They dont call him The Gambler for nothing.

 

 

 

 

 

My two cents, he's filthy dirty right now with or without doctoring the baseball.

 

 

It was wet in detroit, so no moisture issues with the cold. They made him wash his hands, and he because even harder to hit.

Woody Paige had an interesting take today. He said the sh*t on his hands was more of a distraction for him to be able to go to his cap many times ala a good magician distracting those watching.

 

Not saying he is right, or even close to it, just thought it was interesting.

 

He also said cheating is a part of baseball. And he is 100% correct.

Pine Tar is illegal for batters aswell?

After thinking about it the last couple of days, i've come to the conclusion that he probably

just had a serious case of mud butt before the game and it got on his hand when

he was trying to wipe.

After thinking about it the last couple of days, i've come to the conclusion that he probably

just had a serious case of mud butt before the game and it got on his hand when

he was trying to wipe.

If you go by that theory then he had major mud butt in the ALDS and ALCS :lol

 

Senor Poopie Pants.

Am I the only one who believes MLB should look into the possibilty of allowing pine tar and other substances to be used by pitchers?

 

But then again, if I were commish my strike zone would be 2 feet across....

Am I the only one who believes MLB should look into the possibilty of allowing pine tar and other substances to be used by pitchers?

 

But then again, if I were commish my strike zone would be 2 feet across....

 

Anything hitters use for an advantage should be available to pitchers as well. I agree with you.

Am I the only one who believes MLB should look into the possibilty of allowing pine tar and other substances to be used by pitchers?

 

But then again, if I were commish my strike zone would be 2 feet across....

 

Anything hitters use for an advantage should be available to pitchers as well. I agree with you.

 

Pine tar is a substantially greater benefit to pitchers than to hitters.

 

Pine tar doesn't hit the ball farther, it just makes it easier to keep the bat in the hitters hands. For a pitcher, it adds several inches of break on a curveball and an assload of unnatural movement.

 

I don't know how many people have played baseball (by that I mean highschool/college) but what looks easily discernable to a spectator is a world of difference from what you see in the batters box. The only thing you have to use is the spin of the seams, adding anything extra makes movement unnatural and pitches virtually undistinguishable, and therefore unhittable. Allowing foreign substances on a ball is moronic, especially if the motivation is "well, if a hitter can put pinetar on his bat..."

Allowing foreign substances on a ball is moronic, especially if the motivation is "well, if a hitter can put pinetar on his bat..."

I'm with you; it's not at all the same. A batter can use a small amount of pine tar to get a grip on a piece of lumber that they are swinging at a high rate of velocity with no intention to release. If nothing else, the pine tar on the HANDLE of a bat assists with safety. Pine tar is NOT allowed on the barrel of the bat, however, as that does give a batter an edge.

 

With a pitcher, foreign substances like pine tar, spit, and vaseline are used to create an unnatural movement in a pitch. If you look at the fingers of a dominating pitcher like Pedro Martinez, you will see callouses on the tips of their fingers. These callouses are created by the finger push in the final nanoseconds of their pitching motion. Having pine tar would allow that pitcher to put an unnatural spin on a ball during that moment that gives him an unfair advantage. Now, all of a sudden, a flick of the pointer finger drastically changes a pitch compared to no flick or a flick of the middle finger using the same exact motion, arm slot, and pitching angle. Those are the only three tools a batter has to prepare himself for whatever pitch is coming. Those tools and a memory bank of the motion of previous pitches. If a batter doesn't have these tools, they may as well be swinging blindly. And this, my friends, is why you think pitching machines blow... :mischief

My take on this Rogers thing is it's a non-event. FOX is just doing it's best to inject some interest into an other wise boring World Series.

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Rogers apparantly had something on his hand. He still pitched 7 innings after that with nothing on his hand. Of course it might have been elsewhere, but the Cards pitcher might have had an "edge" as well. This is all part of the game. It happens with many, many pitchers. Hitters use "illegal" edges as well.

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Rogers has been pitching well all year. It appears that in last year's off-season he sold his soul to the devil. He's a beast, after years of being a schmeg.

Allowing foreign substances on a ball is moronic, especially if the motivation is "well, if a hitter can put pinetar on his bat..."

I'm with you; it's not at all the same. A batter can use a small amount of pine tar to get a grip on a piece of lumber that they are swinging at a high rate of velocity with no intention to release. If nothing else, the pine tar on the HANDLE of a bat assists with safety. Pine tar is NOT allowed on the barrel of the bat, however, as that does give a batter an edge.

 

No it doesn't.

 

That's an antiquated rule that was implemented to keep balls clean and keep balls reusable thus keeping costs down. The whole "pine tar line" on the bat is nothing more than a symbol, there's absolutely zero advantage to having pine tar higher than that line, or on the barrel.

Rogers has been pitching well all year. It appears that in last year's off-season he sold his soul to the devil. He's a beast, after years of being a schmeg.

 

 

No, he's a cheater, after years of being a schmeg.

Allowing foreign substances on a ball is moronic, especially if the motivation is "well, if a hitter can put pinetar on his bat..."

I'm with you; it's not at all the same. A batter can use a small amount of pine tar to get a grip on a piece of lumber that they are swinging at a high rate of velocity with no intention to release. If nothing else, the pine tar on the HANDLE of a bat assists with safety. Pine tar is NOT allowed on the barrel of the bat, however, as that does give a batter an edge.

 

No it doesn't.

 

That's an antiquated rule that was implemented to keep balls clean and keep balls reusable thus keeping costs down. The whole "pine tar line" on the bat is nothing more than a symbol, there's absolutely zero advantage to having pine tar higher than that line, or on the barrel.

You may be right about pine tar being a greater benefit to pitchers but how can you make a substance legal to hitters but not to pitchers? One of the many rules in the MLB I don't agree with. I say either make it legal for both or outlaw it period.

Allowing foreign substances on a ball is moronic, especially if the motivation is "well, if a hitter can put pinetar on his bat..."

I'm with you; it's not at all the same. A batter can use a small amount of pine tar to get a grip on a piece of lumber that they are swinging at a high rate of velocity with no intention to release. If nothing else, the pine tar on the HANDLE of a bat assists with safety. Pine tar is NOT allowed on the barrel of the bat, however, as that does give a batter an edge.

 

No it doesn't.

 

That's an antiquated rule that was implemented to keep balls clean and keep balls reusable thus keeping costs down. The whole "pine tar line" on the bat is nothing more than a symbol, there's absolutely zero advantage to having pine tar higher than that line, or on the barrel.

You may be right about pine tar being a greater benefit to pitchers but how can you make a substance legal to hitters but not to pitchers? One of the many rules in the MLB I don't agree with. I say either make it legal for both or outlaw it period.

 

Do you not comprehend the difference?

 

Pine tar used on a bat handle might as well be a completely different substance than pine tar put on a ball.

 

Pine tar on a bat changes absolutely nothing from how far the ball goes or how hard it is hit. Pine tar on a ball (or vaseline, KY jelly, suntan lotion, etc) completely changes the movement and spin of a ball.

Rogers has been pitching well all year. It appears that in last year's off-season he sold his soul to the devil. He's a beast, after years of being a schmeg.

 

 

No, he's a cheater, after years of being a schmeg.

According to your strict definition of a cheat, we'd have to eliminate about 70-80% of the MLB players....at least according to player and coach reports mainly after the fact. Between performance enhancing drugs, pine tar or other foreign substances, the majority of players would be gone. Open your eyes. Everybody's doing(the fish). There was a key Marlins bullpen pitcher in 1997 who absolutely abused the non-enforcment of this "rule" that is rarely to never enforced. It's part of the game. I do draw a line between steroids and other substances that you ingest, inject, or spread on. These can cause physical harm, and should not be tolerated as it can influence children. Otherwise, doctoring the ball is akin to intentionally hitting a batter, which is also part of the game. Get away with it if you can is what the majority of pitchers do.

Pine tar on a bat changes absolutely nothing from how far the ball goes or how hard it is hit.

Pine tar on the barrel, however, gives a batter an advantage in bunt situations. That is why it is not allowed past the handle.

 

Just as an FYI, here's the official rule:

MLB Rule Book

Rule 1.10 C

The bat handle, for not more than 18 inches from its end, may be covered or treated with any material or substance to improve the grip. Any such material or substance, which extends past the 18 inch limitation, shall cause the bat to be removed from the game.

Ask George Brett. He can tell you all about it. :mischief

Rogers has been pitching well all year. It appears that in last year's off-season he sold his soul to the devil. He's a beast, after years of being a schmeg.

 

 

No, he's a cheater, after years of being a schmeg.

According to your strict definition of a cheat, we'd have to eliminate about 70-80% of the MLB players....at least according to player and coach reports mainly after the fact. Between performance enhancing drugs, pine tar or other foreign substances, the majority of players would be gone. Open your eyes. Everybody's doing(the fish). There was a key Marlins bullpen pitcher in 1997 who absolutely abused the non-enforcment of this "rule" that is rarely to never enforced. It's part of the game. I do draw a line between steroids and other substances that you ingest, inject, or spread on. These can cause physical harm, and should not be tolerated as it can influence children. Otherwise, doctoring the ball is akin to intentionally hitting a batter, which is also part of the game. Get away with it if you can is what the majority of pitchers do.

 

Sure, cheating has been a part of the game for most of its history. The key is whether or not a player is caught. Rogers was only "semi-caught" since the umps didn't really investigate. But with all of the attention that will be on Rogers during Game 6 after he seemingly doctored the ball a couple nights ago, it will be interesting to see how much longer his postseason scoreless inning streak lasts.

Cheating is cheating. I don't care if everyone does it. Do I blame Rogers? Hell no. He got away with it. Welcome to America.

 

LaRussa is the real jackass for not doing anything about it.

Rogers has been pitching well all year. It appears that in last year's off-season he sold his soul to the devil. He's a beast, after years of being a schmeg.

 

 

No, he's a cheater, after years of being a schmeg.

According to your strict definition of a cheat, we'd have to eliminate about 70-80% of the MLB players....at least according to player and coach reports mainly after the fact. Between performance enhancing drugs, pine tar or other foreign substances, the majority of players would be gone. Open your eyes. Everybody's doing(the fish). There was a key Marlins bullpen pitcher in 1997 who absolutely abused the non-enforcment of this "rule" that is rarely to never enforced. It's part of the game. I do draw a line between steroids and other substances that you ingest, inject, or spread on. These can cause physical harm, and should not be tolerated as it can influence children. Otherwise, doctoring the ball is akin to intentionally hitting a batter, which is also part of the game. Get away with it if you can is what the majority of pitchers do.

 

Sure, cheating has been a part of the game for most of its history. The key is whether or not a player is caught. Rogers was only "semi-caught" since the umps didn't really investigate. But with all of the attention that will be on Rogers during Game 6 after he seemingly doctored the ball a couple nights ago, it will be interesting to see how much longer his postseason scoreless inning streak lasts.

Rogers is on a roll. I imagine he'll pitch in game 6 the same way he pitched in innings 2-7 the other night. I expect he'll win, and I expect Carpenter will win both of his starts. The only possible fly in the ointment is some over-management by LaRussa.

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.As I see it, the key to this series are the other 3 games. The Cards have already won 1 of them.

Allowing foreign substances on a ball is moronic, especially if the motivation is "well, if a hitter can put pinetar on his bat..."

I'm with you; it's not at all the same. A batter can use a small amount of pine tar to get a grip on a piece of lumber that they are swinging at a high rate of velocity with no intention to release. If nothing else, the pine tar on the HANDLE of a bat assists with safety. Pine tar is NOT allowed on the barrel of the bat, however, as that does give a batter an edge.

 

No it doesn't.

 

That's an antiquated rule that was implemented to keep balls clean and keep balls reusable thus keeping costs down. The whole "pine tar line" on the bat is nothing more than a symbol, there's absolutely zero advantage to having pine tar higher than that line, or on the barrel.

 

Doesn't it make the bat harder thus causing the hit balls to go further?

Allowing foreign substances on a ball is moronic, especially if the motivation is "well, if a hitter can put pinetar on his bat..."

I'm with you; it's not at all the same. A batter can use a small amount of pine tar to get a grip on a piece of lumber that they are swinging at a high rate of velocity with no intention to release. If nothing else, the pine tar on the HANDLE of a bat assists with safety. Pine tar is NOT allowed on the barrel of the bat, however, as that does give a batter an edge.

 

No it doesn't.

 

That's an antiquated rule that was implemented to keep balls clean and keep balls reusable thus keeping costs down. The whole "pine tar line" on the bat is nothing more than a symbol, there's absolutely zero advantage to having pine tar higher than that line, or on the barrel.

 

Doesn't it make the bat harder thus causing the hit balls to go further?

 

 

:lol :lol :lol

 

No.

 

 

Pine tar on a bat changes absolutely nothing from how far the ball goes or how hard it is hit.

Pine tar on the barrel, however, gives a batter an advantage in bunt situations. That is why it is not allowed past the handle.

 

Proof?

 

Seriously, it was instituted only to keep balls clean. There's not any advantage for the batter.

:lol :lol :lol

 

No.

 

Ok. Thanks.

Cheating is cheating. I don't care if everyone does it. Do I blame Rogers? Hell no. He got away with it. Welcome to America.

 

LaRussa is the real jackass for not doing anything about it.

 

La Russa doing something about it likely would have resulted in everyone then being closely scrutinized and perhaps that was in no one's best interest. It is damn cold out there.

Pine tar on the barrel, however, gives a batter an advantage in bunt situations. That is why it is not allowed past the handle.

Proof?Proof? I thought you played baseball? Or did you only play with aluminum?

 

Pick up a wooden bat and drop down 5 bunts in a row. Now add pine tar to the sweet spot and drop down 5 bunts in a row. The difference will be obvious. It is especially helpfull in drag bunt situations.