The title of this thread "Behind the Numbers" encompasses many different things. A lot of people look at Jeff Conine's age and they are quick to say he is over the hill at 38 years old. Others look at his stats and say his numbers are not what they once were. The one number people often forget about Conine is the number 2. In the only two World Championships in franchise history -- Jeff Conine was a member of the Florida Marlins. This is in response to the recent talk about trading Conine for a relief pitcher.

 

At 38 years old, Conine is a veteran of the game. Making various stops in different cities throughout his career. But, who is to say 38 is too old to keep going? Julio Franco is 46 and just last week he not only started for the Atlanta Braves -- he batted clean up for them. It's hard to go against anything the Braves do since they have won the National League East for what seems like forever. Maybe they are making the right move afterall. Maybe sometimes age is overrated. Just maybe, it's an excuse for fans to badmouth a player who has given them so much for so many years.

 

Another popular argument about why Conine is nothing more than tradebait for a mediocre reliever at this point in his career is often his statistics. This is a ludicrous argument. Jeff Conine's career averages are as follows: .286 AVG 19 HR 91 RBI .348 OBP. Solid numbers for a career -- now take a look at his numbers in 2004 -- .280 AVG 14 HR 83 RBI .340 OBP. The 2004 numbers were after a rather slow start to the season due to a sinus problem that hindered his work and yet they are still close in every way to his career averages.

 

Recently there have been comments made by Marlins fans that Jeff Conine should be traded for a relief pitcher. A position this team arguably doesn't even need to trade for -- and certainly does not need enough to trade away Mr. Marlin. That same Mr. Marlin who is one of the key reasons -- the Marlins won the 2003 World Series. Sometimes it's not about filling one of your "needs" as much as it is keeping one of the biggest reasons this franchise has a storied history.

 

I'll leave you all with this quote from Jayson Stark's piece during the 2003 playoff run

 

The first hitter Fox faced, Mike Lieberthal, mashed a 2-2 slider to the track in left-center that looked, for a moment, like a game-tying double. But Conine barely hauled it into the webbing of his glove, turning it into a sacrifice fly that cut the lead to only 6-5. It was an out , though. And after Fox had finished wriggling out of the inning with the lead intact, Conine's catch -- and the deal that made him a Marlin -- began looming larger than ever.

 

"It's stuff like that," Fox said, "at times like this, that become your little magic moments. If we win this thing, we're going to look back at plays like that and think, 'That's what got us here.'"

Was that the catch in Philly or the one at PPS?

 

I remember the one in Philly clearly. Me screaming "OMG WHAT A CATCH!" My mom saying, "AHH HAHAHAHAHAHA!"

Hmmm...I haven't even seen any of the talk about trading Conine for a reliever. I guess I've just ignored it or something.

 

You make a bunch of good points.

 

I'll just add that even if you throw out the sentimental reasons for keeping him here, and even if you buy into the unproven idea that Conine's skills have significantly declined, trading him for a mediocre reliever really doesn't make sense. What's more important to the team right now...a capable 4th OF or a capable (at best) 4th or 5th middle reliever?

 

Then throw in the fact that no one's going to trade a good middle reliever for an aging veteran...you probably won't get anything better than what we already have. So, in conclusion, people who want to make this deal would make crappy GMs.

I think you can say Conine is mediocre as a player without it becoming an attack on the person (badmouthing).

The only problem I have with Niner isnt really a problem with him. Because Jack so rarely gets him(and Aguila) at bats, they look pretty rusty in pinch hitting appearances and spot starts(note: only think Aguila gets to do is play in LF in a blowout). I really wish Jack would utilize the bench more.

Kind of off-topic, but since his name was just mentioned, and agreeing with Ramp regarding Jack's use of the bench (sort of because we are winning Jack's way), I really would love to see what Aguila could do if he played with some regularity.

 

As for Conine, there's nothing more I can add to Admin and my dear friend, Mr. Shamster's. When the chips are down, Jeff Conine is one guy I want on my team, whether it be starting or on the bench.

I really would love to see what Aguila could do if he played with some regularity.

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That's why it's almost better if Josh Willingham weren't called up. The man is killing in AAA and his bat is ready for the bigs, but the only hitting he would get to do would be in BP. I mean, he would be behind Chris Aguila, and Aguila gets 1 at bat per week(if lucky).

no way we trade conine, HE'LL BE THE FIRST FISH WHOSE NUMBER IS RETIRED! Also I would love to place a memorial of him in the new ballpark, like a statue or something.

i think that this will be his last season so we might as well get something for him

You're preaching to the choir Admin

I really would love to see what Aguila could do if he played with some regularity.

771749[/snapback]

That's why it's almost better if Josh Willingham weren't called up. The man is killing in AAA and his bat is ready for the bigs, but the only hitting he would get to do would be in BP. I mean, he would be behind Chris Aguila, and Aguila gets 1 at bat per week(if lucky).

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Willy's been playing third at AAA hasn't he?

 

He could be pretty high on the depth charts if he's called up.

I really would love to see what Aguila could do if he played with some regularity.

771749[/snapback]

That's why it's almost better if Josh Willingham weren't called up. The man is killing in AAA and his bat is ready for the bigs, but the only hitting he would get to do would be in BP. I mean, he would be behind Chris Aguila, and Aguila gets 1 at bat per week(if lucky).

771754[/snapback]

 

Willy's been playing third at AAA hasn't he?

 

He could be pretty high on the depth charts if he's called up.

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Yea, Hammer has been playing some 3rd

 

but Jack doesnt use his bench

I really would love to see what Aguila could do if he played with some regularity.

771749[/snapback]

That's why it's almost better if Josh Willingham weren't called up. The man is killing in AAA and his bat is ready for the bigs, but the only hitting he would get to do would be in BP. I mean, he would be behind Chris Aguila, and Aguila gets 1 at bat per week(if lucky).

771754[/snapback]

 

Willy's been playing third at AAA hasn't he?

 

He could be pretty high on the depth charts if he's called up.

771804[/snapback]

Yea, Hammer has been playing some 3rd

 

but Jack doesnt use his bench

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The first thought that came to my head when I read this post was Mike Lowell being benched if thesthis slumper goes on any longer.

he did have a good game the other day and i think that he will get out of this slump very early .

I'm not for or against dealing Conine -- I like having a strong bench -- and quite honestly, I still don't have much faith in Encarnacion becoming a consistent producer. I expect him to drastically cool off thus the need for keeping Conine.

 

That being said, I wouldn't be opposed to dealing Conine (or Encarnacion) to improve other areas. A team with limited finances can't afford the luxury of paying a backup RF $4.5 million. Let Niner play full-time, or let Encarnacion play full time, but I'm afraid that Encarnacions recent dropoff in production will lead McKeon into platooning the two for the rest of this season.

The only problem I have with Niner isnt really a problem with him. Because Jack so rarely gets him(and Aguila) at bats, they look pretty rusty in pinch hitting appearances and spot starts(note: only think Aguila gets to do is play in LF in a blowout). I really wish Jack would utilize the bench more.

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Or at-least use Chris in some pinch-hitting spots, but of course he's blocked by you-know-who...

I really would love to see what Aguila could do if he played with some regularity.

771749[/snapback]

That's why it's almost better if Josh Willingham weren't called up. The man is killing in AAA and his bat is ready for the bigs, but the only hitting he would get to do would be in BP. I mean, he would be behind Chris Aguila, and Aguila gets 1 at bat per week(if lucky).

771754[/snapback]

 

Willy's been playing third at AAA hasn't he?

 

He could be pretty high on the depth charts if he's called up.

771804[/snapback]

Yea, Hammer has been playing some 3rd

 

but Jack doesnt use his bench

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The first thought that came to my head when I read this post was Mike Lowell being benched if thesthis slumper goes on any longer.

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That's where I was going, if Willy keeps tearing it up and Lowell keeps scuffling, you have to wonder what is preventing us from pulling the trigger. I'm not even saying make this the long-term answer, but something has to be done soon...