CP - Borowski

SU - Tank

MR - Kensing

MR - Martinez

MR - Resop

MR - Petit

LR - Pinto

 

Messenger and Mitre won't be back IMO. I can't wait for Carlos Martinez to be back, hope he's not affected long term. I think we keep Borowski for another year, he better not be expecting a raise though. I've never seen some of the young guys that the rest of you are high on, I hope to see some hot competition in the spring.

 

What happened to German?? Why did we let him go?

 

Martinez is out most of 2007, if not the whole year

 

and why wouldnt Borowski expect a raise?... surely someone out there will give him some nice money

I don't think we'll have a consistent set of guys in the 'pen next year. They'll be bouncing up and down and around and around.

 

 

Does anyone else think it's a waste to give Tank a 9th inning role?

 

 

Why?

 

Closers are easy to replace when we're talking fungible quality (IE, the Billy Koch's and Keith Foulke's of the world), but Tank has the potential to be absolutely devastating. His breaking ball is downright abusive to left-handers and his fastball is lively and runs in hard on righties. He's a K per inning guy who walks just about no one and gets a ton of soft outs.

 

You put your best pitcher in the situation needed most, and in this day of specialized bullpen, that means the closer's role.

In this day of the specialized bullpen, closers are not given the responsibility of pitching when the situation is most needed.

No to Messenger

I'd rather keep Tank as an 8th Inning guy, and not because I don't think he could handle it. The thing is that it's hard to find a consistent and solid setup 8th inning guy. Most people who pitch in those roles do it because they're not good enough to be a closer or a starter, that's why so often it seems like everyone's bullpen sucks, at least at some point in the season.

I'm sure we'll find another Benitez/Jones/Borowski type washed up closer to bring back from the grave next season.

I am glad that they realized that Tank is better than just a one-out lefty specialist.

I'd rather keep Tank as an 8th Inning guy, and not because I don't think he could handle it. The thing is that it's hard to find a consistent and solid setup 8th inning guy. Most people who pitch in those roles do it because they're not good enough to be a closer or a starter, that's why so often it seems like everyone's bullpen sucks, at least at some point in the season.

I'm sure we'll find another Benitez/Jones/Borowski type washed up closer to bring back from the grave next season.

I am glad that they realized that Tank is better than just a one-out lefty specialist.

 

 

 

 

Don't you think you're making quite the leap of faith though in thinking that we will find that closer next year ? What if we dont ? Tank has the best stuff, he should close out games next year. Doesn't seem that difficult of a choice. Logan is good enough to be the setup guy.

 

Losing K-Mart though is a huge blow. He would have been our closer in 07 and 08. Oh well.

It's not a big leap of faith. Give a pitcher a relatively easy job to accomplish and some decent support, he'll get it done most of the time if he has any talent and/or confidence.

It's not a big leap of faith. Give a pitcher a relatively easy job to accomplish and some decent support, he'll get it done most of the time if he has any talent and/or confidence.

 

 

I think you discount the closer's role too much. While it is true that a middle reliever have a chance to prevent more runs from scoring than a closer due to being called in with runners on base more often, they are also called into the game more often when their perfomance means less. That is when their team is getting blown out or is otherwise trailing. I would rather keep my best arm saved for when the game was on the line, and that means giving Tank a shot at being the closer next season.

There's two types of middle relievers in today's super-specialized bullpen. (Actually you could say there's 3 or 4, don't forget your left-handed and groundball specialists!). The mop-up and the set-up variety. Set-up pitchers rarely if ever pitch in blowouts. And if they are, it's because they need the work after a couple off days or a bad outing.

It's interesting that you discount a relief pitcher's ability to effect the game by pitching when trailing. As I'm sure you've seen from countless games when teams come back late. They've been bolstered by an impressive relief outing to keep the game close and hope alive. The silliest thing a fan can do is to think the game ends after the 5th inning. There's a billion things that can still happen. The team who lkeads after 5 doesn't always win after 9.

Which is why people who evaluate baseball strategy, not those who simply rely on it to spare them from criticism (a manager who follows the book never gets blamed), suggest pitchers should be used according to the risk of the situation. It would be probably career suicide for a manager to destroy bullpen roles, but the next best option is to have your best reliever in a set-up role, not the closer role. Like K-Rod and Percival. Or as you saw 2003 Fox and Looper (before even Urbina) outperforming the 2005 Koch/Bump/Manzanillo and Benitez. If Tankersley keeps this up into next year, the best situation is for him to throw 2-inning outings, with games tied or with runners on or against the slugging lefties. Then bring on that closer with the name and reasonable contract when we're still 8 to 12 total bases away from the game being tied.

I think you discount the closer's role too much. While it is true that a middle reliever have a chance to prevent more runs from scoring than a closer due to being called in with runners on base more often, they are also called into the game more often when their perfomance means less. That is when their team is getting blown out or is otherwise trailing. I would rather keep my best arm saved for when the game was on the line, and that means giving Tank a shot at being the closer next season.

 

It's an argueable point, but I tend to see a lot more really good closers than I see really good setup guys. Maybe the last couple of years have made me delusional, but it seems like we can bring down any decent veteran reliever and the warm weather and humidity here suddenly brings their arm back to life.

Plus, Tank is young and cheap, give him the chance to develop. If other options don't pan out, we can still make him the closer after the season starts. The problem I see with having Tank close next year is then who becomes Mr. 8th Inning? I don't doubt that Kensing could develop to be able to do it consistently, but I don't want to just bet on him or Messenger. And hiring from outside for that role doesn't seem much more viable either. Ex closers and veteran relievers don't (at least that I've seen) tend to excel in such roles that lack the adrenaline and all that of the closer's role.

Basically, I just think it's harder to find a good 8th Inning guy than it is to find a good closer.