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There Was No Need For This


pierremvp1
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It's not fair to the fans, or the rookies, to have to endure this. It can't help their progress. And there was no need for it. It's the fault of MLB for allowing a team to field a team with a 15M payroll, and have an owner pocket 30-50M after getting his share of the spoils. MLB needs to step in so that this doesn't happen to any team in future. It's not fair to the other teams in the NL Central and West. If Loria had just spent another 10M on some pitching he still would have made a boatload of money and we wouldn't need a psychologist for the fans or players. And it would be fairer to the teams in the NL Central and West. I don't blame Loria...I blame MLB for allowing it to happen.

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If you institute a salary minimum, the game will lose part of itself. This league needs a salary cap, not a salary floor. Small market teams playing small ball are fun and represent a part of baseball that is lost in 200 million dollar pay rolls and players that strike at the very mention of losing even a penny off their salary. This team is hurting, and so are its loyal fans, but keep the faith. Times will get better, so enjoy what there is to enjoy now, and think positively. Its hard to get much worse than this, so we only have upward to go from here. Go fish.

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If you institute a salary minimum, the game will lose part of itself. This league needs a salary cap, not a salary floor. Small market teams playing small ball are fun and represent a part of baseball that is lost in 200 million dollar pay rolls and players that strike at the very mention of losing even a penny off their salary. This team is hurting, and so are its loyal fans, but keep the faith. Times will get better, so enjoy what there is to enjoy now, and think positively. Its hard to get much worse than this, so we only have upward to go from here. Go fish.

 

I respectfully disagree. Having a minimum is more necessary than having a cap. What the Marlins have done is atrocious. I am still amazed that people defend the FO. Not even the Pirates, the Royals, or TBay, would ever field a team with less than HALFthe second lowest payroll. It is a travesty that Major League baseball didn't step in. Selig has no balls. If the point of having a baseball team is SOLELY to make money for its owners, then no team should have a publicly funded stadium. Making money is paramount, but it is not everything. The Marlins would still earn a profit this year with DOUBLE the payroll, and I defy anyone to refute my math. Without a minimum, the Marlins could do this EVEN IF they get a new stadium. What is to stop them? They have NO credibility. They constantly say one thing, and do another. If you run your team SOLELY like a business, than you will stop at nothing to make the most money possible.

 

Just because our $15 Million payroll performs like "other" $30 Million payroll, doesn't justify this - no matter how smart the FO was in acquiring future talent. There is probably someone out there on the boards that would "question my Marlins' loyalty" by saying such things, but I do it because this board is filled with some extremely knowledgeable marlins fans who "bleed teal." Well, I bleed teal as well, I just don't wear teal colored glasses. I respect Beinfest, because he is doing a remarkable job. I respect Girardi - even though I truly believe he is not the right manager for this team - because you know he didn't sign on for this...not someone who was used to contending. But, I pity Loria and Samson, because they have set themselves up for being the biggest villians in the history of South Florida if we don't get a stadium...and the Marlins deserved better.

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I'm not defending the front office. I have Loria and Samson with a passion. If I saw either of them in public I would not hesitate to point out loud to everyone what jerks they are and then precede to spit on them. I just think a salary minimum is not the answer as long as there is no salary cap. You want to keep things fair? stop teams from having 200 million dollar payrolls. The Yankees have 3 players who make more a season than our entire team. This isn't just a problem because our payroll is too small, (though it is, Loria is a cheap bastard), but also because teams such as Boston and New York have unlimited funds to bring whoever they want.

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I respectfully disagree. Having a minimum is more necessary than having a cap. What the Marlins have done is atrocious. I am still amazed that people defend the FO. Not even the Pirates, the Royals, or TBay, would ever field a team with less than HALFthe second lowest payroll. It is a travesty that Major League baseball didn't step in. Selig has no balls. If the point of having a baseball team is SOLELY to make money for its owners, then no team should have a publicly funded stadium. Making money is paramount, but it is not everything. The Marlins would still earn a profit this year with DOUBLE the payroll, and I defy anyone to refute my math. Without a minimum, the Marlins could do this EVEN IF they get a new stadium. What is to stop them? They have NO credibility. They constantly say one thing, and do another. If you run your team SOLELY like a business, than you will stop at nothing to make the most money possible.

 

Oh boy....I've been saying this for a while. I wonder what reaction you'll get. I've pointed out that all Loria wants is a new stadium with some luxury boxes and concessions rights, and once he has that, he'll sit back and watch it roll in just like Vince Namoli did in Tampa Bay. The people on this board are convinced he wants to field a competitive team, but I say he'll get used to what is going on this year, and enjoy that money so much he'll never pay for a decent team.

 

If he had not won that 2003 series, it may have been different -- he may have remained hungry for a championship and tried to go "all out" one or two years. But I am convinced last year was all show for the stadium deal. Even if the City of Miami deal had gone through he would have sold off the team for this year.

 

Just because our $15 Million payroll performs like "other" $30 Million payroll, doesn't justify this - no matter how smart the FO was in acquiring future talent. There is probably someone out there on the boards that would "question my Marlins' loyalty" by saying such things, but I do it because this board is filled with some extremely knowledgeable marlins fans who "bleed teal." Well, I bleed teal as well, I just don't wear teal colored glasses. I respect Beinfest, because he is doing a remarkable job. I respect Girardi - even though I truly believe he is not the right manager for this team - because you know he didn't sign on for this...not someone who was used to contending. But, I pity Loria and Samson, because they have set themselves up for being the biggest villians in the history of South Florida if we don't get a stadium...and the Marlins deserved better.

 

 

I too respect Beinfest, and I wonder how long we keep him here. He's gonna be a hot commodity and may be able to go to a real team where he has a real payroll to work with. What will happen then may make this year look pretty. :banghead

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what gets me mad is that they could have just spent an extra $5 mil or so and build a major-league caliber bullpen and this team would have been.....gasp.....competitive. we've been in so many close games that this horrendous bullpen has blown in the late stages. starting pitching has been erratic - but at least most of the starters hold promise for the future. willis, olsen, vargas, mitre, nolasco, etc. have all been inconsistent, but you can deal with it because their future is bright. offense is also showing flashes of brilliance - especially uggla, ramirez and cabrera. willingham started off strong, although he's scuffling now. and all that is without arguably our most promising youngster aside from cabrera.

 

with the bullpen - you have clowns like matt herpes, joe borowski, todd wellemeyer, franklyn german, who are all waiver wire fodder blowing games and that's frustrating as hell to me. if they went out there and just got one or two guys who could pitch at this level and hold the lead for the starters you'd have a much better atmosphere in the lockeroom and a much better learning experience. instead, these kids must deal with the horrendous record and constant feeling of losing.

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Bullpen is the most unpredictable thing in the game, since they pitch so inconsistently. Beside Scot Sheilds and Mariano Rivera, name me 3 relievers who are dominant year in and year out. You can't. Relievers are a crapshoot at best, i.e. Todd Jones and Armando Benitez.

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Bullpen is the most unpredictable thing in the game, since they pitch so inconsistently. Beside Scot Sheilds and Mariano Rivera, name me 3 relievers who are dominant year in and year out. You can't. Relievers are a crapshoot at best, i.e. Todd Jones and Armando Benitez.

 

 

a)- we don't need dominant - all we needed is a couple of solid arms who could help keep some of these leads...at least once in a while. Our Pen is filled with AAA pitchers and it shows.

 

b) - scot shields? he isn't even the most dominant reliever on his team - why would you name him over guys like k-rod, hoffman, wagner, lidge (he'll get better) etc? there's plenty of "dominant" relievers to go around - so that's no excuse either.

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Guest Jack1

It's not fair to the fans, or the rookies, to have to endure this. It can't help their progress. And there was no need for it. It's the fault of MLB for allowing a team to field a team with a 15M payroll, and have an owner pocket 30-50M after getting his share of the spoils. MLB needs to step in so that this doesn't happen to any team in future. It's not fair to the other teams in the NL Central and West. If Loria had just spent another 10M on some pitching he still would have made a boatload of money and we wouldn't need a psychologist for the fans or players. And it would be fairer to the teams in the NL Central and West. I don't blame Loria...I blame MLB for allowing it to happen.

 

 

I have been saying the same thing all along. I do blame Loria and MLB. Look...this guy had a lot of problems with Montreal. MLB bought him out and then let him buy the Marlins. I think they even financed part of it. These financial problems were very predictable given Loria's history.

I just think it's very sad for the fans, for Florida and for the game itself. It's obvious that most of these players were not ready for the big show. We have a manager that was not ready.

It's getting harder and harder to watch.

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what gets me mad is that they could have just spent an extra $5 mil or so and build a major-league caliber bullpen and this team would have been.....gasp.....competitive. we've been in so many close games that this horrendous bullpen has blown in the late stages. starting pitching has been erratic - but at least most of the starters hold promise for the future. willis, olsen, vargas, mitre, nolasco, etc. have all been inconsistent, but you can deal with it because their future is bright. offense is also showing flashes of brilliance - especially uggla, ramirez and cabrera. willingham started off strong, although he's scuffling now. and all that is without arguably our most promising youngster aside from cabrera.

 

with the bullpen - you have clowns like matt herpes, joe borowski, todd wellemeyer, franklyn german, who are all waiver wire fodder blowing games and that's frustrating as hell to me. if they went out there and just got one or two guys who could pitch at this level and hold the lead for the starters you'd have a much better atmosphere in the lockeroom and a much better learning experience. instead, these kids must deal with the horrendous record and constant feeling of losing.

 

 

 

Realistically, who could have EVER believed that these kids would score more than 2 or 3 runs a game?

 

I know I didn't. I am VERY IMPRESSED with the AB's so far. By a Long Shot! With that said...NOW that we see these kids can actually hit....YES it is worth spending a few bucks on relievers.

 

But to say they should have done this from day one...well I don't think it would have been a very wise move.

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what gets me mad is that they could have just spent an extra $5 mil or so and build a major-league caliber bullpen and this team would have been.....gasp.....competitive. we've been in so many close games that this horrendous bullpen has blown in the late stages. starting pitching has been erratic - but at least most of the starters hold promise for the future. willis, olsen, vargas, mitre, nolasco, etc. have all been inconsistent, but you can deal with it because their future is bright. offense is also showing flashes of brilliance - especially uggla, ramirez and cabrera. willingham started off strong, although he's scuffling now. and all that is without arguably our most promising youngster aside from cabrera.

 

with the bullpen - you have clowns like matt herpes, joe borowski, todd wellemeyer, franklyn german, who are all waiver wire fodder blowing games and that's frustrating as hell to me. if they went out there and just got one or two guys who could pitch at this level and hold the lead for the starters you'd have a much better atmosphere in the lockeroom and a much better learning experience. instead, these kids must deal with the horrendous record and constant feeling of losing.

 

 

They've got to make some kind of move to help this part. They obviously have a good offense that is getting better and some real promising arms. I was rooting for Borowski but he just has no movement whatsoever on his fastball. Same with Herges except he throws in the mid-80's. I think they should let them two go and hope that Carlos Martinez and the other guys can get healthy and get it together. At the same time they are making some bonehead plays in the field. How many balls has Jacobs bobbled trying to make a double play? He has made some good scoops but cost us a little too. Also he tried to get to third on a 90 foot foul popup which led to a double play and could of been an important run. Tighten up the defense and get a couple decent bullpen arms and we should be seeing a more competitive team.

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