March 8, 200521 yr Mommy and Daddy don't pay my way through. So yes, and extra $200 would make a HUGE difference. 705025[/snapback] yes, obviously $200 would make a difference (see above). no one is arguing that. but again, do you think every college student doing any menial task deserves an extra $200?
March 8, 200521 yr No, not everyone deserves $200, but that's not what a legislator thinks about when conisdering raising the minimum wage.
March 8, 200521 yr How can we attack Congress for giving themselves a raise. If I got to vote for how much money I make, I would always vote for the highest amount of possible. It's the logically thing to do, it's not evil. 704681[/snapback] obviously. its the 'american' way. instead of trying to represent your people and working of ra better america...you give yourself more. truly 'american'
March 8, 200521 yr Mommy and Daddy don't pay my way through.? So yes, and extra $200 would make a HUGE difference. 705025[/snapback] yes, obviously $200 would make a difference (see above). no one is arguing that. but again, do you think every college student doing any menial task deserves an extra $200? 705027[/snapback] Mine is only one example, and probably a bad example since many are far worse off than me in this state who benefit from this amendment. For example, my second job is on a plant nursery just outside of Gainesville (Hawthorne) that employs mostly immigrant laborers from Puerto Rico who make minimum wage. The work is tough and most of these workers have sizeable families back home to support much less the money needed to support themselves. That extra dollar pef hour is worth untold riches to them and their families, so not only does it immediately impact them as individuals but whole communities in other countries. Repeat that story at similiar companies all over Florida and you have a picture of how it helps. Am I an expert economist? No. Can I forecast future effects of the amendment such as inflation or a decrease in jobs? No. All I can tell is what I see from experience and so far it leads me to see this amendment in a positive light. So, not only do pampered college kids like moi benefit from this, but people who actually live at the poverty line with little hope of breaking from it in their lifetimes. I'm not sure if I answered your question, so let me know if not.
March 8, 200521 yr don't funnel all the money out of the economy and want more .. i have no sympathy for the send back home crowd also, in college I never made under $8.50 an hour ... if you are good enough to be in college, you can make more than min wage .. you just need to step away from the copy shop and use the skill that you obviously possess to me the min wage is more about economic impact, than who deserves what ... i think at a point it's good to adjust for the living changes .. it should change with time like everything else however, it shouldn't be increased to the point of economic harm, just so some people can live better (mainly because it can cause a spiral that will cause a lot of people to live worse)
March 8, 200521 yr I disagree, I f***in am a supervisor and i get 7.75/hr. It's not as easy for you as it is for everyone else dood.
March 8, 200521 yr also loans are going pretty free right about now ... it sucks, but i took on a lot of student debt as well .. interest rates are great you can take on $30k in loans w/out it really killing your future earnings (plus the interest is tax deductable) a supervisor of what?! you can make more as an office clerk at a company than a supervising clerk at the campus bookstore or coffee shop especially if it's work study (the huge scam) .. they use that to diminish your total real aide package and waste your time hanging out in the gym or student center for $6/hr get out there and network .. you have to have some sympathetic alumni around do you ever go on internships? ... have them keep you on
March 8, 200521 yr Michael Savage is pushing the increase in the minimum wage. That alone is reason enough to be against it.
March 8, 200521 yr also loans are going pretty free right about now ... it sucks, but i took on a lot of student debt as well .. interest rates are great you can take on $30k in loans w/out it really killing your future earnings (plus the interest is tax deductable) a supervisor of what?! you can make more as an office clerk at a company than a supervising clerk at the campus bookstore or coffee shop especially if it's work study (the huge scam) .. they use that to diminish your total real aide package and waste your time hanging out in the gym or student center for $6/hr get out there and network .. you have to have some sympathetic alumni around do you ever go on internships? ... have them keep you on 705212[/snapback] I supervise the cafe in the campus bookstore
March 8, 200521 yr TINSTAAFL Heinlein used the word word "ain't" in The Moon Is a Harsh Mistress when the acronym was coined. I'm a purist, I'm going to stick with the original TANSTAAFL 704586[/snapback] You're 19 years old and you have such advanced ways of thinking? Why? Sounds like you aren't enjoying your youth.
March 8, 200521 yr I really don't think there's a need to raise the minimum wage at this point. A large raise in the minimum wage would likely hurt, more than help, people in lower income brackets.
March 8, 200521 yr If you own a company and can't afford to pay full-time employees $6 an hour you should close up shop. If it's part-time then there's even less of an excuse since you aren't handing out benefits either.
March 8, 200521 yr You're 19 years old and you have such advanced ways of thinking? Why? Sounds like you aren't enjoying your youth. Sadly, I've squandered my youth on books and learning.
March 8, 200521 yr PhxPhin makes good points, however I have a little more sympathy with the "send-home" crowd.
March 9, 200521 yr The Florida minimum wage hike makes me at least 200 more dollars a year at Kappa Delta, which tremendously helps when you're paying your way through college.? I think only when you exist on the financial margins can you truly gauge the value of such an adjustment.? I may be wrong, but that 200 bucks is quite a lot to me. 704982[/snapback] I agree, the first bush tax cut gave me back close to 200 more than i made the previous year on my return. So paying 200 less in taxes was very useful for a guy paying his way through school. It was a lot for me. As everyone ignored in my previous post, mimimum wage needs to be raised periodically to account for general price increases that happen on a yearly basis. However, a large increase hurts everyone. I hate this whole elitist mentality of things hurting 'the poor'. Many of us on this board are poor. I may not be under the poverty line, but im low enough in the middle class that a minimunm wage increase can cost me or my loved ones their job. A major increase hurts us, not this nebulous 'the poor' people like to mention
March 9, 200521 yr I'm not sure who you're directing the "nebulous poor" comments towards, but they are far from nebulous to me. As I mentioned I work with these immigrant workers (who truly are the backbone of the economy) and even have a drink with them from time to time. If I display an "elitist" attitude about the situation it's not intended. As for your final point I would agree with you, despite my hazy economic knowledge and I believe Senator Kennedy proposed such a large hike (5.15 to 7.25) as a bargaining point, not as a final solution. What do you think?
March 9, 200521 yr I'm not sure who you're directing the "nebulous poor" comments towards, but they are far from nebulous to me. As I mentioned I work with these immigrant workers (who truly are the backbone of the economy) and even have a drink with them from time to time. If I display an "elitist" attitude about the situation it's not intended. As for your final point I would agree with you, despite my hazy economic knowledge and I believe Senator Kennedy proposed such a large hike (5.15 to 7.25) as a bargaining point, not as a final solution. What do you think? 706301[/snapback] 'the nebulous poor' comment wasnt meant for you. But the problem that I have with idealism vs realism is that (and tell me if you agree), if a person says " a minimum wage increase will hurt the poor, or a mimimun wage increase is good b/c it helps the poor' a very important fact is being negated. Will it help the middle and lower middle class, which is where most hard working americans belong. My father owns a small business, he cannot afford a mimimum wage increase. That not only hurts my father who is in the lower middle class, it also hurts the employees. Aside from illegal migrant communities, the legal poor in this country are not the people who are worse off. Its the marginal poor, the people who dont qualify for most benefits, but dont make enough to live well. Furthermore, Kennedy's 2 dollar increase and santorum's proposal are actually pretty similar. Defintely both are just bargaining points from the way i see it
March 9, 200521 yr Most of politics (in this and many other issues) is more than just "hurray for min wage increases!" or "booo for min wage increases!" There are more factors involved than anyone can ever understand. Some will lose out economically and some stand to gain. Aside from that, yes, I do agree that most people have little knowledge of the consequences on the economy if such an increase were to be passed.
March 9, 200521 yr What you have to understand is that raising minimum wage has drawbacks to it. If you raise the minimum wage it might make a employeer fire someone because it is to much money, then unemployment will go up.
March 9, 200521 yr What you have to understand is that raising minimum wage has drawbacks to it. If you raise the minimum wage it might make a employeer fire someone because it is to much money, then unemployment will go up. 706372[/snapback] Yes, I realize that it's not all hunkey dorey, however there are benefits as well.
March 10, 200521 yr What you have to understand is that raising minimum wage has drawbacks to it. If you raise the minimum wage it might make a employeer fire someone because it is to much money, then unemployment will go up. 706372[/snapback] Yes this was mentioned several times in the thread. This is what shamrock and I are discussing. However, miminum wage increases are necessary just that they should be done gradually to prevent economic shock
March 10, 200521 yr I'd like to note how refreshing it is to have an actualy discussion, which was nearly impossible only a few days ago. LoC, you'd be happy to know I visited the Libertarian booth today (it's SG month, so all political parties are out in force) and talked to a few members. I was invited to a meeting of the Ayn Rand society and might check it out.
March 10, 200521 yr Making the FICA "contribution" progressive would accomplish the same thing and not impact employment rates at the bottom end.
March 10, 200521 yr I'd like to note how refreshing it is to have an actualy discussion, which was nearly impossible only a few days ago. LoC, you'd be happy to know I visited the Libertarian booth today (it's SG month, so all political parties are out in force) and talked to a few members. I was invited to a meeting of the Ayn Rand society and might check it out. 706986[/snapback] I'm actually disappointed with many young libertarians nowadays. They just want to smoke weed and end the war in iraq, but completely ignore the economic facotrs which are just as important (and much more important than hitting the reefer)
March 11, 200521 yr I'd like to note how refreshing it is to have an actualy discussion, which was nearly impossible only a few days ago.? LoC, you'd be happy to know I visited the Libertarian booth today (it's SG month, so all political parties are out in force) and talked to a few members.? I was invited to a meeting of the Ayn Rand society and might check it out. 706986[/snapback] I'm actually disappointed with many young libertarians nowadays. They just want to smoke weed and end the war in iraq, but completely ignore the economic facotrs which are just as important (and much more important than hitting the reefer) 707101[/snapback] lol. The funny thing is I went to a NORML meeting later today (just got back) and a few of the people tabling for the campus Libertarians were there. Despite that generalizations arn't the way to go as some of people talking were very passionate about the economics planks of the party.
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