Child Rebel

Oh and BTW, just to refresh peoples memories. In 07, Cabrera lead us in HR's, RBI's, and OBP. he and Hanley together looked like this. Cabrera: 34 HR, 119 RBI, .320/.401/.565 Hanley: 29 HR, 81 RBI, .335/.386/.562(Hanley also had 51 SB that year) Now, Hanley has virtually no protection in the lineup and all of his stats fell last year with the exception of HR's. Also, this was before was as established as he is now. Again, we should have kept Cabrera. Again, we would've lost him for nothing. And his value back then was far greater than it is now. We got 2 top 10 prospects for him, at the time. Forgive Maybin and Miller for not being automatic studs, as soon as they got to the big leagues. That tends to happen with young players. Which is basically what we've done anyway. Lost him for nothing. Plus, with the approval of the new stadium there's a chance we would have been able to resign him. It is? Explain. Funny, Cabrera is only 4 years older than Maybin and 3 years older than Miller. They're all "young", except one of the "young" players is one of the best in the game and the other two haven't panned out. You don't trade established superstars for potential. We received 2 top 10 prospects, at the time, and that's not even mentioning a guy like Dallas Trahern, who still has some potential. And Badenhop who's currently contributing to our big league team, in the pen. As for your last sentence, this just goes to show that you're playing the result, which is a terrible thing to do with young players/prospects. I bet you were saying this same crap when we traded World Series MVP, Josh Beckett, in return for "prospect," Hanley Ramirez, and others (including Anibal Sanchez, if I might add, since he, too, has had his good moments). So we should've kept Beckett too, right? Hanley Ramirez >>>>>>> Everybody we got in the trade for Cabrera. Everybody wanted Hanley at the time. He was widely accepted as the uncontested #1 prospect at the time. Also, out of all the prospects we got for Cabrera. Who's helped us win? Also, if you wanna be technical. The Bosox got the best out of that deal seeing as how the won the WS and all. Not that I don't love Hanley, just saying.

Oh and BTW, just to refresh peoples memories. In 07, Cabrera lead us in HR's, RBI's, and OBP. he and Hanley together looked like this. Cabrera: 34 HR, 119 RBI, .320/.401/.565 Hanley: 29 HR, 81 RBI, .335/.386/.562(Hanley also had 51 SB that year) Now, Hanley has virtually no protection in the lineup and all of his stats fell last year with the exception of HR's. Also, this was before was as established as he is now. Again, we should have kept Cabrera. Again, we would've lost him for nothing. And his value back then was far greater than it is now. We got 2 top 10 prospects for him, at the time. Forgive Maybin and Miller for not being automatic studs, as soon as they got to the big leagues. That tends to happen with young players. Which is basically what we've done anyway. Lost him for nothing. Plus, with the approval of the new stadium there's a chance we would have been able to resign him. It is? Explain. Funny, Cabrera is only 4 years older than Maybin and 3 years older than Miller. They're all "young", except one of the "young" players is one of the best in the game and the other two haven't panned out. You don't trade established superstars for potential.

The only thing that's showing is that we're only 34/162 into the season. If you truly believe this offense is this bad, be my guest. Continue believing that Uggla will hit below the Mendoza line, or that Cody Ross will be attrocious all year, for all I care. The only thing that's terrible about this offense is the way Fredi Gonzalez manages it sometimes. Aside from that, their track records show that they will be fine. It's, basically, the same f***ing offense as last year, except we lost Mike Jacobs & his stellar .OBP skills. Basically, speaking in terms of offense, we lost power with Jacobs, and in turn gained speed with Bonifacio(ut). Aside from that, same sh*t. Don't even mention Willingham b/c he was out for a good portion of last year...and we still did fine. Which is around 20% of the season, and they way we've been falling lately it's not going to be pretty when we're finished with those 162 games. I do, and it has been. It' been one of the worst in Baseball. I think Uggla will eventually snap out of it, but again, he's hitting .193. That's not an indication in any way of being one of the best hitting 2B in the Majors. It may to you, but not to me. Cody Ross will be decent, but I don't think he's as good as you do. If track records mattered for here and now, I'd agree with you. However they don't, and we're far from fine. Bonifacio can't even get on base. What does his speed matter? I'm sorry, but I'd much rather have Jacobs right now as opposed to Bonifacio.

Oh and BTW, just to refresh peoples memories. In 07, Cabrera lead us in HR's, RBI's, and OBP. he and Hanley together looked like this. Cabrera: 34 HR, 119 RBI, .320/.401/.565 Hanley: 29 HR, 81 RBI, .335/.386/.562(Hanley also had 51 SB that year) Now, Hanley has virtually no protection in the lineup and all of his stats fell last year with the exception of HR's. Also, this was before was as established as he is now. Again, we should have kept Cabrera.

You can spin it however you want, but the fact remains that Cabrera is a legitimate cleanup hitter, there as hard to find as an ace pitcher! He makes 14 million a year, thats not A-ROID money... but with him in the middle of the lineup it would have been devastating... If the stadium deal would have gone down sooner like it should have, then he never would have been traded period.. Hanley is a bargain at 5 million a year. Josh Johnson better not get away Exactly. No matter what anyone says, we should have kept Cabrera. Hanley and Cabrera in the same lineup, both only being 25 and 26 respectively? We would be a legit playoff and possibly even world series contender for years to come. Now, with only two legit bats in the lineup, we're stuck being mediocre for the time being. Uggla is one of the best offensive 2B in all of baseball. Cody Ross is an .800 .OPS guy, who's struggling. Hermida is showing that he can get on base, again. We have one of the best offensive catching platoons in baseball. And, again, 1 of those 2 legit bats (I'm assuming you're talking about Cantu, since he's having a good year, and you seem like a "what have you done for me, lately?" type of guy?") we never get if Cabrera does not leave. He's currently hitting .193/.301/.345 through 30 games. He had a great season last year, but he's currently nowhere near being one of the best offensive 2B in baseball. Well it's currently .581, but I get your point. We'll see if he steps up or not. His bat has still been less than stellar. In fact, it's been below average. I'll give you that. Baker has done well thus far. I've said it once, and I'll say it again. I couldn't care less about having Cantu if we still had Cabrera. Cabrera is one of the top 10 players in the game. Can you imagine how good we would be having two of the top 1-10 best players in the game? I can.

I will be happy to finish .500 with the limitations of this team! Not enough offense is obvious. the injuries to Sanchez, Miller hurt.. Maybin flopped, Bonafacio has come back to earth, Uggla, ross, hermida not so good.. limited lineup = limited payroll maybe the marlins should have kept Cabrera to go with Hanley. For $144million Cabrera would have to pitch every other day as a starter, be the closer when he isnt starting, pitch long relief for himself and hanley, who would have to pitch too, he would also have to man the entire left side of the infield and cover some of the outfield and he would have to be the back up catcher. And if he did all that the marlins would still have to trade Hanley because they payroll would be too high. To my knowledge, Cabrera had an extra two seasons on his initial contract. Meaning we'd still have him this season at an affordable price. We'd also likely have won more games with a much better lineup. 1. Hanley 2. Baker or Coghlan 3. Cabrera 4. Cantu 5. Uggla Just those 5 look scary. You do know that the reason Cantu was signed and even got the chance to start was because Cabrera left, right? What makes you think we even get Cantu if we keep Cabrera? Are you just looking at an all-best case scenario? This isn't a video game. True, but Cantu played 3B last season. It's in the realm of possibility that he still may have been signed. Honestly, I wouldn't even care about Cantu if we would have kept Cabrera. You can find another Cantu somewhere, you wont find another Cabrera. All I know is this. Last year we did fine, we didn't really feel the effects of Cabrera's loss. With how poor our batting has been, we're feeling it now. Hanley can't carry this team on his own and it's showing.

You can spin it however you want, but the fact remains that Cabrera is a legitimate cleanup hitter, there as hard to find as an ace pitcher! He makes 14 million a year, thats not A-ROID money... but with him in the middle of the lineup it would have been devastating... If the stadium deal would have gone down sooner like it should have, then he never would have been traded period.. Hanley is a bargain at 5 million a year. Josh Johnson better not get away Exactly. No matter what anyone says, we should have kept Cabrera. Hanley and Cabrera in the same lineup, both only being 25 and 26 respectively? We would be a legit playoff and possibly even world series contender for years to come. Now, with only two legit bats in the lineup, we're stuck being mediocre for the time being.

I will be happy to finish .500 with the limitations of this team! Not enough offense is obvious. the injuries to Sanchez, Miller hurt.. Maybin flopped, Bonafacio has come back to earth, Uggla, ross, hermida not so good.. limited lineup = limited payroll maybe the marlins should have kept Cabrera to go with Hanley. For $144million Cabrera would have to pitch every other day as a starter, be the closer when he isnt starting, pitch long relief for himself and hanley, who would have to pitch too, he would also have to man the entire left side of the infield and cover some of the outfield and he would have to be the back up catcher. And if he did all that the marlins would still have to trade Hanley because they payroll would be too high. To my knowledge, Cabrera had an extra two seasons on his initial contract. Meaning we'd still have him this season at an affordable price. We'd also likely have won more games with a much better lineup. 1. Hanley 2. Baker or Coghlan 3. Cabrera 4. Cantu 5. Uggla Just those 5 look scary.

I will be happy to finish .500 with the limitations of this team! Not enough offense is obvious. the injuries to Sanchez, Miller hurt.. Maybin flopped, Bonafacio has come back to earth, Uggla, ross, hermida not so good.. limited lineup = limited payroll maybe the marlins should have kept Cabrera to go with Hanley. Ding, ding, ding.

Hanley's been doing great at 1st, most importantly with Hanley more hesitant at stealing head first than he was in his rookie season, I would rather now see him emerge as a dominant hitter rather than spend some of his energy worrying about base running. We need to find a combination that works fast. We all know Hanley will be 3rd, Cantu 4th, after that it is kind of up in the air. Putting Hermida 2nd at the moment is the right move, and its likely that soon Coghlan gets games leading off, but seems Fredi is obsessed with Boni first (speed kills). Right now we really don't have a player I would really trust batting leadoff, but batting Hanley leadoff right now just doesn't seem right, he needs to stay 3rd. Hanley is being wasted in the 3 spot. It's that simple. This team, as a whole, cannot hit. This pretty much diminishes any RBI opportunities.

I really see no reason not to put him back at lead off. More at bats, more hits, more SB, and likely more HR. Basically enabling us to maximize his production. It's become obvious to me that he won't be batting anyone in hitting at the 3 spot. Also, being at lead off makes it harder for opposing pitchers to walk him. They'll have to pitch to him.

If we would've kept Miggy, what makes you think we even go out and get Cantu, in the first place? I love Cantu, and he's been great for us, but not getting Cantu because we kept Cabrera is a chance I'd be willing to take. Or a price I'd be willing to pay.

What a frustrating team to watch... Every time I see silly errors on the base path or at defense, it is like someone is punching me in the gut. Every time I see Maybin, I'm thinking: we got raped with the Miguel Cabrera trade. That's all I still can't believe we traded away Cabrera. Next it'll be Hanley. The Cabrera trade can still be a good trade. And I doubt we trade Hanley any time soon. At this point, I don't see much good coming out of trading one of the best players in the majors. Can imagine how dominate our line up would have been if we would have kept Cabrera? Cantu, Uggla, Ramirez, Cabrera? One can only dream. Can you imagine how bad our defense would be If we kept Cabrera? Him at 3rd base would be terrible. You have to give our prospects more F*cking time. Why are people always rushing our prospects? Not everyone is gonna dominate once they hit the bigs. Just look at Carlos Quentin, or Randy Johnson(Andrew Miller draws alot of comparisons to him). I pray for our future prospects. I have no issue with giving our prospects time, but you don't trade away established Major league players, at least those whom are as talented as Miguel Cabrera, for prospects. I'm sorry, but that's my opinion on the subject. You know what you get with Cabrera. He's one of the best 1-10 players in the majors, and you'll get big MVP type numbers from him year in and year out. You don't know what you're getting from Maybin, you don't know if he'll pan out or not. What we do know is that he's thus far been terrible with bat, and hasn't been any help at all as far as winning is concerned. His defense may be pedestrian, but I guarantee we'd win more with Cabrera in our lineup than we would with Maybin. Cabrera is one of the best in the game, and what'd we get back for him?

What a frustrating team to watch... Every time I see silly errors on the base path or at defense, it is like someone is punching me in the gut. Every time I see Maybin, I'm thinking: we got raped with the Miguel Cabrera trade. That's all I still can't believe we traded away Cabrera. Next it'll be Hanley. The Cabrera trade can still be a good trade. And I doubt we trade Hanley any time soon. At this point, I don't see much good coming out of trading one of the best players in the majors. Can imagine how dominate our line up would have been if we would have kept Cabrera? Cantu, Uggla, Ramirez, Cabrera? One can only dream.

What a frustrating team to watch... Every time I see silly errors on the base path or at defense, it is like someone is punching me in the gut. Every time I see Maybin, I'm thinking: we got raped with the Miguel Cabrera trade. That's all I still can't believe we traded away Cabrera. Next it'll be Hanley.

Oh and just to add something on. Hanley is supposed to be one of the top 1-2 players in the majors, and talent wise he is, which is why I expect so much from him. I can tell you that the other player considered to be in the top 1-2 players in the majors is batting much better than .295/.385/.484 with 3 HR/13 RBI/3 SB/11 R(pedestrian numbers). In fact, he's batting .364/.467/.747 with 11 HR/31 RBI/4 SB/26 R(MVP numbers). IMO, and it's early, but at this point Hanley isn't playing up to his talent level or potential. To me, it has more to do with work ethic more than anything. And before someone comes in and claims it's too early to look to deep into the number. It's not, we've almost played 20% of the season, playing this many games gives us a little insight on what the rest of the season is going to look like.

Hanley in the leadoff spot just doesn't work. I can't believe I'm saying this, but with the amount of walks Hermida has produced, its time for him to be put #2 in the lineup Maybin Hermida Hanley Cantu Baker Uggla Ross Bonifacio Pitcher just seems to be the only way. Increase our chance of getting a man on base. Seems 2nd is an ideal spot for Hermida with the amount of walks he produced, we still have Maybin there to get steals, and I've seen that he always seems to bat better leading off, Boni needs to go down in the lineup ASAP, the rest of the lineup is self explanitory. Why wouldn't the one spot work for Hanley? I mean... he hasn't done to shabby there. He's hit .302/.413/.491 in his last 15 games. He hasn't done "too shabby" where he is. No reason to move Cantu up and put someone "struggling" in the 4 spot when we could go Hermida, Baker, Hanley, Cantu, Uggla. Fair enough, and I'd be happy with that if it weren't Hanley. However last season at this time, batting leadoff, he had 8 HR/12 SB/BA .328/OPS .978. Obviously, I'd take the latter.

Hanley in the leadoff spot just doesn't work. I can't believe I'm saying this, but with the amount of walks Hermida has produced, its time for him to be put #2 in the lineup Maybin Hermida Hanley Cantu Baker Uggla Ross Bonifacio Pitcher just seems to be the only way. Increase our chance of getting a man on base. Seems 2nd is an ideal spot for Hermida with the amount of walks he produced, we still have Maybin there to get steals, and I've seen that he always seems to bat better leading off, Boni needs to go down in the lineup ASAP, the rest of the lineup is self explanitory. Why wouldn't the one spot work for Hanley? I mean... he hasn't done to shabby there.

Move Hanley back to leadoff, sheesh. It's obvious by now that he isn't overly productive in the 3 spot and Boni isn't getting it done in the 1 spot, so why not change? There's nothing wrong with being a career leadoff hitter. Alfonso hasn't done to bead for himself. You're just posting this now after Hanley is starting to hit again? The main reason this offense is struggling is the absolute disappearance of Dan Uggla, the struggles of Cody Ross, and the fact that it apparently seems to be illegal for anyone to hit the ball with men on base...except for Cantu. He's hitting better than he was, but he's still yet to be the dominant hitter he was last year or could potentially be now. He's doing fine, he just isn't producing like he should. Of course this is all my opinion.

Move Hanley back to leadoff, sheesh. It's obvious by now that he isn't overly productive in the 3 spot and Boni isn't getting it done in the 1 spot, so why not change? There's nothing wrong with being a career leadoff hitter. Alfonso hasn't done to bead for himself.

We would be an amazing team with an infield of Jorge Cantu, Dan Uggla, Hanley Ramirez and Miguel Cabrera. The thought gives me chills. :santa It gives me chills on how many errors they will make. But they will hit pleanty of longballs and remeber Chicks Dig the Longballs! I would have loved to have those 4 in our infield. It'd be an amazing team no doubt. Anyhow, Cantu has been the best player on our team so far this season. Why would we trade him away?

I don't see him hitting 30 HR's. He's still sitting at two, and I'm not sure we'll see another one for a while after the wrist injury. I'm confident in the 30 steals though.

Yes on the homers, No on the steals I think it's yes on steals, no on HR's.

Seeing as how Hanley will be returning to the lineup within the next few games I wonder if he'll bounce back and begin to produce as he did last season. He's had a sort of slow start, and because of that I ask this question. Will Hanley go 30/30 again this season, or will he even have 30 HR or 30 SB at all?

Personally I think when HANLEY starts to play like the All-Star he is we will be much better offensively. Defensively HANLEY is also the key because he is the WEAKEST link in our infield right now. I tend to agree wit this assesment.