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Jacob Nottingham


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On 4/24/2021 at 9:39 AM, Photo-Realistic Billy said:

Y'all know it's easier to just write, "I don't understand them, and I fear what I don't understand."

Just because someone doesn't see the value in an advanced metric doesn't mean they don't understand it or "fear it", whatever that means.

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58 minutes ago, Rydawg said:

Just because someone doesn't see the value in an advanced metric doesn't mean they don't understand it or "fear it", whatever that means.

Yeah, I'm going to have to agree with this. I am a huge proponent of advanced metrics and use a lot of them in my analysis. I don't see the value of something like pitcher wins. At all. It's one of the worst stats in sports. But if someone else sees value in a pitcher win? That doesn't mean I am afraid of it, nor that I don't understand it. Now, if it's something like "batting average is the ONLY way to gauge a batter's effectiveness" then yeah I'm going to open my asshole and shit on you.

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6 hours ago, SongInTheAir said:

Yeah, I'm going to have to agree with this. I am a huge proponent of advanced metrics and use a lot of them in my analysis. I don't see the value of something like pitcher wins. At all. It's one of the worst stats in sports. But if someone else sees value in a pitcher win? That doesn't mean I am afraid of it, nor that I don't understand it. Now, if it's something like "batting average is the ONLY way to gauge a batter's effectiveness" then yeah I'm going to open my asshole and shit on you.

Wins are great, because it means the team wins when that pitcher is on the mound.

 

BUT as you point out, it doesn't necessarily mean anything - look at Sandy - if a particular pitcher never gets run support, he could pitch a great game and give up just a run or two and get a loss despite pitching well.

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17 hours ago, rmc523 said:

Wins are great, because it means the team wins when that pitcher is on the mound.

 

BUT as you point out, it doesn't necessarily mean anything - look at Sandy - if a particular pitcher never gets run support, he could pitch a great game and give up just a run or two and get a loss despite pitching well.

But so much of that is outside of the pitcher's control. A statistic that allows for a pitcher to give up 20 runs (and his team scores 21) to get a win but not a pitcher who throws nine innings of perfect baseball (but his team never scores) is not a good statistic. A "pitcher" win is much more reliant on the team's offense and defense (and oftentimes the bullpen). I like the Quality Start stat a lot more because, even though it's flawed in its own right, it's more about what the pitcher actually did. Did the starter throw 6 innings, give up just a pair of runs, and then his bullpen blew the game for him? Still a QS. Did the starter throw eight no hit innings then give up a walk off homer in the ninth, effectively pitching a one hitter but getting a loss because his team couldn't score? Still a QS. Did a starter allow 7 runs in five innings but all of a sudden his team blows up for 8 runs in the bottom of the fifth and the bullpen holds that lead? He gets a win. Not a QS. 

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11 minutes ago, SongInTheAir said:

But so much of that is outside of the pitcher's control. A statistic that allows for a pitcher to give up 20 runs (and his team scores 21) to get a win but not a pitcher who throws nine innings of perfect baseball (but his team never scores) is not a good statistic. A "pitcher" win is much more reliant on the team's offense and defense (and oftentimes the bullpen). I like the Quality Start stat a lot more because, even though it's flawed in its own right, it's more about what the pitcher actually did. Did the starter throw 6 innings, give up just a pair of runs, and then his bullpen blew the game for him? Still a QS. Did the starter throw eight no hit innings then give up a walk off homer in the ninth, effectively pitching a one hitter but getting a loss because his team couldn't score? Still a QS. Did a starter allow 7 runs in five innings but all of a sudden his team blows up for 8 runs in the bottom of the fifth and the bullpen holds that lead? He gets a win. Not a QS. 

 

I'm agreeing with you lol.

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On 4/24/2021 at 8:39 AM, Photo-Realistic Billy said:

Y'all know it's easier to just write, "I don't understand them, and I fear what I don't understand."

No its an idiotic stat that is just for stat heads that is not overly meaningful on an everyday basis. 

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On 4/29/2021 at 12:19 PM, SongInTheAir said:

Yeah, I'm going to have to agree with this. I am a huge proponent of advanced metrics and use a lot of them in my analysis. I don't see the value of something like pitcher wins. At all. It's one of the worst stats in sports. But if someone else sees value in a pitcher win? That doesn't mean I am afraid of it, nor that I don't understand it. Now, if it's something like "batting average is the ONLY way to gauge a batter's effectiveness" then yeah I'm going to open my asshole and shit on you.

Saves/Holds are just as dumb as pitcher wins in the end based on the same line of thinking.

Just a counting stat for those that care. 

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1 hour ago, Das Texan said:

Saves/Holds are just as dumb as pitcher wins in the end based on the same line of thinking.

Just a counting stat for those that care. 

Meh, at least saves and holds are more specific and have limits. Although I don't think a three run lead in the ninth against the Marlins Sunday lineup should count the same as a one run game against a Major League Baseball team.

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