Jump to content

Puerto Rico thread


g8trz2003
 Share

Recommended Posts


Puerto Rico has endured over 100 years of colonial rule. We are sick and tired of being a colony. Those living in the mainland may ask: why the hell would you want to become a state if you don't pay taxes?! I answer you: I personally don't give a s*** about some extra taxes here and there, as long as I get to choose the government that decides the future of my island. Puerto Ricans, as most of you know, don't vote for the President, and we only have a representative known as resident commissioner who can speak but can't vote at Capitol hearings. It's ridiculous that I'm eligible to fight in a war in which I didn't have a say on if I wanted to participate or not (although I, personally would), it's ridiculous that Puerto Ricans can't have an equal representation on both chambers of congress as the rest of the 50 states, it's ridiculous that Congress can eliminate important economic measures for local economic development (section 936 for economic develpment, Rum tax, etc.) at their will, and it's ridiculous that a country that prides itself for defending the democratic rights of mankind and the people's right to self determination maintains 4,000,000 U.S. citizens without any kind of electoral participation in our nation's ocurrences.

 

I will keep adding info. as it is discussed, but that should start things up....

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Puerto Rico should be a state or an independent nation.

 

 

Didnt PR vote a couple years back to remain a commonwealth though or am I mistaken?

There have been three referendums in Puerto Rico's history:

 

1968:

statehood: 38.9%

Commonwealth: 60.4%

independence: .06%

 

1993:

statehood: 46.3%

commonwealth: 48.6%

independence: 4.4%

 

1998:

"none of the above" option won with over 50% of the votes followed by statehood with nearly 46% of the votes. The referendum also featured the independence option 2.5%, free association with .3% and the commonwealth status redefined by the former pro statehood administration as territorial commonwealth with .1% of the votes. This redefinition was done because it is of widespread belief amongst pro statehood supporters that it's ludicrous to provide the traditional commonwealth status supported by many, as it's not a viable alternative to solve the colonial status in the island. Nonetheless, the pro-Commonwealth PR supreme court ruled for a "fifth column" of "none of the above", which went on to defeat pro statehood forces, thanks to the fact that pro independence and pro commonwealth partisans unified under a virtual "anti-statehood" coalition. The Puerto Rican government at the time, administered by pro statehood Pedro Rossello, informed Congress of the referendum's result, arguing that the referendum was clearly won by statehood, as "none of the above" isn't a status option.

 

 

After the referendum, debate over PR's status died down, but as the Clinton administration came to an end, the former President formed a "task force" which would study the situation in PR and give it's reccommendations to the president. Due to more important events in our nation, though, the task force has still to submit it's long due report, although they just recently visited the island and met with politicians from different sides of the political spectrum.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't like the fact that they wanted us gone from Nuclear Testing which was the only use of our bases there.

 

We gave in,

 

They found out that because of the bases going they would be losing their jobs so now we have bases we don't have much use for running only to satisfy their needs.

 

Their's nothing wrong with creating jobs but come on, their has to be a reason for those jobs in the first place.

 

One of my favorite conservatives, John Stossell broke this down in his give me a break segment of 20/20

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't like the fact that they wanted us gone from Nuclear Testing which was the only use of our bases there.

 

We gave in,

 

They found out that because of the bases going they would be losing their jobs so now we have bases we don't have much use for running only to satisfy their needs.

 

Their's nothing wrong with creating jobs but come on, their has to be a reason for those jobs in the first place.

 

One of my favorite conservatives, John Stossell broke this down in his give me a break segment of 20/20

The NAVY took a s*** on any plead asking for the bases to stay to create jobs. Roosevelt Roads is out already (May, 2004) and that was the largest military complex in PR. The South Command was moved to Florida, and Ft. Buchanan in Guaynabo, Puerto Rico is rumored to be preparing for a move to the mainland.

 

 

There were people who opposed the NAVY leaving Vieques, you know?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't like the fact that they wanted us gone from Nuclear Testing which was the only use of our bases there.

 

We gave in,

 

They found out that because of the bases going they would be losing their jobs so now we have bases we don't have much use for running only to satisfy their needs.

 

Their's nothing wrong with creating jobs but come on, their has to be a reason for those jobs in the first place.

 

One of my favorite conservatives, John Stossell broke this down in his give me a break segment of 20/20

The NAVY took a s*** on any plead asking for the bases to stay to create jobs. Roosevelt Roads is out already (May, 2004) and that was the largest military complex in PR. The South Command was moved to Florida, and Ft. Buchanan in Guaynabo, Puerto Rico is rumored to be preparing for a move to the mainland.

 

 

There were people who opposed the NAVY leaving Vieques, you know?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

there were some massive protests indeed...

 

The NAVY celebrated a referendum in the island of Vieques and over 60% of its residents said they wanted the NAVY to leave the island.

 

Most pro-NAVY advocators, including myself, looked beyond the evident damage that had been done to the island's ecologic treasures to see that the exit of Roosevelt Roads would be a catastrophe for eastern PR's economy. So far, it has been....thousands of direct and indirect jobs have been lost, and millions of dollars worth of investment have vanished. The real estate sector, in which my family is involved, has greatly suffered from this, as soldiers rented countless properties in the area, preferring to leave outside the base.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

obviously the people of PR dont want to be an independent nation or a state.

 

 

so they get what they get.

 

 

if they want full rights....become one of those two.

the New Progressive Party, to which I'm affiliated, is the pro-statehood party. We support an initiative from Congress in order to clarify the viable options for the people of Puerto Rico. We believe that the only two options are independence and statehood...commonwealth isn't a viable non-colonial status, although several in the island argue that it is!

 

Former governor Pedro Rossello, the leader that celebrated the 93 and 98 referendums, is running for re election now (after retiring in 2000) and he has proposed two measures that would bring PR closer to a final solution:

 

1) referendum in which Puerto Ricans would vote yes/no over asking congress to initiate a mechanism to provide viable and acceptable non colonial status options. This referendum would basically put the ball in Congress's court, as they'd be "forced" to act on PR's demands, expressed democratically and through an election.

2) the judicial way...the government, or non governmental entities would file a lawsuit in the courts arguing that the current form of government is a form of "territorial segregation", which contradicts the doctrine that "all men are created equal". The plan is to champion the judicial decisions taken under the Civil Rights Era, arguing that the same rights that were granted to African Americans for equality should therefore be granted to Puerto Ricans for political equality. This lawsuit contests the early 20th century belief that Puerto Ricans are "brown people" and therefore can't govern ourselves.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't like the fact that they wanted us gone from Nuclear Testing which was the only use of our bases there.

 

Testing? There was a nuke storage facility at Vieques, but I know of no live tests (involving detonation) ever performed anywhere in the Atlantic. Given the proximity of the local population, the EMP implications to the island's infrastructure would be devastating. I find it very hard to believe anyone ever live test a nuke off PR. no nuclear tests were ever carried out in Puerto Rico or on the Caribbean for that matter, as you well said. Roosevelt Roads did harbor nuclear subs, but they never launched any kind of nuclear weaponry. It has been said that the NAVY utilized uranium enriched bullets on the beaches of Vieques, but again, those are considered mild nuclear artifacts by all means.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Will someone with more knowledge on the subject please enlighten me as to what motivation the US would have to grant statehood to PR?

 

Just curious.

Political motivation...that'd be about it:

 

1) The economic benefit that the US would obtain by having PR as a state is minimal if not nonexistent. Puerto Rico would be the poorest state in the Union, and therefore would represent a big economic load on other taxpayers.

 

2) With the continuous growth of the Hispanic majority in the US, and their growing political clout, politicians are "hungry" for opportunities that would create rapport with the community. Over 50% of the HIspanic community in the US favors statehood for PR, according to polls conducted in 2003. Granting PR statehood would be seen as a good political move by HIspanics, therefore strengthening the political chances of "X" party at the time.

 

 

So basically, it's all about politics and spheres of influence.

Although I'm Republican, I still ask myself why the hell the Dems. haven't acted on this, becuase they'd probably get 5-8 Democratic electoral votes from Puerto Rico! :confused

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest Juanky

That would give us, what, 5 new representatives? Which works nicely because the number would be 440 if they decided to expand instead of keeping it at the current pace and just removing 5 seats from where they are not needed.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

is the puerto rican population that high to warrant them recieving more than 2 reps in the House?

Yes, the population is listed at 3,885,877 in the CIA world factbook which is slightly higher than the state of Oregon which has 7 electoral votes. well kick me in the balls.

 

 

 

that little place is packed with people.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

is the puerto rican population that high to warrant them recieving more than 2? reps in the House?

Yes, the population is listed at 3,885,877 in the CIA world factbook which is slightly higher than the state of Oregon which has 7 electoral votes. well kick me in the balls.

 

 

 

that little place is packed with people. :lol :lol

 

Puerto Rico has one of the higuest population/square ft. indexes in the world!

And we only continue to grow.... :o

Link to comment
Share on other sites

We are sick and tired of being a colony.

That's the problem. If PR was sick about the current situation, people would have acted a long time ago.

 

I would like the island to be a state, but polititians (more than Miami, if such a thing exists) are so corrupted over there than I don't trust any of the people behind the movement.

 

This is something for the US to resolve. I guess the US is not sick and tired of the situation either.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

We are sick and tired of being a colony.

That's the problem. If PR was sick about the current situation, people would have acted a long time ago.

 

I would like the island to be a state, but polititians (more than Miami, if such a thing exists) are so corrupted over there than I don't trust any of the people behind the movement.

 

This is something for the US to resolve. I guess the US is not sick and tired of the situation either. the pro-statehood advocates, under the New Progressive Party (NPP) propose exactly what you say: that the US must deal with the status issue, that's why we demand Congress to enact a mechanism that would give PRs a final say on the island's permanent status. Yet, we realize that Congress won't deal with an issue that hasn't even been clarified in the island, as statehood nor independence have ever won a status referendum in Puerto Rico. By celebrating a referendum on asking people if they want Congress to solve the status problem, the political pressure shifts to the US government.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

We are sick and tired of being a colony.

That's the problem. If PR was sick about the current situation, people would have acted a long time ago.

 

I would like the island to be a state, but polititians (more than Miami, if such a thing exists) are so corrupted over there than I don't trust any of the people behind the movement.

 

This is something for the US to resolve. I guess the US is not sick and tired of the situation either. the pro-statehood advocates, under the New Progressive Party (NPP) propose exactly what you say: that the US must deal with the status issue, that's why we demand Congress to enact a mechanism that would give PRs a final say on the island's permanent status. Yet, we realize that Congress won't deal with an issue that hasn't even been clarified in the island, as statehood nor independence have ever won a status referendum in Puerto Rico. By celebrating a referendum on asking people if they want Congress to solve the status problem, the political pressure shifts to the US government. Forgive my ignorance, but isn't this a case of be careful what you wish for as far as PR is concerned?

 

I mean, what if PR gets all belligirant and demands statehood via referendum, then the US tells them to go take a hike?

 

Isn't PR like Cuba, only a bit farther away and not nearly as cool once Fidel buys the farm and we put our casinos back into Havana?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This thread is quite old. Please consider starting a new thread rather than reviving this one.

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share



×
×
  • Create New...