That would be cool. Hopefully he gets the chance because there's so many times an executive with a good reputation leaves somewhere but never actually gets picked up elsewhere, like Beinfest. 

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3 minutes ago, SonOfJack said:

Well if we believe that report, it would mean Hill never did anything but give input. It would mean Loria was a terrible decision maker and Jeter has been a better one.

Impossible to know the real story.

We also don't know how much input was taken by each owner. If Jeter allowed Hill more say it's way better than Loria who may have never valued Hill's input over any other front office member. 

Tbh there's nothing wrong with the owner having finally say, it's more about how much trust is given to the GM. "Final say" can also be very different than "overriding everything you suggest". 

If Hill said "We shouldn't trade Luis Castillo for Dan Straily" and Loria says do it anyways that's bad.

But if Hill says "Let's get Sixto for Realmuto" and Jeter says "good idea let's do it" then that's great. 

Both are having final say but doing it very differently. 

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At the end of the day, as a Marlins fan, I thank Mike Hill for his years here and I appreciate his superb work over the last three seasons but my primary concern now is the possibility that a new GM/president of baseball ops comes in from outside the organization and screws up all the great things done over the last three seasons.

Though at first glance it sounds like this front office has been working in more of a group setting so a new guy would like just be one member of the team and wouldn't necessarily even have the chance to mess everything up.

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Fans and media can speculate over a "big name" executive like Epstein or Dombrowski coming to Miami but I don't see it because this organization isn't in a position to hand over the reigns to someone who will want full control.

The organization is more on the right track than ever so they'll probably reshuffle from within.

We can even make a joke about this team having depth in the front office like they do on the fields. Mike Hill can depart and there's enough good executives to take over from within. 

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3 minutes ago, SilverBullet said:

Fans and media can speculate over a "big name" executive like Epstein or Dombrowski coming to Miami but I don't see it because this organization isn't in a position to hand over the reigns to someone who will want full control.

The organization is more on the right track than ever so they'll probably reshuffle from within.

We can even make a joke about this team having depth in the front office like they do on the fields. Mike Hill can depart and there's enough good executives to take over from within. 

I fully agree with you. I don't for a second believe Epstein or Dombrowski are going to be in the mix for the job, despite mentioning them earlier. They would for sure want total control along with a hefty salary.

In addition, Epstein likes to build things from the ground up. This rebuild is already a few years in.

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8 minutes ago, SilverBullet said:

At the end of the day, as a Marlins fan, I thank Mike Hill for his years here and I appreciate his superb work over the last three seasons but my primary concern now is the possibility that a new GM/president of baseball ops comes in from outside the organization and screws up all the great things done over the last three seasons.

Though at first glance it sounds like this front office has been working in more of a group setting so a new guy would like just be one member of the team and wouldn't necessarily even have the chance to mess everything up.

Just trust in Jeter. 

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But yes as Jack said earlier Jeter has to figure this shit out like ASAP, can't waste offseason time worrying about the roles in baseball ops. Settle this before the World Series ends because there's work to do. 

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