July 15, 200917 yr Yeah you guys are so right. A player with 50RBI is a better run producer than someone with 150. RBI mean nothing. Meaningless stat! Same thing with homeruns. That's right. YEAH! Wooo. That must be that homerism right there coming out. As for Philly being "Pathetic" The franchise being "pathetic". That's all well and good. Let's talk about the about the "fanbase" you have down there in Miami if we want to start trading insults. Now THAT's pathetic. So stuff like this doesn't make you a troll? Ah, my mistake.
July 15, 200917 yr If the ballot is a vote containing all of the Phillies outfielders, Victorino still wouldn't deserve it. Victorino deserved it way more than Werth. Victorino: .309/.375/.464 Werth: .263/.371/.513 Uhuh.
July 17, 200917 yr RBIs depend to a large extent on home runs and on how well a guy does with runners on base. I don't understand why people don't understand this. because it depends to an even larger extent in getting players on base in front of him and for most players, hitting with risp is not a repeatable skill.
July 17, 200917 yr If the ballot is a vote containing all of the Phillies outfielders, Victorino still wouldn't deserve it. Victorino deserved it way more than Werth. Victorino: .309/.375/.464 Werth: .263/.371/.513 Uhuh. What I see there is that Victorino has a higher OBP, and Werth hits for more power (which he should, since he plays in a much more offensive demanding position.) Victorino is 5th in OPS among center fielders, Werth is 7th in OPS among right fielders, plus, Victorino brings better defense. Victorino deserved it more.
July 17, 200917 yr You know I was reading through this topic again. It's kinda funny. FIPhillie: RYAN HOWARD WAS LEADING THE LEAGUE IN HR AND RBI! Person with brain A: He was having a horrible year and RBI are useless when evaluating an individual! FIPhille: THAT'S RIDICULOUS RBI IS WHAT EVERYONE ON ESPN TALKS ABOUT AND SO IT MUST BE IMPORTANT HOW CAN IT POSSIBLY BE A USELESS STAT?! Person with brain B: Because it depends on the rest of the team getting on in front of him. FIPhillie: NO THEY'RE STILL IMPORTANT I WILL NOT REGARD THIS LOGIC BECAUSE I AM STUBBORN AND YOU'RE ALL JUST BEING HOMERS!! Person with brain C: No, really...in order to get RBI he has to have RBI opportunities, which depend on other people not named Ryan Howard. FIPhillie: YEAH RIGHT YOU'RE ALL STUPID I CAN'T ACCEPT THIS BECAUSE IT GOES AGAINST WHAT I ORIGINALLY LEARNED WHILE PLAYING THE GAME AND YOU'RE ALL NECKBEARD STATFAGS WHO NEVER PLAYED BASEBALL! It reminds me of that scene from Family Guy with the Mule. NO KEVIN WASN'T IN FOOTLOOSE! NOPE. EEEHHHAWWW!!!! EEEEHHAAAWWW!!
July 17, 200917 yr If the ballot is a vote containing all of the Phillies outfielders, Victorino still wouldn't deserve it. Victorino deserved it way more than Werth. Victorino: .309/.375/.464 Werth: .263/.371/.513 Uhuh. What I see there is that Victorino has a higher OBP, and Werth hits for more power (which he should, since he plays in a much more offensive demanding position.) Victorino is 5th in OPS among center fielders, Werth is 7th in OPS among right fielders, plus, Victorino brings better defense. Victorino deserved it more. When comparing both players, Werth is better than Victirino.
July 17, 200917 yr You know I was reading through this topic again. It's kinda funny. FIPhillie: RYAN HOWARD WAS LEADING THE LEAGUE IN HR AND RBI! Person with brain A: He was having a horrible year and RBI are useless when evaluating an individual! FIPhille: THAT'S RIDICULOUS RBI IS WHAT EVERYONE ON ESPN TALKS ABOUT AND SO IT MUST BE IMPORTANT HOW CAN IT POSSIBLY BE A USELESS STAT?! Person with brain B: Because it depends on the rest of the team getting on in front of him. FIPhillie: NO THEY'RE STILL IMPORTANT I WILL NOT REGARD THIS LOGIC BECAUSE I AM STUBBORN AND YOU'RE ALL JUST BEING HOMERS!! Person with brain C: No, really...in order to get RBI he has to have RBI opportunities, which depend on other people not named Ryan Howard. FIPhillie: YEAH RIGHT YOU'RE ALL STUPID I CAN'T ACCEPT THIS BECAUSE IT GOES AGAINST WHAT I ORIGINALLY LEARNED WHILE PLAYING THE GAME AND YOU'RE ALL NECKBEARD STATFAGS WHO NEVER PLAYED BASEBALL! It reminds me of that scene from Family Guy with the Mule. NO KEVIN WASN'T IN FOOTLOOSE! NOPE. EEEHHHAWWW!!!! EEEEHHAAAWWW!! Persons with no brain ignore RBIs.
July 17, 200917 yr If the ballot is a vote containing all of the Phillies outfielders, Victorino still wouldn't deserve it. Victorino deserved it way more than Werth. Victorino: .309/.375/.464 Werth: .263/.371/.513 Uhuh. What I see there is that Victorino has a higher OBP, and Werth hits for more power (which he should, since he plays in a much more offensive demanding position.) Victorino is 5th in OPS among center fielders, Werth is 7th in OPS among right fielders, plus, Victorino brings better defense. Victorino deserved it more. The All-Star Game has always been a game that puts corner OF'ers and CF'ers together. Why should it change for Victorino?
July 17, 200917 yr RBIs depend to a large extent on home runs and on how well a guy does with runners on base. I don't understand why people don't understand this. because it depends to an even larger extent in getting players on base in front of him and for most players, hitting with risp is not a repeatable skill. Some players adjust their approaches when hitting with RISP and others don't. The number of runners on a guy has will definitely impact his RBI total but the homeruns he hits and his ability in driving in the runners on also have an impact on the RBI total. How so many people ignore this is beyond me.
July 17, 200917 yr If the ballot is a vote containing all of the Phillies outfielders, Victorino still wouldn't deserve it. Victorino deserved it way more than Werth. Victorino: .309/.375/.464 Werth: .263/.371/.513 Uhuh. What I see there is that Victorino has a higher OBP, and Werth hits for more power (which he should, since he plays in a much more offensive demanding position.) Victorino is 5th in OPS among center fielders, Werth is 7th in OPS among right fielders, plus, Victorino brings better defense. Victorino deserved it more. The All-Star Game has always been a game that puts corner OF'ers and CF'ers together. Why should it change for Victorino? Just because fans vote for outfielders as a whole instead of each position individually doesn't mean you should disregard the position a player plays. That's like saying that if fans voted for "infielders" instead of each individual infield position (1B, 2B, 3B, SS, C), 90% of the team should be made up of first and third basemen since they usually have better stat lines than middle infielders and catchers.
July 17, 200917 yr Just because fans vote for outfielders as a whole instead of each position individually doesn't mean you should disregard the position a player plays. That's like saying that if fans voted for "infielders" instead of each individual infield position (1B, 2B, 3B, SS, C), 90% of the team should be made up of first and third basemen since they usually have better stat lines than middle infielders and catchers. Fans vote for all those positions individually. Fact of the matter is, Werth has better #'s. Fact of the matter is, the All-Star Game has never cared for positions when it comes to outfielders.
July 17, 200917 yr You know I was reading through this topic again. It's kinda funny. FIPhillie: RYAN HOWARD WAS LEADING THE LEAGUE IN HR AND RBI! Person with brain A: He was having a horrible year and RBI are useless when evaluating an individual! FIPhille: THAT'S RIDICULOUS RBI IS WHAT EVERYONE ON ESPN TALKS ABOUT AND SO IT MUST BE IMPORTANT HOW CAN IT POSSIBLY BE A USELESS STAT?! Person with brain B: Because it depends on the rest of the team getting on in front of him. FIPhillie: NO THEY'RE STILL IMPORTANT I WILL NOT REGARD THIS LOGIC BECAUSE I AM STUBBORN AND YOU'RE ALL JUST BEING HOMERS!! Person with brain C: No, really...in order to get RBI he has to have RBI opportunities, which depend on other people not named Ryan Howard. FIPhillie: YEAH RIGHT YOU'RE ALL STUPID I CAN'T ACCEPT THIS BECAUSE IT GOES AGAINST WHAT I ORIGINALLY LEARNED WHILE PLAYING THE GAME AND YOU'RE ALL NECKBEARD STATFAGS WHO NEVER PLAYED BASEBALL! It reminds me of that scene from Family Guy with the Mule. NO KEVIN WASN'T IN FOOTLOOSE! NOPE. EEEHHHAWWW!!!! EEEEHHAAAWWW!! I just let the stats speak for themselves from now on, since that's all that matters to you poindexter. Fastest ever to 200 homers. Shattered the mark 3rd alltime in HR per plate appearance.
July 18, 200917 yr Just because fans vote for outfielders as a whole instead of each position individually doesn't mean you should disregard the position a player plays. That's like saying that if fans voted for "infielders" instead of each individual infield position (1B, 2B, 3B, SS, C), 90% of the team should be made up of first and third basemen since they usually have better stat lines than middle infielders and catchers. Fans vote for all those positions individually. Fact of the matter is, Werth has better #'s. Fact of the matter is, the All-Star Game has never cared for positions when it comes to outfielders. Werth has a better slugging %, that's it. It doesn't matter what positions fans vote for in the all-star game. Victorino is a better all-around player than Werth, and deserved to go to the all-star game more. Period.
July 18, 200917 yr You know I was reading through this topic again. It's kinda funny. FIPhillie: RYAN HOWARD WAS LEADING THE LEAGUE IN HR AND RBI! Person with brain A: He was having a horrible year and RBI are useless when evaluating an individual! FIPhille: THAT'S RIDICULOUS RBI IS WHAT EVERYONE ON ESPN TALKS ABOUT AND SO IT MUST BE IMPORTANT HOW CAN IT POSSIBLY BE A USELESS STAT?! Person with brain B: Because it depends on the rest of the team getting on in front of him. FIPhillie: NO THEY'RE STILL IMPORTANT I WILL NOT REGARD THIS LOGIC BECAUSE I AM STUBBORN AND YOU'RE ALL JUST BEING HOMERS!! Person with brain C: No, really...in order to get RBI he has to have RBI opportunities, which depend on other people not named Ryan Howard. FIPhillie: YEAH RIGHT YOU'RE ALL STUPID I CAN'T ACCEPT THIS BECAUSE IT GOES AGAINST WHAT I ORIGINALLY LEARNED WHILE PLAYING THE GAME AND YOU'RE ALL NECKBEARD STATFAGS WHO NEVER PLAYED BASEBALL! It reminds me of that scene from Family Guy with the Mule. NO KEVIN WASN'T IN FOOTLOOSE! NOPE. EEEHHHAWWW!!!! EEEEHHAAAWWW!! I just let the stats speak for themselves from now on, since that's all that matters to you poindexter. Fastest ever to 200 homers. Shattered the mark 3rd alltime in HR per plate appearance. Since when did I say anything about how good Ryan Howard is? (sans that last post where I was trolling your sarcasm with sarcasm) I'm only talking about your blatant ignorance to the fact that RBI are not a very important individual stat, and then scoffing in the face of logic out of sheer stubbornness.
July 18, 200917 yr Just because fans vote for outfielders as a whole instead of each position individually doesn't mean you should disregard the position a player plays. That's like saying that if fans voted for "infielders" instead of each individual infield position (1B, 2B, 3B, SS, C), 90% of the team should be made up of first and third basemen since they usually have better stat lines than middle infielders and catchers. Fans vote for all those positions individually. Fact of the matter is, Werth has better #'s. Fact of the matter is, the All-Star Game has never cared for positions when it comes to outfielders. Werth has a better slugging %, that's it. It doesn't matter what positions fans vote for in the all-star game. Victorino is a better all-around player than Werth, and deserved to go to the all-star game more. Period. You got any #'s to backup that bold statement? Or are you just going to post your opinion, and pretend it makes more sense b/c you put "period" at the end?
July 18, 200917 yr Just because fans vote for outfielders as a whole instead of each position individually doesn't mean you should disregard the position a player plays. That's like saying that if fans voted for "infielders" instead of each individual infield position (1B, 2B, 3B, SS, C), 90% of the team should be made up of first and third basemen since they usually have better stat lines than middle infielders and catchers. Fans vote for all those positions individually. Fact of the matter is, Werth has better #'s. Fact of the matter is, the All-Star Game has never cared for positions when it comes to outfielders. Werth has a better slugging %, that's it. It doesn't matter what positions fans vote for in the all-star game. Victorino is a better all-around player than Werth, and deserved to go to the all-star game more. Period. You got any #'s to backup that bold statement? Or are you just going to post your opinion, and pretend it makes more sense b/c you put "period" at the end? I guess you have a very short memory. From post #80: Victorino has a better OBP. Victorino ranks 5th in OPS among center fielders, while Werth ranks 7th in OPS among right fielders. Victorino brings better defense. I know you just love to criticize people instead of actually reading though.
July 19, 200917 yr Some players adjust their approaches when hitting with RISP and others don't. The number of runners on a guy has will definitely impact his RBI total but the homeruns he hits and his ability in driving in the runners on also have an impact on the RBI total. How so many people ignore this is beyond me. It'd be super awesome if you could show me more than, say, 5 players who show a repeatable ability to increase their skill in RISP opportunities.
July 20, 200917 yr Manny, Howard, Berkman, Sheff & Pujols For the most part, those guy's OPS differences are based mostly on the fact that they walk way more with RISP. I would say some players do perform better with RISP, but I would also say for the most part guys don't hit better with RISP, and for the most part RBI is context dependent. It's a truly overrated stat. It is mostly based on opportunity, and to hang your hat on it is pretty pointless.
July 27, 200917 yr Manny, Howard, Berkman, Sheff & Pujols For the most part, those guy's OPS differences are based mostly on the fact that they walk way more with RISP. I would say some players do perform better with RISP, but I would also say for the most part guys don't hit better with RISP, and for the most part RBI is context dependent. It's a truly overrated stat. It is mostly based on opportunity, and to hang your hat on it is pretty pointless. We agree some players perform better with RISP. I think those players should be applauded for it. I don't hang my hat on RBIs. Obvioulsy OBP and SLG are waaaaaay more important but RBIs and RISP hitting are things to also consider. Anyway, it takes a person like Tommy Hutton to take Manny's incredible RISP hitting and turn it into a negative as he did the other night.
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