lol...

 

 

What schools are you guys attending? I'm studying history at the University of Florida.

Hahaha, the secret fraternal order of political scientists. I think i may go into law, who knows i have a decent job now too so Im weighing options. I'm attending Florida international Univ. in miami

Cyberlina are you retarded? There is no? draft so the my 'uneducated and unemployed" statement does not apply to any of our soldiers.

I think the only retarded person here is you. I am absolutely disgusted at your comments. This reflects the thinking of young people like you, who think all poor people are poor because they are lazy and deserve to die in battle for a country and people like you who denigrate them and treat them like dirt.

 

People like you would rather increase military spending to go to an unnecessary war and send young people to die for you, rather than spending on free education and training so this "Stupid" poor people have a chance to contribute to your F***ing society! How young do you think I am? I have a degree in political science and im currently beginning work ona master's in that field. I came from a low income family of hard working people, my grandfather was a farmer, my dad was an electrician, none of them went to college. My father always worked hard to put food on the table for me and my siblings and not once did he ask for any govt handouts, b/c he worked for it. You need to wake up and realize that the cancer on our society is caused by people who ARE lazy and dont want to work and are living in a culture of dependancy because te govt keeps giving them handouts and has instituted them in help programs for the poor and if they go over a certain income they loose their benefits, so they refuse to work. These programs are the problem and the people who dont want to work are the problem. I was able to work my way out of being poor by hitting the books, going to college, not a great one but the one that i got a scholarship for. You need to relax with blanket statements b/c instead of throwing more money into useless programs, people need to go out and work. go out to liberty city in miami and then come back and tell me that. And if anything the govt should help people find jobs and not penalize them by kicking them out of public housing if they make too much money (although not enough to buy or rent another kind of housing) No incentive to work thats the cancer that is plaguing our country. the problem is elitists who need to get a pat in the back for helping the poor and who think because your a libertarian or conservative that we're rich and have alwyas been so. I've been there ive seen the way things work and it can be done. A draft should not be done anyway, but if it would you need to get the people that contribute less to society because thats what keeps our society moving. The people who can work and refuse to work are a plague on this country, this is not to say that no one should get help. the elderly and sick need help. But if your 20 and you dont want to do anything with your life except procreate and live off food stamps there is a problem with this person and they hsould not be rewarded for this behavior. By the way my apologies for namecalling I overreacted, sorry for any disrespect Congratulations on your degree... It is a shame that such an educated person is so out of touch with reality. It is sad to think that "ALL" poor people are poor because they are lazy. I guess you are not poor, otherwise you'd know what is like to not even have money to go to college, buy books, food or clothing. I guess you don't know what is like to have to chose between going to school or working to help feed your family. I guess you also don't know that despite all the "handouts" you are talking about, the average poor family can't pay all their bills or afford to buy new clothes for their kids. Do you know what is like to chose between getting your daughter new pair of shoes or food for the month? I guess not. Keep watching TV or reading right wing propaganda on how lazy the poor people are, it might just help you confirm your assumption that all poor people are on welfare, have 12 children and are lazy.

Seriously, who is more useful to society? Smarter people. Why should we lose the cream of the crop in war unless necessary?

 

And I'm not talking about just rich people, merely educated. It is a hard issue, because there are many people who are smart and useful, but not educated, but many many more are not.

well what would be the criteria then?

 

 

 

you essentially say yourself that educational level is not a true indicator, so what would it be? sadly, people like me are useless come war time.

 

Scientists and people with good mechanical skills should be exempt, then the smartest in general, depending on how much you need.

I was on scholarship so thanks to that i got into college. and i dont need to read anything b/c ive been there, i work with people like that everyday, I am actually in the heart of it all. I never siad all poor people are lazy, but their are plenty that are, and not only that but after benefits a person who makes 10,000 a year on their own ends up with more than a person who makes 15,000. So you need to stop spitting ideology at me and that elitist garbage and go out there for yourself and see that many poor people are there b/c they dont try to move out. In fact in black neighborhoods it is often the case that if a young person leaves to go study, hes 'selling out' or trying to be white. Not only was i raised poor i am also from a 'minority' group. I assure you that i know exactly what Im tlakin about. And in fact most of the people that have plenty of children get so many benefits for them, that they end up with more than a factory worker with 1 kid. So YOU open you eyes and I want you to live and see what ive seen and come back to me with this idealistic garbage. And the average WORKING class family cant afford to buy anything b/c they dont get the handouts they are being given to people who dont work. Go out and look for yourself if you dont believe me

And the average WORKING class family cant afford to buy anything b/c they dont get the handouts they are being given to people who dont work.

Sounds like a most passionate argument for an increase in the minimum wage.

thats another issue im not even gonna touch upon now

I want to defend LegacyofCangelosi on this one.

 

First off, it was never insinuated that poor people are lazy. Nevertheless, it is a fact that many poor people in this nation are in the situation they're in because of government programs that encourage them not to work.

 

My father arrived from Cuba in 1980 without a penny. He was a couple of months away from graduating in Cuba and he had to start all over in Puerto Rico b/c the university didn't accept his credits. I'm 19 right now and I go to the best business school in the nation right now, and I consider myself to be blessed. My father fought hard since he arrived from Cuba, his family rejected any help from the government (I don't look down on all people who do), and studied at night while he worked to sustain our household. I was able to get an education which allowed me the opportunity to be where I'm at right now, and I therefore consider that I too can talk about how education and hard work makes people overcome any obstacle.

 

Second, don't give me any s*** about how conservative governments ignore our nation's need for improved educational programs. I don't want to get off topic, but it is you democrats that have staunchly opposed educational initiatives like the voucher system which would give EVERYONE, specially the poor, access to top schools in their area instead of being appointed to a specific school. If you really do care about the poor, then why does your party oppose this initiative? If being conservative is being elitist, and if favoring this initiative is being elitist, then call me elitist!!

 

Third, our defense budget needs to be as high as it is, 9-11 proved that. If we don't defend ourselves, the terrorists will run over our country, and there will be no educational system to invest in.

A bullet does not care what you are, it is sent to kill whatever it strikes by the person(s) who shot it.

I want to defend LegacyofCangelosi on this one.

 

First off, it was never insinuated that poor people are lazy. Nevertheless, it is a fact that many poor people in this nation are in the situation they're in because of government programs that encourage them not to work.

 

My father arrived from Cuba in 1980 without a penny. He was a couple of months away from graduating in Cuba and he had to start all over in Puerto Rico b/c the university didn't accept his credits. I'm 19 right now and I go to the best business school in the nation right now, and I consider myself to be blessed. My father fought hard since he arrived from Cuba, his family rejected any help from the government (I don't look down on all people who do), and studied at night while he worked to sustain our household. I was able to get an education which allowed me the opportunity to be where I'm at right now, and I therefore consider that I too can talk about how education and hard work makes people overcome any obstacle.

 

Second, don't give me any s*** about how conservative governments ignore our nation's need for improved educational programs. I don't want to get off topic, but it is you democrats that have staunchly opposed educational initiatives like the voucher system which would give EVERYONE, specially the poor, access to top schools in their area instead of being appointed to a specific school. If you really do care about the poor, then why does your party oppose this initiative? If being conservative is being elitist, and if favoring this initiative is being elitist, then call me elitist!!

 

Third, our defense budget needs to be as high as it is, 9-11 proved that. If we don't defend ourselves, the terrorists will run over our country, and there will be no educational system to invest in.

Totally agreed and thanks for the backup. You have now achieved the level of the political threads official "Armando Benitez".

Totally agreed and thanks for the backup. You have now achieved the level of the political threads official "Armando Benitez".

Excellent... :thumbup

I want to defend LegacyofCangelosi on this one.

 

First off, it was never insinuated that poor people are lazy. Nevertheless, it is a fact that many poor people in this nation are in the situation they're in because of government programs that encourage them not to work.

 

My father arrived from Cuba in 1980 without a penny. He was a couple of months away from graduating in Cuba and he had to start all over in Puerto Rico b/c the university didn't accept his credits. I'm 19 right now and I go to the best business school in the nation right now, and I consider myself to be blessed. My father fought hard since he arrived from Cuba, his family rejected any help from the government (I don't look down on all people who do), and studied at night while he worked to sustain our household. I was able to get an education which allowed me the opportunity to be where I'm at right now, and I therefore consider that I too can talk about how education and hard work makes people overcome any obstacle.

 

Second, don't give me any s*** about how conservative governments ignore our nation's need for improved educational programs. I don't want to get off topic, but it is you democrats that have staunchly opposed educational initiatives like the voucher system which would give EVERYONE, specially the poor, access to top schools in their area instead of being appointed to a specific school. If you really do care about the poor, then why does your party oppose this initiative? If being conservative is being elitist, and if favoring this initiative is being elitist, then call me elitist!!

 

Third, our defense budget needs to be as high as it is, 9-11 proved that. If we don't defend ourselves, the terrorists will run over our country, and there will be no educational system to invest in.

I applaud your father's efforts. Isn't it great when people can aspire to better things in a free, open society? Isn't great that we have access to such great opportunities?

 

I don't disagree with you that hard work does pay off. I know first hand it does. However, to pretend that social programs create bums is an utterly irresponsible assumption. Perhaps your father had enough money in his bank account to pay for your tuition... Or OMG did you get a "hand out" from the government called student aid? If not, you are very lucky. A lot of people, no matter how hard they work, still scramble to pay their basic expenses and in many cases don't have any money left to save or even dream of paying for college tuition. That is why "student aid" exists, to give the opportunity to this poor people to attend college, earn an education and better themselves, to perhaps get out of poverty.

 

I am not going to argue that there isn't certain inescrupulous people who take advantage of the system, because there are. However, why not make the system more efficient and avoid these "loopholes" in order to stop these real bums from taking advantage of the rights of people who really need and deserve this help? Don't you think that ignoring the needs of the poor and taking away the opportunities for them to get out of poverty is going to hurt our society in the long run? Would you like to see an aristocratic society where there are only "dirt poor" people and "ultra rich"? I don't think so... I want to know that I live in a country where everyone has a chance to succeed.

 

If you want to see the trend of social stratification in this country (Sorianofan may help me find it) it can show that the middle class is actually dissapearing; there are more poor people added. I don't want any scumbag to get "free rides", but I don't want all poor people to be lumped in this category and then take away the means by which they may actually succeed in life one day.

 

No grudges here! I hope you can see that I am in no way suggesting we should be a communist or socialist country, but I don't think pure capitalism is all that clear to actually give equal opportunities to all. Some compromise has to reached, between a thriving economy and improving the well being of all citizens.

However, why not make the system more efficient and avoid these "loopholes" in order to stop these real bums from taking advantage of the rights of people who really need and deserve this help? Don't you think that ignoring the needs of the poor and taking away the opportunities for them to get out of poverty is going to hurt our society in the long run?

Most hard lefties decried the Clinton welfare reform because it did move to close a lot of the loopholes. All sorts of dire predictions were made, few ever became reality though.

 

As a general statement, people get what they're willing to strive for. I worked with MANY fellow aerospace engineers at Rockwell's Space Division in the early 80's that were born and raised in Watts and Compton - it doesn't get any worse than that in terms of starting point. They had the desire though, so they worked their way out. Worked their way through Cal State Long Beach, Fullerton, etc.

 

There's lots of opportunity in America. What's lacking in a lot of cases is desire.

 

Do not confuse lack of outcome with lack of opportunity.

 

There's a whole branch of my family that have been bums and losers for the last 60 years. There's not an ounce of motivation among the whole crew. If they can't steal what they want, or con someone else out of it, they're not interested in actually working to get it. You could give every one of them a million bucks tomorrow and it would all be gone within two years. I understand your point completely, but I still don't see how cutting social programs can help close the gap between wealthy and poor and create a little more equitable distribution of wealth. When you don't have education it is very difficult to get a good job and strive for a better life. All I'm saying is that we should not judge the entire group of people by a few bad apples.