Marlins2003 Posted September 17, 2003 Share Posted September 17, 2003 You had to see this coming. Every interview with Pavano leading up to last night's game had Pavs focusing on the Boston Blowout, it obviously weighed heavily on him. One can only conclude that he's still shell-shocked, still living the nightmare, still lacking the self-esteem needed by a first line starting pitcher. But that's always been part of the Pavano story. After last night's game and the one in Boston one might conclude if we do ultimately make it to the playoffs and go to a four-man rotation, Pavs will be the odd man out. Pavs doesn't s*ck to comment on the posts I suspect are going to abound in response to this one, his many quality performances throughout the year should dispel any notion of that conclusively. But in the big situations he clearly isn't the first guy in line asking for the ball. It's not his arm, it's his head. It's not his desire, its something else. In his defense, not everyone has that special quality that separates the Shillings or the Johnsons or even the Livan Hernandez from the rest of the pack. He is what he is, a quality number five in just about anyone's starting staff. I hope Carl recovers from this, he still has at least two more starts after this. I suspect, although we'll never know, he might have recovered had the Fish gotten him a couple of runs in the first few innings but they blew their chance to get back into the game early. A tough game and no doubt a tough night for all the guys on the team. If history repeats itself, perhaps the Fish fight back and take at least tonight's game from the Phils. Maybe this is what the team needed, a slap across the face to take them to next level on this learning curve they've all been on. Let's hope something positive comes from this. We're still a half game up, we still have one more game to play than the Phillies and we still close against the Mets at home. We just need to show the baseball gods that we are worthy. And we are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fish Fillet Posted September 17, 2003 Share Posted September 17, 2003 I don't think anyone ever thought of Pavano as anything more than a #5 that backfilled the rotation. Pavs is bullpenned, no doubt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FreshFish Posted September 17, 2003 Share Posted September 17, 2003 Some times the offense needs to score some runs to pick up the pitcher. Our offense is to blame as well. What happenedd to Pavano happens to the best of the best. Pavano is a quality pitcher and we wouldn't be where we are today without him. I think he has the confidence, and I hope he rebounds strongly into his next start. Every ballclub out there, would love to have a Pavano in their staff. Let's not forget that Pav has given this team a chance to win pretty much every time he pitches. On big situations, I don't think any of our pitcher has tested those waters yet. They may perform or they may not perform. We shall see. We are in the playoff in September. The regular season is not over for the fish until a team clinches the WC. 5th Starter? Pavano, - Leads team in innings pitched - Leads team in Quality Starts with 20 - Has less walks, and the best walks to innings pitched ratio I think this a year where the Fish have 5 quality pitchers. I wouldn't call anyone a 5th starter on the fish staff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shamrock Posted September 17, 2003 Share Posted September 17, 2003 Just about everyone EXCEPT Beckett is a candidate for the pen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fish Fillet Posted September 17, 2003 Share Posted September 17, 2003 Just about everyone EXCEPT Beckett is a candidate for the pen. That's a joke, right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJBurnett34 Posted September 17, 2003 Share Posted September 17, 2003 I think Pavz will bounce back. He has had a rough career and has finally felt comftable here. When he goes to the Pen next year he will develop into an even better pitcher. Our bullpen would be alot better when AJ comes bacl. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
g8trz2003 Posted September 17, 2003 Share Posted September 17, 2003 That's a joke, right? who has been solid as of late? Pavs? Penny? Willis? Redman? Beckett has been the only one to solidify his spot in the postseason rotation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJBurnett34 Posted September 17, 2003 Share Posted September 17, 2003 No one in the Starting rotation is a candidate. Only Pavz. We cant any of our starters in the rotation... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
g8trz2003 Posted September 17, 2003 Share Posted September 17, 2003 we're gonna rotate all 5 pitchers through the playoffs? I think not. McKeon's got himself a tough decision. Beckett is definitely in there. I guess Willis is in there. And then you must decide between Penny, Redman, and Pavs. Penny has been pitchin good, but we dont know how he will do after this injury. If Redman was pitching like he did earlier in the year, he would be a lock. And Pavs has been great until this game. Like someone said, he leads the team in IP and Quality starts. Should he really be sent to the bullpen? I think, if Penny recovers from this injury nicely, then our top 3 should be: 1) Beckett 2) Willis 3) Penny 4) Redman or Pavz in the spot 4th start (i.e. Tony Saunders of 97). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
g8trz2003 Posted September 17, 2003 Share Posted September 17, 2003 oops...I guess Saunders was a spot 5th starter wasnt he? Hmm...well that makes things more complicated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrlngrl34 Posted September 17, 2003 Share Posted September 17, 2003 wow, just yesterday there was a thread of Pavano performing excellent. Now this? Whoever says he is still "shellshocked" from Boston, needs to check what Pavano has done since Boston up to yesterday. His ERA is very good actually. Before yesterday it was 3.96 . Now 4.16. Not bad either way. You guys are overreacting and need to check yourself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marlins2003 Posted September 17, 2003 Author Share Posted September 17, 2003 wow, just yesterday there was a thread of Pavano performing excellent. Now this? Whoever says he is still "shellshocked" from Boston, needs to check what Pavano has done since Boston up to yesterday. His ERA is very good actually. Before yesterday it was 3.96 . Now 4.16. Not bad either way. You guys are overreacting and need to check yourself. I hope none of you would read into my post that I am down on Pavs because I tried to make clear he's done an excellent job for the Fish this year and he could pitch for just any team in baseball. I hope he's a Marlin next year. Having seen a few tv snipets, from interviews with him, and read several more, the recurring thing "he" brought up was being shelled in Boston. Clearly it was still on his mind. What Pavano has done this season is not the point (at least of this thread). Anyone who watched last nights game had to recognize that "deer in the headlights" look on his face after the third hit in the first inning. You or anyone else here can disagree but that's my interpretation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hotcorner Posted September 17, 2003 Share Posted September 17, 2003 Actually I figured they'd drop one of either Pavano or Penny to the bullpen, depending upon who was hotter at the time. I don't have much faith in Penny usually, but he seems like he's been more consistent lately so I figure Pavano would be the fifth starter & likely go to the pen. In his defense, despite the 4 runs he gave up in the first inning, he was still going in the fifth without giving up another run (if Enc catches that ball). His pitch count was up so he couldn't have gone much further, but the offense couldn't make a game out of it anyway so it was moot. I keep thinking what if that ball hadn't taken a wild hop on Alex in the first inning & they turn that double-play... Oh well, Pavs has been real solid this season for a #5 starter, given them innings and been healthy. Can't ask for much more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonnylons Posted September 17, 2003 Share Posted September 17, 2003 Pavano is a very, very good pitcher who will only get better in time. This is really, his first full season. Is he suffering from some kind of mental breakdown? No confidence? Possibly, but that is a little harder to gauge because we are not in the circle. I think Pavano has done an excellent job IF he is suffering from confidence issues - and surely he would be aware of that. but sometimes, inadequate feelings lead to greatness. You will never be satisfied. Pavano may not be in that role, but he certainly has the tools to be very good. Give the guy a break, one bad game doesnt end his career. Besides, he is resilient, he has come back from being a phenom to career threating injury to starter on a winning ballclub. As for the postseason roster - lets at least win 1 game against the Phils before we start hyping ourselves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FreshFish Posted September 17, 2003 Share Posted September 17, 2003 "As for the postseason roster - lets at least win 1 game against the Phils before we start hyping ourselves." agree 100% Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CapeFish Posted September 17, 2003 Share Posted September 17, 2003 Postseason roster means nothing until after Sept. 28th at 12 am Sept. 29th. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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