Sun-Sentinel

MIAMI GARDENS -- No one in the Marlins' clubhouse agreed. Maybe no one will agree, period. But here goes: From the standing start of today, Aug. 23, I think the Marlins making the playoffs this season would be a bigger athletic achievement than making them from this same spot in 2003.

 

"2003 was bigger, maybe because it was my first time," pitcher Josh Beckett said.

 

"This would be great, but nothing compares to the first time," owner Jeffrey Loria said.

 

"The bigger achievement was 2003 just because no one thought we could do it," third baseman Mike Lowell said. "This year, if we make the playoffs, a lot of people are going to say they picked us. On paper, we should be a lot better than we are. And we're getting there."

 

And so it went. Some didn't take sides, like Monday's winning pitcher, Dontrelle Willis, who said, "Making the playoffs any year is a big achievement." But no player picked this year as bigger. Not one.

 

And I still say: Forget the first-time romance. Forget expectations. From the purely baseball view of here, now, today, these Marlins making the playoffs will be a bigger athletic achievement than in 2003.

 

The situations are similar. On Aug. 23, the Marlins were a half-game from the wild-card berth. After Monday's 5-2 win against the Dodgers, the Marlins packed for Milwaukee just one-half game out of the wild-card playoff spot.

 

Both had/have tough, division-intensive schedules remaining. Both were/are playing before smallish home crowds. (How small? On Monday, Marlins fan Jeff Hargrove caught two foul balls and a souvenir T-shirt. "I just hope it doesn't start lightning, because I know I'll catch it," said Hargrove, 21, of Boca Raton.)

 

This current team just has more sizable problems to navigate. This isn't to question its ability to do so. If anything, it's to salute the achievement even more if it happens.

 

This 2005 team has isolated greatness amid pockets of mediocrity. That 2003 team had balanced goodness amid pockets of greatness.

 

So far, this team is an example of how far great starting pitching, a hot closer and a formidable three-four punch of Miguel Cabrera and Carlos Delgado can carry a team. That 2003 team was an example of how far good starting pitching, a deep and balanced lineup and a solid bullpen could take a team.

 

This team has good defense overall. That team had great defense (add in Derrek Lee's glove and Pudge Rodriguez's arm.)

 

This team doesn't have much speed. That team had underrated speed (even Lee stole 21 bases).

 

This team has not played consistently all year, despite everyone expecting it to win. That team had the best record in baseball from the end of May, despite few people believing what it meant.

 

This team has Juan Pierre hitting .258 with a .314 on-base percentage and Mike Lowell hitting .233 with six home runs. That team had Pierre hitting .305 with a .361 on-base percentage, and Lowell hitting .276 with 32 home runs until he was hurt on Aug. 31.

 

Then Jeff Conine was acquired and hit five home runs with 15 RBI in September.

 

"On any given night, our potential to dominate a team is better this year than back then," Conine said. "The starting pitcher is great. [Lowell is] having an off year and Juan's having an off year, but there's more than a month to play and if they play like they usually do in September, then a lot changes.

 

"This team's capable of turning it on in a hurry, and I think we showed it this homestand. Our starting pitching shut down people. And we put together some good offensive games. We scored 7 [runs]. We scored 6. Today we scored 5. We can put up some offense."

 

Here's the catch with this offense: It had nine hits against Dodger pitching that started Edwin Jackson, a minor league call-up. Eight were singles. This is a common story line, too. If Cabrera and Delgado don't supply the power, it's not coming.

 

Maybe they can ride this manner of offense to the playoffs. But do you see what an achievement it would be? Do you understand the pressure the arms of Beckett, Willis, A.J. Burnett and rookie Jason Vargas would pitch through? The dependence, since most games are close, on closer Todd Jones?

 

Then again, nothing stays the same in seasons. Maybe this offense changes. Maybe the Guillermo Mota of Monday (five strikeouts in six Dodgers faced) is what plays out. Beckett, for instance, was 6-6 in 2003 before he caught magic from right about this spot in August all the way through the World Series (even his two regular-season losses after that point were in 1-0 and 2-1 games).

 

In 2003, the Braves couldn't be caught, and the Marlins finished 10 games behind first. The Marlins were four games behind Atlanta on Monday afternoon as they packed for the road trip.

 

"We were four games behind Houston [in the wild card] and gained it in a week," Lowell said. "If we keep playing like this, winning series, we'll be in the playoffs. It's not how you start ..."

 

They can do it. They're starting to feel it themselves. They just face obstacles that weren't there in 2003.

 

What do you guys think?

Anything is possible and we're very much still in it. I just hope if one thing holds true from '03 it's the season outcome.

This team was meant to take the division, and at the very least coast to the wild-card. '03 was much sweeter. This is just a case of a team drastically underachieving for much of the first half.

Damn, I was just coming on here to post that :lol .

guys we could be looking at our first division title

 

theres 5 weeks left in the season... we're four and a half back

 

if we gain ONE GAME a week for the rest of the season we can win the division

 

go fish

guys we could be looking at our first division title

 

theres 5 weeks left in the season... we're four and a half back

 

if we gain ONE GAME a week for the rest of the season we can win the division

 

go fish

912141[/snapback]

 

Not to mention we finish the season with three games against Atlanta at home (Sept 30, Oct 1 & 2) and that six of our last nine games are aginst the Braves (with two days off in the mix to boot).

I think it's BS that they mention monday's small crowd, most people can't go to a 1 pm game on a Monday. While it hasn't been great, monday shouldn't be considered an example of our typical small crowd.

True...what was it? about 17,000? Thats pretty good IMO! I went to a 1pm Monday game last year...and it was only about 10,000, lol...fun though! It was vs the D-Backs...we all got Donuts from Krispy Kreme!! :thumbup

True...what was it? about 17,000? Thats pretty good IMO! I went to a 1pm Monday game last year...and it was only about 10,000, lol...fun though! It was vs the D-Backs...we all got Donuts from Krispy Kreme!! :thumbup

912186[/snapback]

 

I was also there--but bad example as I'm pretty sure it was Memorial Day.

lol...I actually remember it...it was like May 24...I remember cause I was pissed too! I had to fly back home here to California a day before Memorial Day...so I missed all the Memorial Day fun there in Miami! I was out there for about 5 days it was :thumbup though as always! *cant wait to go back* Gonna be there in less than a month, gonna catch a game...and just :cool

guys we could be looking at our first division title

 

theres 5 weeks left in the season... we're four and a half back

 

if we gain ONE GAME a week for the rest of the season we can win the division

 

go fish

912141[/snapback]

It's not as simple as you're making it. If Philly, Nats, or Mets get hot it becomes more than just the Braves.

The one thing that bothers me about the constant barrage of insulting comments regarding attendance (which was pretty good overall in the last week) is that reporters and columnists, who are lavished with air conditioning and any manner of creature comforts ("pass me another shrimp cocktail will ya?") refuse to acknowledge how horrendenous the conditions were Monday and many of the other days they use to ridicule the fanbase.

 

I'd like to Hyde or Baxter or Rodriguez, Carpozzi, right on down the line, bring their kids to a Sunday game and sit out in the outfield for nine innings and then see what they have to say.

 

I went through three bottles of water by the fourth inning Monday just to stay alive. I think Marlins management understands, at least Jeffrey Loria who opined after Sunday's game and Vargas' performance that "...it was worth sitting out in the sun, dripping like a wet fish", that August at PPS is unbearable, simply hell on earth.

 

I'll buy outfield reserve or upperdeck seats to any day game that any member of the media wants to attend. The only conditions are they have to bring a child under 12 and they have to stay for nine innings.

 

Then let's hear what they have to say about the fans.

This year would be sweeter for me because I can actually watch the Marlins on Foxsports. 2003 I got half my Marlins news through the newspaper, and it was the first year I started paying attention again after the 1997 firesale. There is no reason we can't take the wild card and possibly the division. 1/2 game out our fate is in our hands, we play everyone we're contending with and we've been playing a lot better recently.