I'm looking for someone to explain to me why everyone wants Tony Pena as a manager.

 

Is he young? Yes. Let's examine what he's done.

 

In 2002 he went 49-77 after taking over the team. In 2003 the team went 83-79, shocking just about everyone in the world. Last year, they went 58-104, and this year, before he resigned, they were 8-25.

 

What does this mean? It means that either 2003 was a complete fluke, or he managed well in 2003 and for some reason couldn't after that. Either way, those are not desirable qualities.

 

If you are so dead set on having a young Latin manager, then bring in Fredi Gonzalez. He knows some of the players and always seemed to fit in in Florida, not to mention he's had to have picked something up from Bobby these last three years.

 

But ideally, in my opinion, Ken Macha is the man this team needs, and you need to look no farther back than this season with the A's.

 

But we will anyway.

 

After Art Howe left Macha rode the A's to a 96-66 record, a first place finish. The leading batting average on this team? Eric Chavez, .282. Miguel Tejada, .278, was next. Their full lines: .282/29/101, .278/27/106. No one had more than 10 stolen bases.

 

Their pitching was a different story, of course. Keith Foulke had 43 saves and a 2.08 ERA and their top four starters had ERAs of 2.70, 3.13, 3.30, and 4.34, with records of 16-7, 14-12, 15-9, and 12-10, respectively.

 

In 2004 the team went 91-71, finishing second but not making the playoffs. Would you believe me when I tell you that on a team that won 91 games, the two leading hitters were Erubiel Durazo and Mark Kotsay? No one hit more than 29 homers or drove in more than 88 runs, but they did have 5 players with 20 or more homers and another two that had 15. Their pitching was mediocre: 4.43, 4.48, 4.71, 3.99, and 3.53, with records of 17-8, 11-11, 11-12, 11-7, and 12-6. Mark Mulder started only 27 games.

 

 

And then there was this year. Their "disappointing season," as claimed after the closer by ESPN.com, finished at 88-74. The team opened with a 17-32 record and went 71-42 for the last 5 months. Five starters finished with 10 wins. Their records were 12-12, 14-12, 14-13, 10-9, and 10-5, with ERAs of 3.53, 3.73, 3.86, 4.17, and 2.53. Rich Harden (10-5, 2.53) only started 19 games due to injury. Their closer was a rookie who saved 23 games. Their catcher hit NO home runs in 601 ABs, batting .271. Their best hitter, Eric Chavez, hit .269 with a .329 OBP (after a .397 one in 04) with 27 homers and 101 RBI. Nick Swisher hit 21 homers, but he hit .236 along with it.

 

But Macha made it work. Despite the injuries to their top hitter from the previous season, Erubiel Durazo, multiple injuries to their star young shortstop Bobby Crosby, and injuries to arguably their best pitcher in Rich Harden, Macha made it work. Imagine what he could have done with a team where four regulars batted over .300, a leadoff hitter had 57 steals, two hitters had 33 homers and 115 and 116 RBI, and had injuries to a shortstop who hit .264 whose replacement actually ended up with the fourth most home runs on the team, a catcher who hit .283 (but actually had 6 home runs), and all this DESPITE a big name player hitting .236 with 8 home runs. Not to mention a reliever with 40 saves and an ERA under 2 until the last game, a starter with 22 wins and a Cy Young candidate, two other pitchers with 3.38 and 3.44 ERAs, a rookie starter with a 4.03 ERA, and all THAT despite injuries to the opening day closer and set up man, AND a number three starter who pitched in 17 games with an ERA of 6.64.

 

Look at any of the three of those A's teams and tell me the Marlins team of 2005 wasn't better on paper. Macha year after year took players who were not big name stars and turned them into a 90-win ballclub. There's no reason he couldn't do the same here. He's 55 years old, so he's not "old," and he isn't of the same school as McKeon. He'll cost a little over a million...big deal. He'll cost a few thousand more than Pena would. So I ask you...why not Macha?

I like Macha alot for the job. Fredi intriques me. Lou would make me happy too. But, I dont want Pena. :shrug

The Sun-Sentinel's observation this morning dovetails with mine that Macha and Pinella may not be serious candidates (in the eyes of the Marlins FO) solely based on their cost.

 

Any of the mentioned rookie manager candidates could be had for 30% or less of what the more seasoned managers would cost, which is a factor that can't be ignored.

The Sun-Sentinel's observation this morning dovetails with mine that Macha and Pinella may not be serious candidates (in the eyes of the Marlins FO) solely based on their cost.

 

Any of the mentioned rookie manager candidates could be had for 30% or less of what the more seasoned managers would cost, which is a factor that can't be ignored.

 

 

It can be when you're getting rid of most of your coaches and likely replacing them with lesser names, when you could possibly trade an overpaid, non-producing third baseman, and when 30% only equals about 300 grand, less than the lowest MLB contract.

The Sun-Sentinel's observation this morning dovetails with mine that Macha and Pinella may not be serious candidates (in the eyes of the Marlins FO) solely based on their cost.

 

Any of the mentioned rookie manager candidates could be had for 30% or less of what the more seasoned managers would cost, which is a factor that can't be ignored.

 

 

 

 

I hope the Marlins aren't foolish and do not sign a top manager to save a couple of bucks, we are probably talking about 500-800K difference. Not saying Macha and Pinella are the best candidates.

 

The influence of a manager is not to be undermined, especially with this group of players

You make a strong argument for Mancha. I am torn between Mancha, Girardi, and Gonzalez.

Give me Pena!

I'm looking for someone to explain to me why everyone wants Tony Pena as a manager.

 

Is he young? Yes. Let's examine what he's done.

 

In 2002 he went 49-77 after taking over the team. In 2003 the team went 83-79, shocking just about everyone in the world. Last year, they went 58-104, and this year, before he resigned, they were 8-25.

 

What does this mean? It means that either 2003 was a complete fluke, or he managed well in 2003 and for some reason couldn't after that. Either way, those are not desirable qualities.

 

If you are so dead set on having a young Latin manager, then bring in Fredi Gonzalez. He knows some of the players and always seemed to fit in in Florida, not to mention he's had to have picked something up from Bobby these last three years.

 

But ideally, in my opinion, Ken Macha is the man this team needs, and you need to look no farther back than this season with the A's.

 

But we will anyway.

 

After Art Howe left Macha rode the A's to a 96-66 record, a first place finish. The leading batting average on this team? Eric Chavez, .282. Miguel Tejada, .278, was next. Their full lines: .282/29/101, .278/27/106. No one had more than 10 stolen bases.

 

Their pitching was a different story, of course. Keith Foulke had 43 saves and a 2.08 ERA and their top four starters had ERAs of 2.70, 3.13, 3.30, and 4.34, with records of 16-7, 14-12, 15-9, and 12-10, respectively.

 

In 2004 the team went 91-71, finishing second but not making the playoffs. Would you believe me when I tell you that on a team that won 91 games, the two leading hitters were Erubiel Durazo and Mark Kotsay? No one hit more than 29 homers or drove in more than 88 runs, but they did have 5 players with 20 or more homers and another two that had 15. Their pitching was mediocre: 4.43, 4.48, 4.71, 3.99, and 3.53, with records of 17-8, 11-11, 11-12, 11-7, and 12-6. Mark Mulder started only 27 games.

 

 

And then there was this year. Their "disappointing season," as claimed after the closer by ESPN.com, finished at 88-74. The team opened with a 17-32 record and went 71-42 for the last 5 months. Five starters finished with 10 wins. Their records were 12-12, 14-12, 14-13, 10-9, and 10-5, with ERAs of 3.53, 3.73, 3.86, 4.17, and 2.53. Rich Harden (10-5, 2.53) only started 19 games due to injury. Their closer was a rookie who saved 23 games. Their catcher hit NO home runs in 601 ABs, batting .271. Their best hitter, Eric Chavez, hit .269 with a .329 OBP (after a .397 one in 04) with 27 homers and 101 RBI. Nick Swisher hit 21 homers, but he hit .236 along with it.

 

But Macha made it work. Despite the injuries to their top hitter from the previous season, Erubiel Durazo, multiple injuries to their star young shortstop Bobby Crosby, and injuries to arguably their best pitcher in Rich Harden, Macha made it work. Imagine what he could have done with a team where four regulars batted over .300, a leadoff hitter had 57 steals, two hitters had 33 homers and 115 and 116 RBI, and had injuries to a shortstop who hit .264 whose replacement actually ended up with the fourth most home runs on the team, a catcher who hit .283 (but actually had 6 home runs), and all this DESPITE a big name player hitting .236 with 8 home runs. Not to mention a reliever with 40 saves and an ERA under 2 until the last game, a starter with 22 wins and a Cy Young candidate, two other pitchers with 3.38 and 3.44 ERAs, a rookie starter with a 4.03 ERA, and all THAT despite injuries to the opening day closer and set up man, AND a number three starter who pitched in 17 games with an ERA of 6.64.

 

Look at any of the three of those A's teams and tell me the Marlins team of 2005 wasn't better on paper. Macha year after year took players who were not big name stars and turned them into a 90-win ballclub. There's no reason he couldn't do the same here. He's 55 years old, so he's not "old," and he isn't of the same school as McKeon. He'll cost a little over a million...big deal. He'll cost a few thousand more than Pena would. So I ask you...why not Macha?

 

 

 

Listen... you want to know the reason Pena could not do anything with the Royals in '04... Let see...

 

1) Carlos Beltran only played in 69 games in '04 and hit 15HRs, 51 RBIs, and a .278 avg...

 

2) Mike Sweeney only played a 106 games....

 

3) Look at their average everyday line up...

 

1B Ken Harvey

2B Tony Graffanino

3B Joe Randa

SS Angel Berroa

LF Dee Brown

CF David DeJesus

RF Abraham Nunez

DH Mike Sweeney

 

SP Darrell May

SP Brian Anderson

SP Jimmy Gobble

SP Zack Greinke

SP Mike Wood

CL Jeremy Affedlt

 

-Only SP that had less than an ERA of 5 was Greinke....

 

not to mention that the player that played the most games was Angel Berroa with 134 games played. The rest of the players averaged 100 games.

 

The reason that Tony Pena quit at the end of the season, was because he knew that the team had absolutely no talent and the team was going no where after trading Beltran....

 

Pena is an excellent coach.... he showed it in '03 winning AL Manager of the Year...

Try coaching at KC and see if you can do any better...

 

I state the rest of my case the posting of TONY PENA - New Marlins Skipper...

You make a strong argument for Mancha. I am torn between Mancha, Girardi, and Gonzalez.

 

Same here, I would be happy if one of these 3 made it.....just don't give the job to Lou.