Ramp Posted March 1, 2004 Share Posted March 1, 2004 if any of you wanted to talk about the prospects that are being talked about by Marlins Insider, feel free to talk about them here link Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nc marlin Posted March 1, 2004 Share Posted March 1, 2004 I think overall the overview of these prospects is too positive. I mean honestly what shot does the 50th or 49th best prospect in a ballclubs system have at making the team. VERY LITTLE. But they make it seem like these guys could actually make the team with the ETA and all. For example they say Magness is maybe the best hitting prospect in organization and a pure hitter but he hit .227 last year and is ranked 47th. And the year before he hit .296 in A ball when he wasn't hampered by a wrist injury. That's great and all but this guy can't be our best hitting prospect. They say he's a good prospect but not quite a blue-chipper. He is ranked 47th in the orgazation for crying out loud. If he is a good prospect by the time we get to the 25th prospect they are going to be nominating the players for the Hall of Fame ballot. They need to be a little more realistic in their evaluations I think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaGreatOne Posted March 1, 2004 Share Posted March 1, 2004 And is the age right on Magness?? because according to the profile hes 26 meaning he would be 27 when he would come up according to the profile not much of a prospect I would say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonnylons Posted March 2, 2004 Share Posted March 2, 2004 I do not know any of these guys. Wathan seems like a career minor leaguer - a guy you need around for developing other players. But what do I know. Magness I do not know about either. Considering he is a former college standout, there has to be something there. I dont know if this guy will be a starter, but maybe a guy to come off the bench. Hopefully, he does well this season - we could always trade him. Power hitting is always in vogue...especially in AL. I am curious to see who else pops up here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaGreatOne Posted March 2, 2004 Share Posted March 2, 2004 Scooter, Toronto: Jim, thanks for the outstanding chat session. Which player ranked 51-100 this year can you see making the biggest jump over the next 12 months? Jim Callis: Cubs LHP Justin Jones, Orioles RHP John Maine, White Sox RHP Kris Honel, Mariners LHP Travis Blackley, Marlins LHP Scott Olsen, Indians 1B Michael Aubrey, Cubs OF Ryan Harvey. A piece of the chat transcript from ESPN.com with Baseball America writer, Jim Callis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarlinsinPBC Posted March 2, 2004 Share Posted March 2, 2004 I dont think the evaluations are OVER-positive. When talking about prospects, most teams are lucky with they carry 5 blue-chip type prospects throughout their whole organization. From that point on most of the other players have either a few glaring weakeness in their game or are too young to project as sure-fire major leaguers. Heck, even a lot of the blue-chippers never break in. You seem to have a problem with the way Magness is talked about. The guy hit pretty much .300, and was among the league leaders in homers, and rbis in a HIGH-A league (the florida state league) in 2002. the FSL is known for being a difficult league for hitters. Before his injury problems in 2003 he was actually considered a top 30 Marlins prospect by Baseball America. At that point he was only 24 and expected to be in Double A in 2003. The insiders report also made mention of the fact that for as good a hitter as he is, he really cant do much of anything else. the wasnt even allowed to play the field in college, let alone at a higher level. As for Wathan, I should hope that a guy that in a best case scenario projects to be a Mike Mordecai type NEVER cracks even the top 10 best prospects in an organization. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geemoney Posted March 2, 2004 Share Posted March 2, 2004 I've heard good things about Kavourias and am looking forward to seeing him play someday (hopefully). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fish Fry Posted March 2, 2004 Share Posted March 2, 2004 I dont think the evaluations are OVER-positive. When talking about prospects, most teams are lucky with they carry 5 blue-chip type prospects throughout their whole organization. Most teams are lucky to carry 2 blue chip prospects. There are plenty of teams with 0 (the Yankees and Tigers immedately come to mind). 5 would be an outrageous fortune. A blue chip prospect = a Josh Beckett or a Miguel Cabrera. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarlinsinPBC Posted March 2, 2004 Share Posted March 2, 2004 youre right, and outside of those one or two top prospects everyone else fall into the category of either too young to consider a top prospect or still has holes to fill. the great thing about keeping track of prospects is that sometimes one develops his game to become either a top major leaguer or a very solid contributor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonnylons Posted March 2, 2004 Share Posted March 2, 2004 Right now, Kavourias and Tucker are a little long in the tooth for my liking. If these guys were about 3 years younger, I would be a little more excited. According to the report, it seems Kavourias just needs to loosen up some, relax and not go so hard at it (in the batter's box, anyway). If he could calm down and learn to make better contact, could be interesting. Tucker doesnt seem much of an offensive threat and 3B pretty much requires that. If he played SS or 2B, could be something to work with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJB34 Posted March 3, 2004 Share Posted March 3, 2004 0(the Yankees and Tigers immedately come to mind) actually the tigers have delmon young. who i guess u cant say hes proven yet, but i bet a hefty dollar or 2 that he will be a stud. it runs in the family which is important because it shows that your genetics have a nack for athletics. especially baseball in this case. (older brother dmitri) which is also a VERY important aspect to scouts around the country. they will evaluate not only you, but your parents and your family backround etc. So i would go ahead and mark him a blue chip prospect right away because he has imidiate value for a prospect Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nc marlin Posted March 3, 2004 Share Posted March 3, 2004 0(the Yankees and Tigers immedately come to mind) actually the tigers have delmon young. who i guess u cant say hes proven yet, but i bet a hefty dollar or 2 that he will be a stud. it runs in the family which is important because it shows that your genetics have a nack for athletics. especially baseball in this case. (older brother dmitri) which is also a VERY important aspect to scouts around the country. they will evaluate not only you, but your parents and your family backround etc. So i would go ahead and mark him a blue chip prospect right away because he has imidiate value for a prospect uhm Young's a D-Rays prospect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramp Posted March 3, 2004 Author Share Posted March 3, 2004 0(the Yankees and Tigers immedately come to mind) actually the tigers have delmon young. who i guess u cant say hes proven yet, but i bet a hefty dollar or 2 that he will be a stud. it runs in the family which is important because it shows that your genetics have a nack for athletics. especially baseball in this case. (older brother dmitri) which is also a VERY important aspect to scouts around the country. they will evaluate not only you, but your parents and your family backround etc. So i would go ahead and mark him a blue chip prospect right away because he has imidiate value for a prospect Delmon Young is a DRay Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJB34 Posted March 3, 2004 Share Posted March 3, 2004 good point bud, thats my bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJB34 Posted March 3, 2004 Share Posted March 3, 2004 see, i got mixed up thinkin about dmitri Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarlinsinPBC Posted March 3, 2004 Share Posted March 3, 2004 judging by his performance in the AFL, Young can flat out hit the drays have some terrific prospects in both young and bj upton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonnylons Posted March 3, 2004 Share Posted March 3, 2004 Here is a link that looks at NL East's top prospects - our's are listed: Top Prospects Check it out...they even claim that the Mets and Phillies should be in the best shape over the next decade with their young arms. They completely overlook who has the best starting five right now in the NL East - us - and forget how young our pitchers are. Wow... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fanofthefish Posted March 3, 2004 Share Posted March 3, 2004 Well after having watched the Marlins minor leaguers the last few years, especially at GCL and FSL and last year at Double-A, I can honestly say we have a lot of talent. Unfortunately it appears most of it is in the lower rungs of the minors. I don't see any Miguels', Dontrelles' or Joshs' popping up into the show without some more seasoning. That being said I would not be surprised to see last years number 2 pick Logan Kensing make a big jump from Jupiter to Carolina this year. He pitched on a very bad Jamestown team and he could show marked improvement with a little offense behind him. Carolina and Jupiter will be able to supply this for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fish Fry Posted March 3, 2004 Share Posted March 3, 2004 Check it out...they even claim that the Mets and Phillies should be in the best shape over the next decade with their young arms. They completely overlook who has the best starting five right now in the NL East - us - and forget how young our pitchers are. Wow... Well, I could sort-of agree with them in that the Mets and Phillies can re-sign their guys beyond free agency, while the Marlins would be hard-pressed to keep Josh Beckett or (assuming he comes all the way back) A.J. Burnett once their free agency time comes. With Nannini, Allison, and possibly Olsen in the pipeline, though, they should be discounted, either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarlinsinPBC Posted March 3, 2004 Share Posted March 3, 2004 the marlins also got a good one in LHP Bill Murphy from the Mark Redman trade some other possible good ones; Yorman Bazardo, Ron Belizario, Kevin Cave, Josh Johnson, David Marchbanks, and Jon Nickerson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heckeroo Posted March 3, 2004 Share Posted March 3, 2004 wow. we have a lot of ETA's for 2005 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nc marlin Posted March 3, 2004 Share Posted March 3, 2004 I'd say its more like ETA never but these overviews are very optimistic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarlinsinPBC Posted March 4, 2004 Share Posted March 4, 2004 well Derek Wathan is already part of the 40 man roster trying to earn a spot on the roster and if you are reading the articles youd have realized that the ETA's are for the most part when the player is expected to earn an invitation to spring training. not when they are expected to earn a starting spot. miguel cabreras and dontrelle willis' come along for a team once every 10 years if theyre lucky. the marlins got 2 of those guys in 1 year, which is absolutely unheard of I dont know why you think the write ups are overly optimistic. Every player has strengths and weakeness, aspects of their games that they need to work on, and aspects of their games that are already at a major league quality level. sure 99% of all prospects never make the majors. but then what would be the purpose of scouting???? one could just say "this guy sucks" and be done with it. i think the write ups have been very fair in their evaluations praising the players strengths and pointing out their weakeness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarlinsinPBC Posted March 4, 2004 Share Posted March 4, 2004 another note about ETA's usually when a player is given an ETA that is not necessarily when the team is saying ok, this player is now ready and lets bring him up. ETAs are a measurement of when a player should be ready and if he isnt by that point he pretty much loses his "prospect" status and ends up eventually out of the organization. if you've noticed the order so far, the players at the tail end of the list are all players that seem to be getting at that age where they are getting close to that either now or never status. thats why theyre probably at the bottom of the list. cause I know that once upon a time both Kavourias and Magness were listed in the top 30 prospects in the Marlins organization by Baseball America. now that they are getting to the point of their careers where they either make it or they dont, does that mean that they dont have any strengths in their game that are worth praising? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nc marlin Posted March 4, 2004 Share Posted March 4, 2004 Don't get me wrong, I know that these players have strengths worth praising but I guess I misinterpreted ETA's to mean when they would make the major league team. I fully understand that a Miggy or Dontrelle is a blue chip prospect that doesn't come around very often although I could see Allison or Hermida being just as special. I don't know what it is about I just think it comes off too positive, maybe its just me. Most of these guys are just people to fill out the organizations needs on the minor league team and many were never expected to succeed. And yes you still need scouting because you still have to have these type of guys in the organization and not everyone is a great player. I'm not dumb I just think that maybe the overviews are misleadingly positive, I don't know why. That doesn't mean that I don't enjoy reading them and learning about players in the organization. Some of these players were never really prospects in the first place so that has to be understood. When you are drafted in the 47th round or something, no one expects you to make it past A ball really. You are just filling a need for the organization and if the player does well than so be it but he was never thought of as a prospect and ETA's probably aren't thrown around with players like these when scouts talk about them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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