From what you all have heard, what is the impression on whether or not Hanley will be on the big league roster on opening day. For two reasons this would seem excessive. First off, it is before the Super-Two deadline. That extra year before FA eligability is going to be a heck of a lot more valuable on the back end than the front. Second of all, he has been rushed through the system at this point and could likely use a little more time to learn to have some success. Anyway, I am just curious about the impression are on this topic.

While it's true that Ramirez didn't have eye-popping stats in the minors....the Marlins don't really have any good alternatives, so I vote for letting him play from Day 1 if he has a decent spring.

 

Andino isn't close to ready, Reese will probably have to play second and Amezaga is just plain awful.

While it's true that Ramirez didn't have eye-popping stats in the minors....the Marlins don't really have any good alternatives, so I vote for letting him play from Day 1 if he has a decent spring.

 

Andino isn't close to ready, Reese will probably have to play second and Amezaga is just plain awful.

 

Why let's the fact stand in the way of another of your fictions?

 

Ramirez has put up staggeringly good numbers in the minors up until last season, where one could still call his numbers respectable. I don't know if he's ready or not, but that's what spring training is for.

 

Here's his stats since turning pro. Only a hater would find fault with them.

 

http://thebaseballcube.com/players/R/hanley-ramirez.shtml

I would have Pokey play SS and Uggla start at 2B. I think Ramirez needs more time to develop and the longer we wait to get him to the majors the longer until arbitration and free agency come up. I know they may seem far away, but buy the time we are good many of these guys will start arbitration and get big rases. Letting some players develop and come up later could save us some serious $ in the future.

Plus, I think Uggla is more ready than Hanley.

I think the club will give the final infield job to Hanley or Andino based on how they perform in spring training. I don't think that's the best thing, but I imagine it's what they will do.

 

I'd argue it's in the club's best interests going forth to accept Andino's talent tops out at Pat Meares, not Derek Jeter, and place him on the path towards complimentary utilityman on a championship contender. Hanley, he's a future star and should be nutured. I realize that's not a popular opinion among many of Andino's former classmates, who are members of this forum, but he is what he is, and it's not anything great. Servicable, with a chance of being better than Hanley, but the odds are probably not in his favor.

While it's true that Ramirez didn't have eye-popping stats in the minors....the Marlins don't really have any good alternatives, so I vote for letting him play from Day 1 if he has a decent spring.

 

Andino isn't close to ready, Reese will probably have to play second and Amezaga is just plain awful.

 

Why let's the fact stand in the way of another of your fictions?

 

Ramirez has put up staggeringly good numbers in the minors up until last season, where one could still call his numbers respectable. I don't know if he's ready or not, but that's what spring training is for.

 

Here's his stats since turning pro. Only a hater would find fault with them.

 

http://thebaseballcube.com/players/R/hanley-ramirez.shtml

I meant last season. Why so touchy? Sorry that I don't have complete faith in the Marlins organization.

Why let's the fact stand in the way of another of your fictions?

 

Ramirez has put up staggeringly good numbers in the minors up until last season, where one could still call his numbers respectable. I don't know if he's ready or not, but that's what spring training is for.

 

Here's his stats since turning pro. Only a hater would find fault with them.

 

http://thebaseballcube.com/players/R/hanley-ramirez.shtml

 

Just copying the stats to avoid clicking back and forth.

 

2003, 19, Single A, 422 AB, .275/.327/.403, 32/73 BB/K, 36/13 SB

2004, 20, Combined, 388 AB, .314/.362/.436, 29/68 BB/K, 25/10 SB (RK, A, and AA stats)

2005, 21, Double A, 465 AB, .271/.335/.385, 39/62 BB/K, 26/13 SB

 

BB per plate apperance: .078 2003, .074 2004, .083 2005

K per AB: .172 2003, .175 2004, .133 2005

Extra Base Hit per Hit: .30 2003, .23 2004, .27 2005

 

I don't know if I want to go as far as saying he had a better 2005, but I see very encouraging signs of a breakout performance. He displayed way better plate discipline, BB rate improved, K rate drastically improved, and he displayed more power per hit, despite the slugging. The average is a concern, but what I like to see is he is hitting for a lot of contact and he is fast. And he did this at 21 years old, which is very young for that level. If he is putting so many balls into play, getting a better idea of the strikezone, and starting to smack them harder/farther, that average is going to climb pretty sharply at some point. I don't know if he will ever be a perennial .825+ OPS monster like Jeter, but I think it's safe to say Hanley is the next Jimmy Rollins or Rafael Furcal at worst.... .290/.340/.420 type guy 30+ SB potential in a few years. Not a superstar like some Red Sox fans, and others think, but still a pretty valuable baseball player and a nice compliment to Hermida, Cabrera, Jacobs, and Willingham.

 

I just hope 2006 doesn't ruin his confidence because he will be overmatched in the bigs. He needs another year splitting AA/AAA to play everyday, keep improving that BB rate, and make sure the average does in fact go up as I predict. He is maybe the most important young player on the Marlins. Hermida is just going to be godly. If Willingham or Jacobs fail, you can always find corner players. There is so much pitching depth who cares if half of them flop, we'll still be in good shape come 2008. We just have nothing in the middle infield. They cannot mess up Hanley's potential by throwing him out there if he isn't ready.

My two cents:

 

It's not as if we're trying to win in 2006, so what's the point of hurting our chances of winning in 2007/08?

 

Let Ramirez get the year/half year in AAA that most respectable outlets think he needs (I'm deferring to B.A. on this one since I haven't followed the guy at all until November) and prepare to have the most exciting short-stop in the NL East in 2007.

 

After all, "good things come to those who wait." (That's for 2003, )

He's not ready this year. Possibly mid-season..

 

But he'll be in the running for starting SS, regardless--just because we don't have many options.

 

You have to think that sometime during ST, after evaluating the talent, the Marlins will make a bid for some positional prospects/youngns by using some of their pitchers as bait.

I meant last season. Why so touchy? Sorry that I don't have complete faith in the Marlins organization.

 

I wasn't commenting on what you thought. I was commenting on what you said.

 

And "faith" in the Marlins, who have only had him a few months, has nothing to do with it.

Let him play in AAA for a while. If anything hitting there will get his confidence up and bring him up mid-year. No need to rush things. Unless he has a lights out Spring Training.

So most of you guys/gals don't want to start Ramirez...then who starts in the middle-infield? Reese and Uggla? I don't think the Marlins should worry about arbitration years when making this decision, it should only be made on talent. If Ramirez is the best they got they should just play him. By the time Ramirez is elgible for arbitration the Marlins should have a good idea where their new stadium will be built and they will be able to give him the money if he has earned it.

 

Every middle IF on this roster comes with major question marks. Amezaga and Andino can't hit, Uggla is a 25 year old AA Rule 5 player, Pokey Reese didn't even play last year and hasn't even been an average player for 4 years.

 

It would be different if they would have done what the Nationals did and signed Royce Clayton (or someone like him) on the cheap and give Ramirez some real competition in the spring and if he couldn't handle it you give him more seasoning in the minors.......but the Marlins don't have that luxury.

I was mortified to see the Marlins pass on Clayton, especially after seeing how little he signed for but obviously the Marlins have their reasons (and I don't think it's $$$).

 

Perhaps they envision both Reese and Clayton as equivalent players, there may be other reasons, but it certainly it is shaping up that Girardi wants to go with youth at whatever cost in the standings.

 

Personally I would have chosen Clayton over Reese but right now I'm willing to defer judgement until we see how well Pokey does in spring training and how major league ready some of the kids are. Uggla, at least to me, is either the 2Bman on opening day or fills one of the ultility lineup spots. The Marlins didn't take him in the draft just to return him to the D'Backs in April. If he can hit, he'll be playing.

 

I don't think you can hold not playing in 2005 against Reese, he was after all injured. It may be that a season off will benefit him in the longrun but at this point it's impossible to tell.

I won't hold 2005 against Reese, but 2004 and 2003 were absolutely horrid. I think they probably went with Reese over Clayton because he can play second or short. The Nationals have sure been adding alot of players on the cheap.

 

I wonder why the Marlins are passing on so many decent cheap players for? They just want to give the kids the jobs without earning them?

 

I think Uggla will make the team. I think the history of the Rule 5 draft works against him being a force in the everyday line-up...seeing how no one has ever done it. I guess he could be the first, but I have some reservations about that.

 

McGrew should make it too. I just hope the Marlins sign another lefty (chritiansen, or someone like him) so McGrew isn't a specialist.....too much pressure.

Because the Marlins are looking toward developing a championship club, while the Nationals are just trying to tread water until they have owners to give them direction.

Wasn't Jay Gibbons of the Orioles a Rule 5 guy?

I think the GM for the Nationals has done a great job. That team was garbage when Bowden took over.

I think Uggla will make the team. I think the history of the Rule 5 draft works against him being a force in the everyday line-up...seeing how no one has ever done it.

 

Umm...Roberto Clemente?

I think the GM for the Nationals has done a great job. That team was garbage when Bowden took over.

 

As if I didn't already dislike you for your extreme pessimism.

Damian Jackson, Royce Clayton, Marlon Anderson, Robert Fick, Michael Tucker, Daryle Ward, Felix Rodriguez.......all for beans.

 

I don't dislike anyone that posts on this site. I'm a realist though, and I don't think I can put on a "happy face" and say......."oh, the Marlins will be great".

 

 

I think Uggla will make the team. I think the history of the Rule 5 draft works against him being a force in the everyday line-up...seeing how no one has ever done it.

 

Umm...Roberto Clemente?

 

Roberto Clemente......1955....... .255 batting average, 48 runs, 5 homers, 47 RBI...........Wow! That's great production. Notice the year.....51 years ago.

I think Uggla will make the team. I think the history of the Rule 5 draft works against him being a force in the everyday line-up...seeing how no one has ever done it.

 

Umm...Roberto Clemente?

 

Roberto Clemente......1955....... .255 batting average, 48 runs, 5 homers, 47 RBI...........Wow! That's great production. Notice the year.....51 years ago.

 

Well, you did say that no one taken in the rule V has ever become a force in the everyday lineup. I'd say Clemente became a force.

 

Just admit you misspoke and we'll leave it at that, I really don't feel like splitting hairs over this.

Alot of players have been good a few years after getting drafted......NO ONE has EVER been an impact player as a rookie.

 

 

 

 

I think Uggla will make the team. I think the history of the Rule 5 draft works against him being a force in the everyday line-up...seeing how no one has ever done it.

 

Umm...Roberto Clemente?

 

Roberto Clemente......1955....... .255 batting average, 48 runs, 5 homers, 47 RBI...........Wow! That's great production. Notice the year.....51 years ago.

 

Well, you did say that no one taken in the rule V has ever become a force in the everyday lineup. I'd say Clemente became a force.

 

Just admit you misspoke and we'll leave it at that, I really don't feel like splitting hairs over this.

Roberto Clemente was NOT a force his rookie year which is what I'm talking about. Kelly Gruber, George Bell, Johann Santana, Jay Gibbons......alot of players turn into decent players down the road. To expect Uggla to hit like he did as a 25 year old AA player as a rookie in the Majors is insane......that is my point.

Roberto Clemente was NOT a force his rookie year which is what I'm talking about. Kelly Gruber, George Bell, Johann Santana, Jay Gibbons......alot of players turn into decent players down the road. To expect Uggla to hit like he did as a 25 year old AA player as a rookie in the Majors is insane......that is my point.

 

It's funny how you always come up with a cop-out, you meant this...you meant that, why don't you mean what you say and say what you mean?

Roberto Clemente was NOT a force his rookie year which is what I'm talking about. Kelly Gruber, George Bell, Johann Santana, Jay Gibbons......alot of players turn into decent players down the road. To expect Uggla to hit like he did as a 25 year old AA player as a rookie in the Majors is insane......that is my point.

 

It's funny how you always come up with a cop-out, you meant this...you meant that, why don't you mean what you say and say what you mean?

 

What is funny on here is how people just take parts of a post and take it out of context.

After the all-star break is what am aiming for.