Read before. I said they have been linked to increased durability and beter eyesight by some studies. Not most though. The only conclusion that has been universally made is its effect in strength training, which any ballplayer will tell you does not help much.

 

This hearing is a joke. You see everyone here in this thread, making judgements against the players. How Raffy didn't take steroids because he came prepared. How McGwire did because of his physical appearance. And so on. The congressmen are making the same judgements. There's little or no intent in fact-finding. They are a bunch of fans, feeling they have been wronged personally and are taking their anger out at the players, Fehr and Selig. It's a sad display. There's not one rational mind in that room. There's not one even attempting to be, save perhaps those being asked the questions.

Read before. I said they have been linked to increased durability and beter eyesight by some studies. Not most though. The only conclusion that has been universally made is its effect in strength training, which any ballplayer will tell you does not help much.

 

This hearing is a joke. You see everyone here in this thread, making judgements against the players. How Raffy didn't take steroids because he came prepared. How McGwire did because of his physical appearance. And so on. The congressmen are making the same judgements. There's little or no intent in fact-finding. They are a bunch of fans, feeling they have been wronged personally and are taking their anger out at the players, Fehr and Selig. It's a sad display. There's not one rational mind in that room. There's not one even attempting to be, save perhaps those being asked the questions.

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Did you even see any part of the hearings? Because you are coming off kinda dim-witted.

 

The point of these hearings is NOT to catch the players on taking steroids. That is the BALCO hearing. This is to clean up baseball, from highschool on up. And if you are against that, or you don't think there is a problem and your watched the hearing you seriously need more help than anyone I know can offer.

I've watched attently a total of 3 hours. It's been just grilling the players on their suspected use. Their teammates of suspected use. Fehr and Selig for the testing process. Everyone's opinion of the testing process. Early they totted in selected doctors and experts to tell them what they wanted to hear. The one thing I'd hardly say was covered was how to stop children from using. There was the sad testimony of the Garibaldis, and condolensces from all. Very little ideas on how to stop use by children. No where near the grilling. Just a bunch of fans purporting to be congressmen expressing their frustrations.

Chris Matthews: Mr. Lasorda you said a few years ago that balls that would be caught at the warning track years before are now ending up in the seats. Why is that?

 

Lasorda: Because they are being hit further.

 

 

Pwned!

Read before. I said they have been linked to increased durability and beter eyesight by some studies. Not most though. The only conclusion that has been universally made is its effect in strength training, which any ballplayer will tell you does not help much.

 

This hearing is a joke. You see everyone here in this thread, making judgements against the players. How Raffy didn't take steroids because he came prepared. How McGwire did because of his physical appearance. And so on. The congressmen are making the same judgements. There's little or no intent in fact-finding. They are a bunch of fans, feeling they have been wronged personally and are taking their anger out at the players, Fehr and Selig. It's a sad display. There's not one rational mind in that room. There's not one even attempting to be, save perhaps those being asked the questions.

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Actually, the hearing was quite comical. I have been an avid watcher of C-Span for over 20 years. It was so comforting to see MLB do to the congressman what the Congress has been doing to us!

The one question that wasn't asked AND was very obvious was...to Donald Fehr....HOW could half the teams have ratified the new policy when it isn't even complete yet? That idiot (can't think of his name) who wrote the policy said they were still making changes. That means that MLB and Bud Selig have been lying to the Congress. There is no policy set in stone as yet and they just plain lied. MLB doesn't care if these guys use steriods. They only care that people fill the seats. They knew....come on...of course they knew. WE knew. Just look at some of these guys...even Barry Bonds' neck shrunk last year. AND Mark McGuire..for goodness sake...he probably weighs 1/3 what he was weighed when he broke the record. I am not sure about Sosa. He looks the same to me but how would we know...he always wears a lot of undergarments!!

Once again...my main question is...how did some of these teams ratify something that is not finished? It was and is all show...no substance!! 5 times and you're out...what a joke! The Congress is going to have to pass legislation and take all drug testing OUT of collective bargaining. This should have been done years ago to protect all work places.

Bud Selig needs to be fired. They only honest person on that last panel was Kevin Towers, the GM for the Padres.

I have a question. If steroids "don't help" players perform better on the field, why do they take them? They take them for a reason, no? I kind of think that "performance enhancing" drugs enhance performance. Give me a break with all this juiced ball, smaller parks, and bad pitching excuse. I just hope the players and owners are in bed like this the next time the CBA expires.

I have a question. If steroids "don't help" players perform better on the field, why do they take them? They take them for a reason, no? I kind of think that "performance enhancing" drugs enhance performance. Give me a break with all this juiced ball, smaller parks, and bad pitching excuse. I just hope the players and owners are in bed like this the next time the CBA expires.

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I honestly believe that the reason the players take anything is not so much to enhance their performance on the field. Steroids don't help your hand eye coordination. They don't help you distinguish a slider vs a fastball... The reason I believe they take them is to allow their bodies to heal quicker from injuries, to allow their bodies to adjust to playing 162 games a year, etc... If steroids helped a professional baseball player hit homeruns, guys like Jeremy Giambi, Marvin Benard, Armando Rios, Manny Alexander, etc.. would all be All-Stars. And they are far from it.

I have a question. If steroids "don't help" players perform better on the field, why do they take them? They take them for a reason, no? I kind of think that "performance enhancing" drugs enhance performance. Give me a break with all this juiced ball, smaller parks, and bad pitching excuse. I just hope the players and owners are in bed like this the next time the CBA expires.

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I honestly believe that the reason the players take anything is not so much to enhance their performance on the field. Steroids don't help your hand eye coordination. They don't help you distinguish a slider vs a fastball... The reason I believe they take them is to allow their bodies to heal quicker from injuries, to allow their bodies to adjust to playing 162 games a year, etc... If steroids helped a professional baseball player hit homeruns, guys like Jeremy Giambi, Marvin Benard, Armando Rios, Manny Alexander, etc.. would all be All-Stars. And they are far from it.

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Steroids help you become stronger. They don't make you stronger. If a Barry Bonds or Sammy Sosa didn't use steroids and being as they are both old guys, they wouldn't be as strong and in as good physical shape. Bonds still hit like .350 but the stronger you are the harder you can swing, the more homeruns.

The thing that pisses me off most about steroids is this. Some guys, like Manny Alexander, Armando Rios, and Jeremy Giambi take them because well they want to become better players. While these guys are cheaters and just as much scum as all the others, you can see their logic to a degree.

 

BUT WHY WOULD MARK MCGWIRE AND BARRY BONDS TAKE STEROIDS?? These guys were STUDS as young players, when they weren't steroid juiced cheating monsters!! They didn't NEED steroids, they were great players as it is. I mean, IMHO these guys would have both been hall of fame players without roids, but no, they cheat and take roids, and as a result, they both have 70+ HR seasons and make some numbers look better. I mean yeah, if you go from 170 to 240 pounds and call it "hard work" people know your full of s***!

 

I dunno, just my opinion.

I had the chance of looking at the player?s testimony

 

My recap:

McGwire - looked really bad out there. between his tears and "I'm not here to talk about the pasts"

 

Sosa - looked lost and scared, didn't say much.

 

Canseco - looked articulated and the most honest. However was caught in a couple of major contradictions between his opening statement and the book. He is the winner in all of this, since he should be feeling vindicated with the congress stepping in due to the book controversy. He is back in the spot light.

 

Schilling - acted like a damn politician. Accused himself of exaggerating the situation before.

 

Palmeiro - seemed sincere most of the time, but as the others gave politically correct answers.

 

MLB directors - all looked like crap, and they were hammered hard by congress. Bud Selig should resign and demonstrated that he is not capable of solving the issue.

I had the chance of looking at the player?s testimony

 

My recap:

McGwire - looked really bad out there. between his tears and "I'm not here to talk about the pasts"

 

Sosa - looked lost and scared, didn't say much.

 

Canseco - looked articulated and the most honest. However was caught in a couple of major contradictions between his opening statement and the book. He is the winner in all of this, since he should be feeling vindicated with the congress stepping in due to the book controversy. He is back in the spot light.

 

Schilling - acted like a damn politician. Accused himself of exaggerating the situation before.

 

Palmeiro - seemed sincere most of the time, but as the others gave politically correct answers.

 

MLB directors - all looked like crap, and they were hammered hard by congress. Bud Selig should resign and demonstrated that he is not capable of solving the issue.

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Couldn't have said it better myself.

The thing that pisses me off most about steroids is this. Some guys, like Manny Alexander, Armando Rios, and Jeremy Giambi take them because well they want to become better players. While these guys are cheaters and just as much scum as all the others, you can see their logic to a degree.

 

BUT WHY WOULD MARK MCGWIRE AND BARRY BONDS TAKE STEROIDS?? These guys were STUDS as young players, when they weren't steroid juiced cheating monsters!! They didn't NEED steroids, they were great players as it is. I mean, IMHO these guys would have both been hall of fame players without roids, but no, they cheat and take roids, and as a result, they both have 70+ HR seasons and make some numbers look better. I mean yeah, if you go from 170 to 240 pounds and call it "hard work" people know your full of s***!

 

I dunno, just my opinion.

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My sentiments exactly. There's no point in great players like Bonds and McGwire taking steroids just to inflate their numbers and enhance their status as legends.

The thing that pisses me off most about steroids is this.? Some guys, like Manny Alexander, Armando Rios, and Jeremy Giambi take them because well they want to become better players.? While these guys are cheaters and just as much scum as all the others, you can see their logic to a degree.

 

BUT WHY WOULD MARK MCGWIRE AND BARRY BONDS TAKE STEROIDS??? These guys were STUDS as young players, when they weren't steroid juiced cheating monsters!!? They didn't NEED steroids, they were great players as it is.? I mean, IMHO these guys would have both been hall of fame players without roids, but no, they cheat and take roids, and as a result, they both have 70+ HR seasons and make some numbers look better.? I mean yeah, if you go from 170 to 240 pounds and call it "hard work" people know your full of s***!

 

I dunno, just my opinion.

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My sentiments exactly. There's no point in great players like Bonds and McGwire taking steroids just to inflate their numbers and enhance their status as legends.

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I will say this; if it were ever proven that Bonds and McGwire took steroids for the simple intention of inflating their numbers, I'm right there with you.

 

I don't know what McGwire has or has not taken. The only thing we know about Bonds is that he used some cream (THG??) on his legs... Having said that, what I truly believe is that anything they may have taken was for the sole purpose of allowing them to heal quicker and allowing them to deal with the daily grind of being a Major League Baseball player. Mac and Bonds were already putting up Hall of Fame numbers. I just can't see them taking anything to enhance their performance. Do I think it's right? No... But it does make it a little easier to swallow, if in fact, all they were trying to do was prolong their careers and/or heal from injuries quicker.

One thing that is upsetting about Schilling testimony.

 

This guy for years have claimed and whined that steroid used was rampant on baseball. Even on print on the SI article.

 

Now he goes with this garbage of "I over exagerated the issue", "I think 1% of players use this stuff, if that ", "I never seen a syringe in . . . ."

 

I lost a lot of respect for Curt for pulling this politician crap.

I had the chance of looking at the player?s testimony

 

My recap:

McGwire - looked really bad out there. between his tears and "I'm not here to talk about the pasts"

 

Sosa - looked lost and scared, didn't say much.

 

Canseco - looked articulated and the most honest. However was caught in a couple of major contradictions between his opening statement and the book. He is the winner in all of this, since he should be feeling vindicated with the congress stepping in due to the book controversy. He is back in the spot light.

 

Schilling - acted like a damn politician.? Accused himself of exaggerating the situation before.

 

Palmeiro - seemed sincere most of the time,? but as the others gave politically correct answers.

 

MLB directors - all looked like crap, and they were hammered hard by congress. Bud Selig should resign and demonstrated that he is not capable of solving the issue.

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perfect i agree with you 100%....congress basically called him weak and in other words told him to quit cause he doesnt have the balls to stand up to the players union....congress hit it right on the head when they said the 5 strike proposal is a major joke...

Why do players take steroids? The players feel it gives them an extra edge. The jury is out on its full effects IMO, but the confidence effect can't be ignored.

 

 

 

I'd say Canseco and Schilling came out looking the worse. Schilling was sticking up for the union, which is amiable considering there's some serious privacy issues regarding a stricter testing process. Canseco came off as a big jerk. He was too busy pointing fingers and complaining about being supposedly blacklisted to offer anything to the hearing. I don't want to make any judgements on Palmeiro or any one else's sincerity, but he did supply some of the more interesting and productive testimony. McGwire was in a tough spot. He has another court case to worry about. He's an ex-ballplayer, loyal to the union, didn't want to take a stand for or against jeopardizing the union's right to negotiate.

Congressman: Take McGwire's name off highway

By JIM SALTER, Associated Press Writer

March 18, 2005

 

ST. LOUIS (AP) -- A St. Louis congressman wants Mark McGwire's name stripped off the stretch of highway that was named after Big Mac following his 70-homer season in 1998.

 

``It would take an act by the state legislature, but I don't think he deserves a name on the highway if he can't be forthcoming about his involvement with this issue,'' U.S. Rep. William Lacy Clay, a Missouri Democrat, told The Associated Press on Friday.

 

McGwire refused to tell the House Government Reform Committee on Thursday whether he had used steroids. Clay is a member of that panel.

 

Gov. Mel Carnahan signed legislation in 1999 officially naming a five-mile stretch of Interstate-70, from the city's western edge to the Illinois border, ``Mark McGwire Highway.''

 

The chairman of the state Senate Transportation Committee said McGwire's name will remain, as far as he's concerned.

 

``Mark McGwire was a hero of baseball in St. Louis,'' state Sen. Jon Dolan said. ``He remains so and must deal with the choices he's made. But nothing he did would change my mind about what we do or don't name highways.''

 

Sammy Sosa, Rafael Palmeiro and Frank Thomas told the committee Thursday they did not use illegal steroids. McGwire has previously denied steroid use, but under oath repeatedly sidestepped questions by saying he wouldn't discuss his past.

 

``It was disappointing because I didn't think he took the opportunity to make clear to his fans and the rest of America that he was not under the influence of steroids when he set those home run records in 1998,'' Clay said. ``He does not come clean. He's not forthcoming. His fans and the public want to know, where do you stand on this, Mark McGwire?''

 

Even Cardinals manager Tony La Russa, who managed McGwire both in Oakland and St. Louis, said he was surprised by McGwire's testimony.

 

``He's made a statement where he's denied it, and I thought it was a great time to make that same statement,'' La Russa said at spring training. ``I think he was kind of coached into saying this one thing, 'I'm here about the future, not about the past.' I was surprised he didn't repeat what he said earlier. I think it would have helped his cause.''

 

This is what I worry about. Want to prosecute a player? Do it accordingly in the law of the land and/or the collective bargaining agreement. Don't do out in the public. The public will just as soon hang him without hearing his defense.

Congressman: Take McGwire's name off highway

By JIM SALTER, Associated Press Writer

March 18, 2005

 

ST. LOUIS (AP) -- A St. Louis congressman wants Mark McGwire's name stripped off the stretch of highway that was named after Big Mac following his 70-homer season in 1998.

 

``It would take an act by the state legislature, but I don't think he deserves a name on the highway if he can't be forthcoming about his involvement with this issue,'' U.S. Rep. William Lacy Clay, a Missouri Democrat, told The Associated Press on Friday.

 

McGwire refused to tell the House Government Reform Committee on Thursday whether he had used steroids. Clay is a member of that panel.

 

Gov. Mel Carnahan signed legislation in 1999 officially naming a five-mile stretch of Interstate-70, from the city's western edge to the Illinois border, ``Mark McGwire Highway.''

 

The chairman of the state Senate Transportation Committee said McGwire's name will remain, as far as he's concerned.

 

``Mark McGwire was a hero of baseball in St. Louis,'' state Sen. Jon Dolan said. ``He remains so and must deal with the choices he's made. But nothing he did would change my mind about what we do or don't name highways.''

 

Sammy Sosa, Rafael Palmeiro and Frank Thomas told the committee Thursday they did not use illegal steroids. McGwire has previously denied steroid use, but under oath repeatedly sidestepped questions by saying he wouldn't discuss his past.

 

``It was disappointing because I didn't think he took the opportunity to make clear to his fans and the rest of America that he was not under the influence of steroids when he set those home run records in 1998,'' Clay said. ``He does not come clean. He's not forthcoming. His fans and the public want to know, where do you stand on this, Mark McGwire?''

 

Even Cardinals manager Tony La Russa, who managed McGwire both in Oakland and St. Louis, said he was surprised by McGwire's testimony.

 

``He's made a statement where he's denied it, and I thought it was a great time to make that same statement,'' La Russa said at spring training. ``I think he was kind of coached into saying this one thing, 'I'm here about the future, not about the past.' I was surprised he didn't repeat what he said earlier. I think it would have helped his cause.''

 

This is what I worry about. Want to prosecute a player? Do it accordingly in the law of the land and/or the collective bargaining agreement. Don't do out in the public. The public will just as soon hang him without hearing his defense.

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This is going too far, but there is no excuse for McGwire's behavior yesterday. You don't sit in front of Congress and pull this "I'm not talking about the past . . ." even though he was asked in general terms and not to call specific names, etc

 

Everyone in the media is talking about Mgwire. HE did an enourmous damage to his image yesterday, IMHO

He was asked the same two questions over and over: "Did you or anyone you know take steroids?" and "What is your opinion of the current testing process as agreed to by MLB and the player's union?"

 

He took the fifth, or threatened as much in his opening statement, on the first question; and did not feel comfortable discussing the latter as a former player who feels a certain loyality to his ex-teammates and the players' union.

 

If the media can't understand that, well, they're just looking for something [negative] to write about.

Did they ask, "Did one of your teamates take steroids?" Hell they asked did you know anyone. To me that means if he answered yes that means he just might know some guy down at the gym that never played in the MLB to take steroids.

 

And I don't see how not giving his opinion on the testing process spared anyone anything except us an answer.

 

I think what hurt him the most is his answer, or lack there of, about if the use of steroids is cheating or not.

Congressman: Take McGwire's name off highway

By JIM SALTER, Associated Press Writer

March 18, 2005

 

ST. LOUIS (AP) -- A St. Louis congressman wants Mark McGwire's name stripped off the stretch of highway that was named after Big Mac following his 70-homer season in 1998.

 

``It would take an act by the state legislature, but I don't think he deserves a name on the highway if he can't be forthcoming about his involvement with this issue,'' U.S. Rep. William Lacy Clay, a Missouri Democrat, told The Associated Press on Friday.

 

McGwire refused to tell the House Government Reform Committee on Thursday whether he had used steroids. Clay is a member of that panel.

 

Gov. Mel Carnahan signed legislation in 1999 officially naming a five-mile stretch of Interstate-70, from the city's western edge to the Illinois border, ``Mark McGwire Highway.''

 

The chairman of the state Senate Transportation Committee said McGwire's name will remain, as far as he's concerned.

 

``Mark McGwire was a hero of baseball in St. Louis,'' state Sen. Jon Dolan said. ``He remains so and must deal with the choices he's made. But nothing he did would change my mind about what we do or don't name highways.''

 

Sammy Sosa, Rafael Palmeiro and Frank Thomas told the committee Thursday they did not use illegal steroids. McGwire has previously denied steroid use, but under oath repeatedly sidestepped questions by saying he wouldn't discuss his past.

 

``It was disappointing because I didn't think he took the opportunity to make clear to his fans and the rest of America that he was not under the influence of steroids when he set those home run records in 1998,'' Clay said. ``He does not come clean. He's not forthcoming. His fans and the public want to know, where do you stand on this, Mark McGwire?''

 

Even Cardinals manager Tony La Russa, who managed McGwire both in Oakland and St. Louis, said he was surprised by McGwire's testimony.

 

``He's made a statement where he's denied it, and I thought it was a great time to make that same statement,'' La Russa said at spring training. ``I think he was kind of coached into saying this one thing, 'I'm here about the future, not about the past.' I was surprised he didn't repeat what he said earlier. I think it would have helped his cause.''

 

This is what I worry about. Want to prosecute a player? Do it accordingly in the law of the land and/or the collective bargaining agreement. Don't do out in the public. The public will just as soon hang him without hearing his defense.

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This is going too far

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No it's not!! What kind of message does it send to people that a steroid juiced cheating freak has a darn HIGHWAY named after him?!

You, I, Congress, MLB, MLBPA or the media don't need his answer to that question to take steps against steroid use.