WildMarlinMan2003 Posted August 2, 2004 Share Posted August 2, 2004 Comparing Choi to LoDuca? haha ya right. LoDuca was described as "the heart and soul" of the Dodgers. He is a leader! You can't teach that. Someone would need to teach Choi english before he could become a leader. Compare the two when Choi is an all star... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaq-Man Posted August 2, 2004 Share Posted August 2, 2004 do you guys honestly think the marlins beat writers are ripping this trade out of spite for the team? do you honestly think they're all out to get us? this was a GOD AWFUL trade, and 80% of the board agreed it was until everyone on ESPN mysteriously called it a win for the marlins. ignore what ESPN says and just LOOK at this god damn trade. it's dreadful. how on earth can you say this offense is better? the marlins' beat writers know this team a thousand times better than peter gammons, yet you write off their (rather obvious) conclusions as hate? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramp Posted August 2, 2004 Share Posted August 2, 2004 Shaq-Man you know damn well Berardino and LeBatard rip any and every move we make whether it was good or not Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mave Posted August 2, 2004 Share Posted August 2, 2004 saying choi and lo duca cancel each other out and are even is ridiculous. one of our weak points was hitting with runners in scoring position. i think we helped ourselves a lot by adding lo duca, look at his numbers with RISP. paul lo duca with RISP: .316 AVG 3 HR 38 RBI .461 SLG% .357 OBP hee seop choi with RISP: .234 AVG 5 HR 26 RBI .547 SLG% .407 OBP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildMarlinMan2003 Posted August 2, 2004 Share Posted August 2, 2004 do you guys honestly think the marlins beat writers are ripping this trade out of spite for the team? do you honestly think they're all out to get us? this was a GOD AWFUL trade, and 80% of the board agreed it was until everyone on ESPN mysteriously called it a win for the marlins. ignore what ESPN says and just LOOK at this god damn trade. it's dreadful. how on earth can you say this offense is better? the marlins' beat writers know this team a thousand times better than peter gammons, yet you write off their (rather obvious) conclusions as hate? 489954[/snapback] hahaha...ok man. I loved the trade when it happened and a few other fans did too. There is a reason why they are called "experts". They study the game more than us (it's their job) and they say we got the better deal. The only way we will know is at the end of the season. Even a few GMs in the National League agree that Beinfest is a genious and he ripped LA off. We shall see....either way, to call this trade GOD AWFUL is stupid and makes it sound like you just do not know baseball. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nc marlin Posted August 2, 2004 Share Posted August 2, 2004 I think Peter Gammons likes the Dodgers end of the deal better. It was more Harold Reynolds, Jeff Brantley, and John Kruk who liked what the Marlins got(wow that's a great trio to have on your side). The trade sucked but the beat writers love to rip the Marlins especially the Front Office and Ownership. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miami 305 Posted August 2, 2004 Share Posted August 2, 2004 This guy is a moron...how the hell do these people get to be writers....Lo Duca and Choi same bat ???? How?? LoDuca has higher avg. Choi has more home runs Lo Duca has more RBI's ...choi has higher obp...i dont get how these morons are allowed to write in newspapers......and is Choi a team leader??? Did we not get a catcher who can throw out a runner stealing....did we not make our bullpen one of the best...did we not improve our defense and speed?? did we not get a # 3 hitter......???? This guy knows nothing at all Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hotcorner Posted August 2, 2004 Share Posted August 2, 2004 I think the article's a little too harsh, but I still agree that the trade didn't do enough. Can't remember the last time I agreed with LeBatard.... yuck. The bats just aren't improved enough & as crappy as the bullpen was, the main reason for the team's record so far is NOT because the pen blew a lot of late leads. You guys ripping Choi make it so easy... Choi is putting up comparable or better numbers than Lo Duca in nearly every category except batting average and RBIs in his first full season, and he's done it in far fewer at-bats while batting much lower in the order. That includes on-base, slugging, OPS, walks, runs, homers, doubles... Lo Duca's a .287 career hitter, and Choi's batting .270 in his first full season. I'm not bashing Lo Duca, he's a good player & an obvious upgrade at catcher. Last year's moves were additions only. These are additions AND subtractions, and the end result just isn't improved enough in my opinion. Hey I hope my opinion's dead wrong though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaq-Man Posted August 2, 2004 Share Posted August 2, 2004 saying choi and lo duca cancel each other out and are even is ridiculous. one of our weak points was hitting with runners in scoring position. i think we helped ourselves a lot by adding lo duca, look at his numbers with RISP. paul lo duca with RISP: .316 AVG 3 HR 38 RBI .461 SLG% .357 OBP hee seop choi with RISP: .234 AVG 5 HR 26 RBI .547 SLG% .407 OBP 489958[/snapback] youre comparing RISP? have you ever seen a player whose RISP doesnt vary wildly from one year to the next? that stat has almost no statistical significance at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildMarlinMan2003 Posted August 2, 2004 Share Posted August 2, 2004 LoDuca > Choi....end of story. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miami 305 Posted August 2, 2004 Share Posted August 2, 2004 nice point shaq man... choi cant get a hit with RISP for his life Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nc marlin Posted August 2, 2004 Share Posted August 2, 2004 Comparing Choi to LoDuca? haha ya right. LoDuca was described as "the heart and soul" of the Dodgers. He is a leader! You can't teach that. Someone would need to teach Choi english before he could become a leader. Compare the two when Choi is an all star... 489944[/snapback] Choi speaks good english. And I prefer Choi's numbers with RISP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prorl Posted August 2, 2004 Share Posted August 2, 2004 I do agree that we didnt improve enough though, specially on offense which might be our biggest weakness. But if some of the hitters start gettign hot then that would obviously solve alot of problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mave Posted August 2, 2004 Share Posted August 2, 2004 saying choi and lo duca cancel each other out and are even is ridiculous. one of our weak points was hitting with runners in scoring position. i think we helped ourselves a lot by adding lo duca, look at his numbers with RISP. paul lo duca with RISP: .316 AVG 3 HR 38 RBI .461 SLG% .357 OBP hee seop choi with RISP: .234 AVG 5 HR 26 RBI .547 SLG% .407 OBP 489958[/snapback] youre comparing RISP? have you ever seen a player whose RISP doesnt vary wildly from one year to the next? that stat has almost no statistical significance at all. 489971[/snapback] it is significant because we've been struggling all year with RISP and we added someone who is batting well over .300 with RISP and subtracting someone who is batting .230 with RISP. don't you get it???? however, choi does have a very very nice slg% Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaq-Man Posted August 2, 2004 Share Posted August 2, 2004 saying choi and lo duca cancel each other out and are even is ridiculous. one of our weak points was hitting with runners in scoring position. i think we helped ourselves a lot by adding lo duca, look at his numbers with RISP. paul lo duca with RISP: .316 AVG 3 HR 38 RBI .461 SLG% .357 OBP hee seop choi with RISP: .234 AVG 5 HR 26 RBI .547 SLG% .407 OBP 489958[/snapback] youre comparing RISP? have you ever seen a player whose RISP doesnt vary wildly from one year to the next? that stat has almost no statistical significance at all. 489971[/snapback] it is significant because we've been struggling all year with RISP and we added someone who is batting well over .300 with RISP and subtracting someone who is batting .230 with RISP. don't you get it???? however, choi does have a very very nice slg% 489981[/snapback] it is not significant in that because you cannot expect a player's RISP to be the same from year to the next due to small sample sizes, you can similarly not expect a player's RISP to be the same from one half of the season to the next. it all hinges on the tiniest of sample sizes....to say that we have infused a .300 RISP into our lineup for the rest of the year while taking out a .230 RISP is not correct, and at the end of the season--if i remember--we can compare choi's and lo duca's RISPs after the trade and see just how consistent those numbers remained. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jack1 Posted August 2, 2004 Share Posted August 2, 2004 I read this article earlier this morning and I agree with it. We don't know how all this will pan out. Just because you get "new" players" doesn't mean it will help. As I said the other day, only time will tell. Let's wait a few weeks and see what happens. Most of these guys are mediocre. We already had that. Once again, time will tell. We also have to wait and see how it all affects McKeon. Will he continue to micro manage every little thing? Will the hitting come around? It has started but that has been the biggest problem all year long. If you don't score runs, YOU'RE NOT GOING TO WIN! Don't hate someone's article just because you don't agree with them. That article may be right in the long run. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ice Man Posted August 2, 2004 Share Posted August 2, 2004 what part of we needed an upgrade at catcher doesn't anyone understand? who else could we have givin up? Not niner, or lowell. Or Cabs. Would you rather give them Luie? Ah...you'd rather let them have Pierre...NO! Alex...Yeah... Look, Choi was the only one who we could stand losing. Seriously, I don't think they would have said yes if we gave them OMGNUNEZ or Easley. Plus, we got Valdez, He's decent and that's all i was hoping for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nc marlin Posted August 2, 2004 Share Posted August 2, 2004 why upgrade at catcher only to downgrade elsewhere? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miami15 Posted August 2, 2004 Author Share Posted August 2, 2004 do you guys honestly think the marlins beat writers are ripping this trade out of spite for the team? do you honestly think they're all out to get us? this was a GOD AWFUL trade, and 80% of the board agreed it was until everyone on ESPN mysteriously called it a win for the marlins. ignore what ESPN says and just LOOK at this god damn trade.? it's dreadful. how on earth can you say this offense is better?? the marlins' beat writers know this team a thousand times better than peter gammons, yet you write off their (rather obvious) conclusions as hate? 489954[/snapback] hahaha...ok man. I loved the trade when it happened and a few other fans did too. There is a reason why they are called "experts". They study the game more than us (it's their job) and they say we got the better deal. The only way we will know is at the end of the season. Even a few GMs in the National League agree that Beinfest is a genious and he ripped LA off. We shall see....either way, to call this trade GOD AWFUL is stupid and makes it sound like you just do not know baseball. 489959[/snapback] I made up my opinion (which approved the trade) before I got home from NYC at Friday on midnight. Common sense says this trade helps the team in positions it was awful at. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramp Posted August 2, 2004 Share Posted August 2, 2004 :deadhorse :deadhorse :deadhorse :deadhorse :deadhorse :deadhorse :deadhorse :deadhorse :deadhorse :deadhorse :deadhorse :deadhorse :deadhorse :deadhorse :deadhorse :deadhorse :deadhorse :deadhorse make it stop!!!! ahhhhhh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FutureGM Posted August 2, 2004 Share Posted August 2, 2004 I just try to ignore Le Retard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Juanky Posted August 2, 2004 Share Posted August 2, 2004 Short Term: Good Deal Long Term: Bad Deal That's all there is to it. Let's lean back and enjoy the steep climb in the roller coaster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Accord Posted August 2, 2004 Share Posted August 2, 2004 Dan LeBastard is one of the worst writers in all of Florida. He is just trashing this deal because he didn't get exclusive rights to break the story to the world like he did with the Shaq deal. He's such a baby, if he can't be a part of it he'll trash it in the press. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marlins04 Posted August 2, 2004 Share Posted August 2, 2004 choi, and lo duca dont cancel each other out, choi strikes out every at bat he dosent do his magical walk to first base. lo duca barley strikes out and always makes contact Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockyMountainMarlin Posted August 2, 2004 Share Posted August 2, 2004 I wrote to Dan too this morning right after reading the article. Couldn't believe what I was reading. Comparing LoDuca to Choi is like comparing Pudge to Josh Willingham. Give me a break. Then we also go Encarnacion who - like it or not - did put some respectable numbers for us last year. And we ended up getting Mota, who in almost all certainty will be our closer once Benitez signs his millions somewhere else - only after saving our bullpen in the 8th inning since we can't always count on Koch. And if that wasn't enough, it virtually guarantees that we will have money to sign Carl Pavano after this season since keeping Penny would have meant losing Carl. Sure the Shaq trade is huge, but they also gave up a lot to get him. This trade isn't an A+, but I'd say its a solid A. The climb to the pennant starts tomorrow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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