Fish Fillet

I love the fact that since there isn't much support for Bush's policies, or not enough, that he has to pay people to act like they think it's a good idea. With taxpayer dollars even.... 671283[/snapback] Yeah, not much support. How'd that election go, by the way?

Have fun piloting a mop.

Whether you like him or not, this makes no sense politically. After the trainwreck that was the last election the very last thing the DNC needs to do is to shift farther to the left. And we wonder why the Democratic party is faltering. Didn't they learn anything at all from the last election? The DNC has two choices. Either accept the ideological shift the country a a whole has made to the right and adapt... Or they can stick their heads in the sand and pull dumb moves like this, which only serve as some type of perverted self justification for thier divergent views.

CNN reporting that the Jury in the Scott Peterson case has told the Judge they may not be able to reach a verdict. I dunno WTF goes on out there, but it's just flat-out absurd.

Vietnam? Crap comparison once again. Even if the worse-case scenario is 25 per day, most observers put the fighting in the 5-7 day range. 125-175 KIA? Hardly Vietnam-ish. It's gotta get done. We've already learned that negotiation and compromise don't work, and having large sections and/or cities under insurgent control won't work with the elections coming up. Clean 'em up.

Powell: A Dem in GOP clothing, not enough core party support (and he's black, btw) McCain: You thought Kerry got hammered for being a flip-flopper? McCain's got a post up his wazoo he hops the fence so often. Guiliani: Feel good candidate. But what no one remembers is that he was the most hated mayor in over a century before 9/11. You think Ashcroft is oppressive? Try Guiliani circa 1998. Frist: Charismatic as a wet fart. Lemme jus tell you know..... Three little letters....... JEB.

I miss the old days of the NFL when a guy like BO, uh I mean TO would get his leg broken on a cheap shot for doing this crap. Oh well what goes around comes around. 605404[/snapback] I miss the good old days when someone who helps cover up a double murder actually goes to jail. As much as you might hate TO, he stays clean, doesn't beat his wife or any of those other wonderful things alot of the miscreants in the NFL do. I respect that.

It'll probably be in 2012, probably Obama, but they have no chance in 2008 with Hillary. :blink: 608912[/snapback] Truly a sign of how bad off the Democratic Party is when the topic of regaining power and electability centers on a woman and an african american man.

Yet another testement to how stupid some people actually are. Mindbogglingly dumb.

See ya, Yassi. Time to insert new ineffectual, disingenious and easily discreditied "leader" of Palestine. Then we all can get back to the fun and games of blowing each other up like we have for half a century.

Minority male. Sexism is present in every color and creed. No woman in our lifetime. Anyone else remember the backlash from Albright when she was SoS? If other countries have aproblem recognizing a women in that role, what of a female president?

they gotta can ashcroft. 607934[/snapback] CNN reporting Ashcroft to "resign" within two weeks. Rumors are Rudy will be the new AG, and is supported by his prior governmental legal experience. As for McCain, new info from "behind the scenes" in the Kerry campaign indicates Kerry tried to get him to run as VP very hard. Even offered McCain to preside as both VP and Sec. of Defense. McCain saw it as a sign of desperation and passed.

All I'm saying is it is what it is. Complaining about it up and down all day long isn't going to help. The DNC need to realize that they must tailor their message to the masses, not try to have the masses tailor thier beleifs to the democratic ideology. 607592[/snapback] When the masses have such a social conservative view, are you ok with that? I think some of you guys are not realizing the increasing power of the Christian right. Ask Arlen Spector. 607598[/snapback] It's not the Christian right. You know as well as I that the Chrisitan right isn't to blame for a crushing electoral defeat. Republicans have proven that they are better able to reach out on an ideological level and bring voters into the fold. Democrats haven't.

Sour grapes. You lost, and your views have been proven to be divergent with that of the country. Simple as that. Being an atheist, I already know my views are divergent with that of the country, but the South isn't exactly the moderate center of this country, either. There are more people in NY state than MS, LA, AL, and AK combined and then some. 607587[/snapback] Flawed democratic electoral thinking. Yeah, the dems have a super consolidated base in the uraban NE. Problem is it doesn't matter, as proven last night.

All I'm saying is it is what it is. Complaining about it up and down all day long isn't going to help. The DNC need to realize that they must tailor their message to the masses, not try to have the masses tailor thier beleifs to the democratic ideology.

You're taking it worse than any of the other people on here. No, I just have to provide a voice of reason to all the chest-beating on here. It would be one thing if you left it at "We won! Yay!", but the shoddy armchair Poli-Sci analysis by a bunch of teenagers on here is going way overboard. Bush wins by a few million votes and all of a sudden, everyone on here is an expert in politics and it's "proof" that there are no liberals left in the country and everyone agrees with Southern Christians. 607553[/snapback] Sour grapes. You lost, and your views have been proven to be divergent with that of the country. Simple as that.

There is no way to interpret the results as anything other than the country expressing a shift to the right. Forget the presidential election, look at the senate, house and governors races. And no, Kerry didn't effectively fight off the liberal label. This election overwhelmingly on every level trended towards conservative control and conservative initiatives. As a Democrat, you can sit there and deny reality, but you should of learned that ignoring reality won't make it go away. F_M, your thoughts are exactly whats wrong with the democrats. It's why they've run (and lost) 4 times in the last 25 years with a liberal candidate from Mass. How many times does it have to happen before the realization that it doesn't work? Outside of Clinton the DNC has been nothing but a disaster for the last 30 years. Carter for 1 term, empty suits against Reagan, the loss of Congress, 3rd parties taking chunks of your vote, etc... Time to recognize a change is needed. Heck, it's been needed for 3 decades.

It's going to be a LONG four years for this country. Now Bush can do whatever he wants without much opposition. 607527[/snapback] I kno this is terrible isnt it? Too bad we dont live in a democratic country where the masses could have voted him out of office 607532[/snapback] Nearly a 4 million vote lead with "the masses." He not only won, but has a majority, which even Billy-Boy couldn't do. The masses have spoken.

It's going to be a LONG four years for this country. Now Bush can do whatever he wants without much opposition. 607527[/snapback] Not quite. If he runs a trainwreck the midterms will be an unmitigated disaster for the GOP. Much like what happened to Clinton with the contract with america in the mid 90's.

Not to sound racist, but you aren't going to see a black president anytime soon, much less an inexperienced one from the democrats. Running Obama would put the Dems even farther out to the liberal left, which ain't exactly what they want to do right now. Besides, an anglo, ultra WASP would have a problem winning if he was a naturalized citizen. Obama is a novelty at this point.

Realizing a hyper-polarized ideological debate the Dems have taken the extreme left without hedging with moderates. Want a moderate in the GOP you can identify with that isn't way out to the extreme right? No problem, there's plenty of them at a very high level. Not nearly as many on the Democratic side.

OK, so the issues that the Dems have are showing up as strong undercurrents in other threads, so I thought I'd try to bring it all together in one thread. What is wrong with the DNC and its' strategies? A couple thoughts to start off for little old me.... 1) The Kennedy-Clinton effect Apparently Democrats view Kennedy and Clinton as templates for success instead of anomalies that won largly on their own charisma. Newsflash to the DNC....Just b/c a guy is a southern Democrat (Gore) or a statesmanlike Massachussetts liberal (Kerry) does not mean they are viable as electable candidates. 2) The base isn't enough As evidenced by the red/blue state map, Dems get no penetration outside of the liberal northeast and with te fruitloops in CA. They need to stop speaking to thier base and make a solid move into the southern ideology. And once again, the mere fact that a guy is from the Soouth doesn't mean that he'll be successful there. Just because Clinton did it doesn't mean anyone can. 3) Liberalism is dead At least as we know it. Whether you like it or not, liberalism (which used to be a compliment) has been virtually criminalized by the right. The base liberals in the NE and CA will vote dem no matter what, so it's time to start thinking of mainlining the message. The Democratic liberal message has no resonance in the midwest, nor in the south. As much as some dems hate the idea, the party must move to the right. That's all there is to it.

Kerry won't win in the court of public opinion if he forwards litigation. Remember that Gore had the popular vote in his favor when he decided to litigate.. Kerry is down by some 3mil votes. Kerry's goose is cooked. Somebody with half a political brain (a 'la Clinton) needs to get on the horn with Kerry and tell him to buck up like a man and concede before he causes irreperable damage to the Democratic Party.

Already rumblings and grumblings out of the Kerry and DNC camps that election results (most notably OH) may be legally challenged. Please John, take a hint. It was a good fight, but just go away now. You got your teeth kicked in, and your party got it's hat handed to them in the Senate elections. Concede and save some dignity on behalf of the party and yourself. Let this country heal and get behind the winner. Time to go away now, Johnny. Go windsurfing, or snowboarding, or go teach PolySci with Gore or soething. Your time is over. Please go away now.

MSNBC's Scarborough (who I don't care for mostly) made a good point. Democrats can't win in the south anymore unless they run a southerner.? They're going to win the northern states anyway, so apparently they need to pick a redneck from Alabama every time. North vs South. 607125[/snapback] Yep. Thats what it will always boil down to from hear on out. Who knows if half our party listens. Some are just too idealistic. 607127[/snapback] Former Senator Mitchell mentioned that the South used to vote Democrat based on economic issues. The Republicans during the Reagan years convinced southerners that cultural conservative issues are more important than economic ones. 607184[/snapback] The south's conversion to the GOP? Simple, and in two issues...... 1) Religion/morality 2) Gun control