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Arod Wins AL MVP


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Alex Rodriguez - 3B - Yankees

Alex Rodriguez received 16 of the 28 first-place votes to edge David Ortiz for the AL MVP award.

Ortiz received 11 first-place votes and was second on the rest of the ballots to finish with 307 points to A-Rod's 331. Someone had the nerve to give Vladimir Guerrero a first-place vote and place A-Rod third on the ballot. Guerrero was third with 196 points and was followed by Manny Ramirez (156 points), Travis Hafner (151), Paul Konerko (128), Mark Teixeira (106), Gary Sheffield (84), Mariano Rivera (59) and Derek Jeter (23). We're quite surprised Michael Young received just 20 points for 11th place, and Jason Giambi, who was the No. 2 Yankee in our opinion, was named on just two ballots. Nov. 14 - 2:01 pm et

 

 

 

ridin that one all the way to the bank!

 

woops didnt see another thread for this. admin feel free to delete. sorry

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No suprise, I didn't think Ortiz should win being a full time DH. A-Rod brings a lot more to the table with his defense.

 

I hate that argument, 'if he played the field'.

 

There have been plenty of players to win the MVP that were awful at defense, why just because they play the field should they be held in higher regard for someone then a player who only hits? Ill never understand that.

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wha eva the reason is that we wanna think why big papi didnt win it we can....

 

but facts are, he lost by 5 votes, do you really think the writers that cover the yanks are gonna vote for a redsox? the writers dont even have to be NY they can be all over the country.....

 

thats like me a Maryland Terps fan cheering on dukes basketball team to win a championship...... NEVA

 

case closed

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No suprise, I didn't think Ortiz should win being a full time DH. A-Rod brings a lot more to the table with his defense.

 

I hate that argument, 'if he played the field'.

 

There have been plenty of players to win the MVP that were awful at defense, why just because they play the field should they be held in higher regard for someone then a player who only hits? Ill never understand that.

Because at least those guys went out there and fielded their position. Perhaps poorly but how can you give an award to a guy who only plays half the game?

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No suprise, I didn't think Ortiz should win being a full time DH. A-Rod brings a lot more to the table with his defense.

 

I hate that argument, 'if he played the field'.

 

There have been plenty of players to win the MVP that were awful at defense, why just because they play the field should they be held in higher regard for someone then a player who only hits? Ill never understand that.

Because at least those guys went out there and fielded their position. Perhaps poorly but how can you give an award to a guy who only plays half the game?

Ortiz won more games for his team this year then A-Rod did with his defense.

 

Dont kid yourself, the MVP award is an offensive award. Do you think that the Gonzalez's and Giambi's really won the award for what they did in the field? No, they got it for their bat...and their bat only.

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No suprise, I didn't think Ortiz should win being a full time DH. A-Rod brings a lot more to the table with his defense.

 

I hate that argument, 'if he played the field'.

 

There have been plenty of players to win the MVP that were awful at defense, why just because they play the field should they be held in higher regard for someone then a player who only hits? Ill never understand that.

Because at least those guys went out there and fielded their position. Perhaps poorly but how can you give an award to a guy who only plays half the game? he might only play half the game but he effects the outcome of his teams games night in and night out more then the whole marlins starting lineup on field did. you cannot look over the amount of big game hits Papi contributed to the Red Sox this year.

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No suprise, I didn't think Ortiz should win being a full time DH. A-Rod brings a lot more to the table with his defense.

 

I hate that argument, 'if he played the field'.

 

There have been plenty of players to win the MVP that were awful at defense, why just because they play the field should they be held in higher regard for someone then a player who only hits? Ill never understand that.

Because at least those guys went out there and fielded their position. Perhaps poorly but how can you give an award to a guy who only plays half the game?

Ortiz won more games for his team this year then A-Rod did with his defense.

 

Dont kid yourself, the MVP award is an offensive award. Do you think that the Gonzalez's and Giambi's really won the award for what they did in the field? No, they got it for their bat...and their bat only.

Certainlty offense is the primary factor but A-Rod played above average defense at third base whereas Ortiz played little, if any defense this season. Being able to hit AND field well is what gets A-Rod this award.

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No suprise, I didn't think Ortiz should win being a full time DH. A-Rod brings a lot more to the table with his defense.

 

I hate that argument, 'if he played the field'.

 

There have been plenty of players to win the MVP that were awful at defense, why just because they play the field should they be held in higher regard for someone then a player who only hits? Ill never understand that.

Because at least those guys went out there and fielded their position. Perhaps poorly but how can you give an award to a guy who only plays half the game?

Ortiz won more games for his team this year then A-Rod did with his defense.

 

Dont kid yourself, the MVP award is an offensive award. Do you think that the Gonzalez's and Giambi's really won the award for what they did in the field? No, they got it for their bat...and their bat only.

Certainlty offense is the primary factor but A-Rod played above average defense at third base whereas Ortiz played little, if any defense this season. Being able to hit AND field well is what gets A-Rod this award.

I think it was him having a better average and more home runs.

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I think it was him having a better average and more home runs.

 

Agreed.

 

You have to figure that home runs are a wash - what's 1 home run among friends?

 

It basically came down to 21 points on the ba versus 18 rbi. Now, throw in 5 more runs scored and 20 more stolen bases to help pad ARod's stats. Add another 24 points to the OBP, 6 points in SLG, and 30 points to the OPS... All of a sudden, it's harder to ignore Arod. NOW add the D to the mix and it's a lock.

 

In other words, Pappy had 18 more rbi and some dramatic home runs. ARod had everything else.

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Guest Moneyball

If Ortiz doesn't play for the Sox, they don't get in the playoffs. If ARod doesn't play for the Yankees they still make the playoffs. He isn't even the second most feared hitter in that line up.

 

Look at all the RISP stats close and late and all those other stats. Ortiz BLOWS ARod out of the water.

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the only travesty here is that it was so close...A Rod was a better hitter than Ortiz, didn't spend 90% of every game on the bench, played on the team that won the division, and played in the toughest park in baseball for righties

 

If Ortiz doesn't play for the Sox, they don't get in the playoffs. If ARod doesn't play for the Yankees they still make the playoffs. He isn't even the second most feared hitter in that line up.

 

Look at all the RISP stats close and late and all those other stats. Ortiz BLOWS ARod out of the water.

 

so you don't think A Rod makes a two game difference?

Trade Ortiz for A Rod, Red Sox win the division this year instead of the Yankees

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If Ortiz doesn't play for the Sox, they don't get in the playoffs. If ARod doesn't play for the Yankees they still make the playoffs.

 

How do come to this conclusion? The Yankees finished the season 95-67. The Red Sox finished the season 95-67.

 

ARod went 4-5 with a home run and 2 runs scored in the Oct 1 game that the Yankees beat the Red Sox to win the division.

 

Prior to this game, with the Yankees trailing the Red Sox and 1/2 game behind Cleveland for the WC, Arod went 3-5 with a HR, 2 RBI, and 2 Runs scored against the Red Sox on September 9 to keep the Yankee's playoff hopes alive.

 

ARod hit the winning home run in the Cleveland series to get the Yankees back into the playoff hunt back in August.

 

These are only three extremely high profile games that ARod won for the Yankees. This does not include the string of web gems he pulled off late in September.

 

I know all about Pappi's big HR's down the stretch and I'm not knocking him in any way. Point is, neither team makes the playoffs without their studs.

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If Ortiz doesn't play for the Sox, they don't get in the playoffs. If ARod doesn't play for the Yankees they still make the playoffs. He isn't even the second most feared hitter in that line up.

 

Look at all the RISP stats close and late and all those other stats. Ortiz BLOWS ARod out of the water.

 

A-Rod + Da Mawnstah = 55 HRs

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the only travesty here is that it was so close...A Rod was a better hitter than Ortiz, didn't spend 90% of every game on the bench, played on the team that won the division, and played in the toughest park in baseball for righties

 

 

If Ortiz doesn't play for the Sox, they don't get in the playoffs. If ARod doesn't play for the Yankees they still make the playoffs. He isn't even the second most feared hitter in that line up.

 

Look at all the RISP stats close and late and all those other stats. Ortiz BLOWS ARod out of the water.

 

so you don't think A Rod makes a two game difference?

Trade Ortiz for A Rod, Red Sox win the division this year instead of the Yankees

I respectfully disagree, Ortiz is as clutch as A-Rod dreams of becoming. If I really wanted to do some hunting, which I will probably convince myself of later, Ortiz won more games for his team then A-Rod did...

 

But who am I kidding....didnt you pick Travis Hafner as your MVP?

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Guest Moneyball

The same can be said about David Ortiz in New York with the shortporch.

 

I'm sure hitting it over that 2' tall wall that's 315' away is a real challenge.

 

That 302 fence quickly shoots out to a wall 380 feet away.

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As much as I hate to let someone else do the dirty work for me... Jayson Stark has painted a clear picture of why Papi was more valuable.

Alex Rodriguez had 24 more at-bats with runners in scoring position than David Ortiz this season -- and still drove in 18 fewer runs.

Ortiz hit 62 points higher than A-Rod did with runners in scoring position (.352 to .290) overall.

In the late innings of close games, A-Rod hit .176 with men in scoring position; Ortiz batted .313. That's a humongous, 137-point difference.

Ortiz's OPS (on-base plus slugging) in those situations was 1.224 -- to A-Rod's .813. That's a 411-point chasm.

A-Rod was vastly more productive in the Yankees' blowout wins than he was in games where a hit either way was the difference between winning and losing.

In the 20 games each of their teams won by six or more runs, A-Rod hit .549, had an OPS of 1.793 and racked up 46 of his 130 RBI (35 percent). Ortiz, on the other hand, batted .277, had an OPS almost 800 points lower than A-Rod's (.999) and drove in only 33 runs (22 percent of his overall total).

In close games -- and each team played exactly 65 of them -- A-Rod batted only .243, had an OPS of .805 and drove in just 38 runs (29 percent). Ortiz, meanwhile, clearly tapped some mysterious force that made him even better in moments like that -- batting .321, running up an OPS of 1.116 and knocking in nearly a run a game (62 -- or 42 percent of his overall total).

I find this pretty mind boggling, now instead of me just spouting off my opinion on Papi vs. Slappy, cold hard facts....

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/columns/stor...yson&id=2224114

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No suprise, I didn't think Ortiz should win being a full time DH. A-Rod brings a lot more to the table with his defense.

 

I hate that argument, 'if he played the field'.

 

There have been plenty of players to win the MVP that were awful at defense, why just because they play the field should they be held in higher regard for someone then a player who only hits? Ill never understand that.

 

 

In Arod's defense, he was stellar in the field this year. He could have easily won the GG over Chavez at 3rd and many people felt he got robbed.

 

As much as hitting gets the glory, defense is still 1/2 of the game and that is 1/2 Ortiz didn't participate. They were both very deserving candidates but since they have such similar offensive numbers, I totally understand why they gave it to Arod.

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No suprise, I didn't think Ortiz should win being a full time DH. A-Rod brings a lot more to the table with his defense.

 

I hate that argument, 'if he played the field'.

 

There have been plenty of players to win the MVP that were awful at defense, why just because they play the field should they be held in higher regard for someone then a player who only hits? Ill never understand that.

 

 

In Arod's defense, he was stellar in the field this year. He could have easily won the GG over Chavez at 3rd and many people felt he got robbed.

 

As much as hitting gets the glory, defense is still 1/2 of the game and that is 1/2 Ortiz didn't participate. They were both very deserving candidates but since they have such similar offensive numbers, I totally understand why they gave it to Arod.

The offensive numbers arent as close when you look at how valuable Ortiz's was as opposed to A-Rod's as I posted above.

 

Also, like Stark said...we will never know how many games A-Rod won or loss with his defense but we do know Ortiz never effected any game with defense win or lose.

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Guest Moneyball

Combined with the 1-2 games inwhich ARod's glove led to a Yankee loss...I can think of one game early in the season against the RED SOX. So in reality ARod cost the Yankees a game or two in the standings with his glove. ;)

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No suprise, I didn't think Ortiz should win being a full time DH. A-Rod brings a lot more to the table with his defense.

 

I hate that argument, 'if he played the field'.

 

There have been plenty of players to win the MVP that were awful at defense, why just because they play the field should they be held in higher regard for someone then a player who only hits? Ill never understand that.

 

 

In Arod's defense, he was stellar in the field this year. He could have easily won the GG over Chavez at 3rd and many people felt he got robbed.

 

As much as hitting gets the glory, defense is still 1/2 of the game and that is 1/2 Ortiz didn't participate. They were both very deserving candidates but since they have such similar offensive numbers, I totally understand why they gave it to Arod.

The offensive numbers arent as close when you look at how valuable Ortiz's was as opposed to A-Rod's as I posted above.

 

Also, like Stark said...we will never know how many games A-Rod won or loss with his defense but we do know Ortiz never effected any game with defense win or lose.

 

We won't know how many games were won and lost with defense, but we do know that is still half of the game and Arod was stellar in that aspect and Papi didn't play it. That is a huge thing to overlook when bottom line numbers (HR, AVG, RBI) are what voters most likely look at anyway.

 

As I said, both men are more than deserving candidates and have great arguments. While the bottom line numbers are similar, the Starks numbers are undeniable as well. However, the counter to that would be he defensive one. However, it should not only be how many games did Arod win defensively with plays he made, but how many he won also by making some routine plays other people would not have made if he was not the Yankees 3B. And as you said, that is immeasureable.

 

Additionally, Starks saying we know Ortiz did not win or lose a game defensively...I am not so sure that strengthens the case.

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I wanna know where all the outcry was when Giambi, Juan Gone x 2, Mo Vaughn, Frank Thomas, and Canseco won it...defense was never part of it then...why should it be now?

 

People need to face the facts that the DH is a position and a big part of the American League and a player shouldnt be slighted because he plays that position, especially one who was more valuable to his playoff team's success then anyone.

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Speaking of Mo Vaughn, he didn't deserve his MVP. Edgar Martinez lost out on an MVP in 1995 with these stats:

 

.356/.479/.628 29 HR 113 RBI

 

Yeah, folks, that's an 1.100 OPS

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