July 26, 200620 yr JP is a free agent at the end of the year, so we'd be giving up prospects for 2 months of him. It's not that simple. Who knows what any trade would involve. This whole thread is just speculation....but if a trade was to occur with the Cubs, the Marlins have a history of geting the best of the deal....to put it mildly.
July 26, 200620 yr i would do it for pinto.. we have plenty of pitching, and one thing we dont have is a CF.. Dtrain would be happy, and I would too Exactly....i like Pinto's potential but he isn't going to crack our rotation anytime soon. We have Petit ranked #1 as far as prospects....then we have an emerging Jose Garcia, and young guns Chris Volstad, Aaron Thompson, Brett Sinkbeil.......not to mention talented minor vets like Jason Vargas, Paul Mildren, and Adam Bostick. Sure send them Pinto!
July 26, 200620 yr i would do it for pinto.. we have plenty of pitching, and one thing we dont have is a CF.. Dtrain would be happy, and I would too Exactly....i like Pinto's potential but he isn't going to crack our rotation anytime soon. We have Petit ranked #1 as far as prospects....then we have an emerging Jose Garcia, and young guns Chris Volstad, Aaron Thompson, Brett Sinkbeil.......not to mention talented minor vets like Jason Vargas, Paul Mildren, and Adam Bostick. Sure send them Pinto! Gaby anyone?
July 26, 200620 yr i would do it for pinto.. we have plenty of pitching, and one thing we dont have is a CF.. Dtrain would be happy, and I would too Exactly....i like Pinto's potential but he isn't going to crack our rotation anytime soon. We have Petit ranked #1 as far as prospects....then we have an emerging Jose Garcia, and young guns Chris Volstad, Aaron Thompson, Brett Sinkbeil.......not to mention talented minor vets like Jason Vargas, Paul Mildren, and Adam Bostick. Sure send them Pinto! Gaby anyone? Forgot our #1 talent in Gaby Hernandez...haha Our team needs a CFer really bad and JP can have all star calibar seasons (hit over 200 hits 3 times in career). I would really like to get him back.
July 26, 200620 yr No If Florida trades for JP, there is no way they would trade Borowksi. Trading for JP is an undeniable sign that they want to contend this year. Maybe Im alone in this one but I believe we can still contend without Joe Borowski. Also seeing what teams like KC, WAS, and CLE got for their relivers freaks me out as Borowski should go for the same price or for more. Yeah I agree. Tank I believe can step into the closers roll. JoBo has been great, but the price for relievers right now is ridiculous and it would be well worth trading him for some quality prospects. There are players who can step in his place and do a pretty good job. If he were traded it basically means Resop gets more innings and I don't really have a problem with that
July 26, 200620 yr No If Florida trades for JP, there is no way they would trade Borowksi. Trading for JP is an undeniable sign that they want to contend this year. Maybe Im alone in this one but I believe we can still contend without Joe Borowski. Also seeing what teams like KC, WAS, and CLE got for their relivers freaks me out as Borowski should go for the same price or for more. Yeah I agree. Tank I believe can step into the closers roll. JoBo has been great, but the price for relievers right now is ridiculous and it would be well worth trading him for some quality prospects. There are players who can step in his place and do a pretty well job. If he were traded it basically means Resop gets more innings and I don't really have a problem with that If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
July 26, 200620 yr I can't see J.Bo going anywhere at this point. I doubt we re-sign him in the offseason like Benitez and Jones...but this year if we make a move, it sounds like it will be one to help the club (like a Cfer).
July 26, 200620 yr JP is a free agent at the end of the year, so we'd be giving up prospects for 2 months of him. It's not that simple. Who knows what any trade would involve. This whole thread is just speculation....but if a trade was to occur with the Cubs, the Marlins have a history of geting the best of the deal....to put it mildly. I would think Hendry would shy away from accepting Pinto back when he gave up Nolasco, Mitre AND Pinto for JP in the first place. I would think he would want, for image reasons, a different name.' That said, now that I'm over being caught up in the emotion of the moment when this first surfaced, and the thoughts of 2003 and how happy Dontrelle (and I'm guessing Miggy) would be being reunited, and hearing "We Ready" at the start of every game, I agree this idea has both a good side and a ad side to it. I think we can do better. But then I say, "sheesh, this has to bring fans back" and then I think "well, for $2-2.5 million we could get a better player as a rental", and I think of his arm, then his speed, then his familiarity with CF, then his motivational contribution...then I think what this means, Loria is serious about winning again this year, then I think of draft picks lost. In short I am so all over the place on this, where I can usually stake out my territory on any issue fairly quickly, on this one I just can't. I guess it comes down to what it symbolizes more than the substance of such a move.
July 26, 200620 yr No If Florida trades for JP, there is no way they would trade Borowksi. Trading for JP is an undeniable sign that they want to contend this year. Maybe Im alone in this one but I believe we can still contend without Joe Borowski. Also seeing what teams like KC, WAS, and CLE got for their relivers freaks me out as Borowski should go for the same price or for more. Yeah I agree. Tank I believe can step into the closers roll. JoBo has been great, but the price for relievers right now is ridiculous and it would be well worth trading him for some quality prospects. There are players who can step in his place and do a pretty good job. If he were traded it basically means Resop gets more innings and I don't really have a problem with that Joe Borowski can easily be replaced and a 1.39 W.H.I.P tells me he is overrated right now and is more Alfonseca than he is Jones, Benitez. I think we can trade Borowski to a team like the Mets, Brewers, Giants for 2-3 good prospects and if need be (yuck ) trade a Bostick, Tyler, Mobley for Pierre New Team C Olivo 1B Jacobs 2B Uggla SS Ramirez 3b Cabrera LF Ross/Williangham CF Pierre RF Hermida CL Tankersley SU Kensing SU Messenger Lefty Vargas ML Resop ML J. Garcia Long man Moehler/Herges/Fulchino Rotation same as it is now
July 26, 200620 yr this would be awesome. JP's trade was the hardest for me to swallow. i'd be thrilled if we could get him back...
July 26, 200620 yr actually if we traded for him and he walks in the offseason we could get draft picks then. Just offer him arby, he should be a type B FA. so that is 2 2nds
July 26, 200620 yr actually if we traded for him and he walks in the offseason we could get draft picks then. Just offer him arby, he should be a type B FA. so that is 2 2nds 2 2nds??
July 26, 200620 yr actually if we traded for him and he walks in the offseason we could get draft picks then. Just offer him arby, he should be a type B FA. so that is 2 2nds Its not that easy. Since he has had another bad year and is already making 7 million(I believe) he is unlikely to decline arby as the best offers he will likely get as a free agent are 2 year deals worth 8-10 million. Even with his bad play if he goes to arby with the Marlins the arbitrator will likely rule in his favor and award him with atelast 8-9 million dollars for a 1 year deal. How many of you see Loria paying that for Pierre? I for one don't care if he pays that I just don't think Pierre is worth that money Also Type B free agents do not bring in 2 picks, they bring in 1 first/second round pick or maybe even later if the signing team signs higher rated players
July 26, 200620 yr In general though, bringing back JP only helps if the marls FO thinks we have a shot at the wild card, otherwise, theres not that much of a problem sacrificing in CF defensively by playing Ross if he keeps hitting well.
July 26, 200620 yr actually if we traded for him and he walks in the offseason we could get draft picks then. Just offer him arby, he should be a type B FA. so that is 2 2nds Its not that easy. Since he has had another bad year and is already making 7 million(I believe) he is unlikely to decline arby as the best offers he will likely get as a free agent are 2 year deals worth 8-10 million. Even with his bad play if he goes to arby with the Marlins the arbitrator will likely rule in his favor and award him with atelast 8-9 million dollars for a 1 year deal. How many of you see Loria paying that for Pierre? I for one don't care if he pays that I just don't think Pierre is worth that money Also Type B free agents do not bring in 2 picks, they bring in 1 first/second round pick or maybe even later if the signing team signs higher rated players I'm confused. The Marlins can just cut him and not offer arbitration, can't they?
July 26, 200620 yr actually if we traded for him and he walks in the offseason we could get draft picks then. Just offer him arby, he should be a type B FA. so that is 2 2nds Its not that easy. Since he has had another bad year and is already making 7 million(I believe) he is unlikely to decline arby as the best offers he will likely get as a free agent are 2 year deals worth 8-10 million. Even with his bad play if he goes to arby with the Marlins the arbitrator will likely rule in his favor and award him with atelast 8-9 million dollars for a 1 year deal. How many of you see Loria paying that for Pierre? I for one don't care if he pays that I just don't think Pierre is worth that money Also Type B free agents do not bring in 2 picks, they bring in 1 first/second round pick or maybe even later if the signing team signs higher rated players I'm confused. The Marlins can just cut him and not offer arbitration, can't they? We don't have to offer arbitration but if we don't then we don't get any compensatory picks when he signs elsewhere. With that said, I wouldn't offer him arbitration. He would probably accept it and be very expensive.
July 26, 200620 yr actually if we traded for him and he walks in the offseason we could get draft picks then. Just offer him arby, he should be a type B FA. so that is 2 2nds Its not that easy. Since he has had another bad year and is already making 7 million(I believe) he is unlikely to decline arby as the best offers he will likely get as a free agent are 2 year deals worth 8-10 million. Even with his bad play if he goes to arby with the Marlins the arbitrator will likely rule in his favor and award him with atelast 8-9 million dollars for a 1 year deal. How many of you see Loria paying that for Pierre? I for one don't care if he pays that I just don't think Pierre is worth that money Also Type B free agents do not bring in 2 picks, they bring in 1 first/second round pick or maybe even later if the signing team signs higher rated players I'm confused. The Marlins can just cut him and not offer arbitration, can't they? We don't have to offer arbitration but if we don't then we don't get any compensatory picks when he signs elsewhere. With that said, I wouldn't offer him arbitration. He would probably accept it and be very expensive. Exactly...He's a rental, that's all.
July 26, 200620 yr actually if we traded for him and he walks in the offseason we could get draft picks then. Just offer him arby, he should be a type B FA. so that is 2 2nds Its not that easy. Since he has had another bad year and is already making 7 million(I believe) he is unlikely to decline arby as the best offers he will likely get as a free agent are 2 year deals worth 8-10 million. Even with his bad play if he goes to arby with the Marlins the arbitrator will likely rule in his favor and award him with atelast 8-9 million dollars for a 1 year deal. How many of you see Loria paying that for Pierre? I for one don't care if he pays that I just don't think Pierre is worth that money Also Type B free agents do not bring in 2 picks, they bring in 1 first/second round pick or maybe even later if the signing team signs higher rated players I'm confused. The Marlins can just cut him and not offer arbitration, can't they? The marlins don't have to offer him arb. If they don't offer him arb., then they can't receive compensatory draft pics. Why trade Pinto for a rental?? He has a ton of upside and is only 24 (b-day in July).
July 26, 200620 yr I wouldn't do it for Pinto. I love JP, but if we're not going to re-sign him or offer him arbitration at the end of the year, why do it? Pinto for a rental is not smart. Why not go after Crawford??? I think Ross in CF is fine. Sure, he doesn't have the range, but JP is not a gold glover by any means. Also, I don't think this would help our offense tremendously. It is not as if JP is tearing the cover off the ball. Oh please....we are loaded at pitching and whatever Beinfest decides to trade I'm sure will make us a better team. Pierre is a career .330 hitter in the minors and a career .302 hitter in the majors. He has a good glove, players and fans love him, and he can steal mega bases. GO GET HIM! Why not go after Crawford? Because I rather give up Pinto for Pierre than Sanchez or Willis for Crawford....thats why! Pierre is an empty .300 hitter with below-average range, a terrible arm, break-even basestealing skills and has extremely poor time adjusting to new challenges. He's not going to live up to the worth of his next contract. He's an improvement over Abercrombie, but so is Ross and a half-dozen others with various levels of talent at 1/15th the price. However soon we may be contenders again, Pierre will certainly not be the catalyst he once was, fans think he was or will be and likely be one of our weakest performers overall. There are certainly better players to fill those extra roles of role model and confidence-generator.
July 26, 200620 yr I don't know why you all are so convinced that if this trade goes through it will only be a rental. As far as I kow, we don't have a CF prospect that could/should be called up next year. If the Marlins do make this deal, I could see them giving him at least a one-year contract extension. As far as having JP back, I am not sure how I feel about it. One thing is certain, this would be an improvement from our current CF situation.
July 26, 200620 yr I don't know why you all are so convinced that if this trade goes through it will only be a rental. As far as I kow, we don't have a CF prospect that could/should be called up next year. If the Marlins do make this deal, I could see them giving him at least a one-year contract extension. As far as having JP back, I am not sure how I feel about it. One thing is certain, this would be an improvement from our current CF situation. He would be an improvement over Reggie, no doubt about that, but I would take my chances with Ross over JP. Isn't JP one of the primary reasons last year's team underperformed?
July 26, 200620 yr Author actually if we traded for him and he walks in the offseason we could get draft picks then. Just offer him arby, he should be a type B FA. so that is 2 2nds Its not that easy. Since he has had another bad year and is already making 7 million(I believe) he is unlikely to decline arby as the best offers he will likely get as a free agent are 2 year deals worth 8-10 million. Even with his bad play if he goes to arby with the Marlins the arbitrator will likely rule in his favor and award him with atelast 8-9 million dollars for a 1 year deal. How many of you see Loria paying that for Pierre? I for one don't care if he pays that I just don't think Pierre is worth that money That "bad" year of Pierre's is getting better by the day... As Ive said, he is hitting .350 his last 36 games and his overall average is back up to .278 This move is truly a no brainer on the part of the Marlins 1) You get a capable CF back in Juan Pierre 2) You show South Fla the Marlins mean business 3) You have another good role model for Hanley, Reggie, and others to look up to... no one can touch JP's work ethic 4) He isnt that much money and Loria happens to really like the guy 5) Dontrelle Willis. I dont even need to explain this one. 6) JP knows the park and he knows the NL East, thats big. 7) Did I mention the fact this puts South Fla on notice that the Marlins are making another run at the playoffs? 8) Reynel Pinto is a nice arm but isnt in the Marlins future plans no brainer.
July 26, 200620 yr why such hate? who cares about the pinto's and the resop's and whoever other PTBNL are included so we lose a pitcher but we get one hell of a ballplayer back, even if its for two months
July 26, 200620 yr I think it's laughable that you wouldn't trade (quite possibly) a player that has no future in South Florida with all of our stud arms to get someone that can not only legitimately help the club, but also provide an emotional and leadership spark.
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