February 23, 200719 yr Seriously. South Florida doesn't support the team enough to justify ruling out Central Florida. And no, it's distance from Tampa isn't a factor. Playing in Orlando would allow for a large fanbase, and for visiting tourists to get to go the games and become fans.
February 23, 200719 yr and how are alot of us gona see the games? or maybe even be able to watch them?
February 23, 200719 yr and for visiting tourists to get to go the games and become fans. Right, because people become fans of teams in places they visit.....and Orlando is a more popular destination than Miami and Ft. Lauderdale..... :blink:
February 23, 200719 yr Seriously. South Florida doesn't support the team enough to justify ruling out Central Florida. And no, it's distance from Tampa isn't a factor. Playing in Orlando would allow for a large fanbase, and for visiting tourists to get to go the games and become fans. I quote Tony Montana "No...F*** no".
February 23, 200719 yr Author and how are alot of us gona see the games? or maybe even be able to watch them? Are you kidding? Obviously the fan base isn't strong enough down there, why not try a place that would actually embrace a major league team. The Marlins need REVENUE that they aren't getting right now. You can watch the game on TV, like the majority of Floridians that care about the Marlins. And if you think Orlando isn't as popular as Miami and Fort Lauderdale for vacation, do some research. From a 2004 American Society of Travel Agents Press Release: According to the American Society of Travel Agents (ASTA)/Fodor`s Winter Hot Spots Survey, travelers are returning to popular domestic destinations during the 2003-2004 winter season. Orlando, Las Vegas and New York City are once again the top three locations for Americans.? 2003-2004 Top Destination % of Total 1. Orlando 23.0 2. Las Vegas 21.3 3. New York 9.4 4. Miami 4.2 5. Honolulu 4.0 6. Phoenix 4.0 http://www.astanet.com/news/releasearchive04/01_29_04.asp 7. Los Angeles 8. Denver 9. San Diego 10. Hawaii http://www.travelsense.org/destinations/hotspots.asp --------------------------------------------------------- The American Society of Travel Agents' (ASTA)/ Fodor's Summer Hot Spots Survey of popularity of U.S. city destinations for the summer of 2003 Orlando (24.8 %) Las Vegas (22.2 %) New York (8.9 %) San Francisco (7.3 %) Honolulu (6.2 %) Los Angeles (3.8 %) San Diego (3.6 %) Seattle (2.4 %) Miami (2.3 %) Phoenix (2.1 %) http://www.travelcomexpo.com/travelcomrepo...sp?IssueID=1025 --------------------------------------------------------- Top 10 Domestic Destinations: 2004 1 - Las Vegas, NV 85.0% 2 - Orlando, FL 77.0% 3 - Maui, HI 54.7% 4 - Honolulu, HI 49.1% 5 - Phoenix/Scottsdale, AZ 23.7% 6 - New York City, NY 23.3% 7 (tie) - Anchorage, AK 15.7% 7 (tie) - Fort Myers, FL 15.7% 9 - San Francisco, CA 14.3% 10 - Los Angeles, CA 10.5% Top 10 Domestic Destinations: 2003* 1 - Las Vegas, NV 80% 2 - Orlando, FL 66% 3 - AK Cruisetours 52% 4 (tie) - Honolulu, HI 50% 4 (tie) - Maui, HI 50% 6 - New York City, NY 25% 7 - Kauai, HI 18% 8 (tie) - Fort Myers, FL 13% 8 (tie) - Phoenix/Scottsdale, AZ 13% 10 - Los Angeles, CA 11% Source: Carlson Wagonlit Travel Associates' 2004 Travel Trends Survey ?Carlson Wagonlit Travel Associates' 2004 Travel Trends Survey is the travel agency powerhouse's most comprehensive survey to date, also offers insight into current leisure travel trends, such as the increasing popularity of cruising. The survey, conducted October 20 - November 19, 2003? Yahoo News http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/040102/cgf007_1.html --------------------------------------------------------- According to the United States Tour Operators Association: Top United States Destinations 1. Las Vegas 2. Orlando 3. Various California Disneyland, San Francisco, and Yosemite cited. United States Tour Operators Association http://www.ustoa.com/_docs/surveytable.doc --------------------------------------------------------- Here is another list of the 10 most visited cities in the United States. Orlando, Florida Las Vegas, Nevada New York, New York San Francisco, California Los Angeles, California New Orleans, Louisiana Phoenix, Arizona Miami, Florida San Diego, California Seattle, Washington http://www.cheap-airline-tickets-now.com/trips.html --------------------------------------------------------- CNN Travel November 2003 ?A survey of American Express travel agents reported that they expect Honolulu, Orlando, New York City, Las Vegas and Miami to be the top U.S. destinations for the rest of the year. Hawaii also tops the list of U.S. destinations in 2004. Next year, agents said they expect Hawaii, Alaska, Las Vegas, New York City and Orlando to be the top destinations.? http://www.cnn.com/2003/TRAVEL/11/10/travel.survey.ap/ Top 50 Destinations of the Year: 2006 50. Krakow 49. Rio de Janeiro 48. Phoenix 47. Auckland 46. Ayers Rock 45. Dallas 44. Zurich 43. Brisbane 42. Berlin 41. Nassau 40. Salzburg 39. Edinburgh 38. Vancouver 37. Prague 36. Milan 35. Punta Cana 34. Montreal 33. Toronto 32. San Diego 31. Cancun 30. Anaheim - Buena Park 29. Cairns 28. Dubai 27. Munich 26. Bangkok 25. Tokyo 24. Madrid 23. Dublin 22. Vienna 21. Chicago 20. Venice 19. Oahu 18. Miami 17. Boston 16. Florence 15. Hong Kong 14. Barcelona 13. Melbourne 12. Washington D.C. 11. Los Angeles 10. Orlando 9. San Francisco 8. Sydney 7. Singapore 6. Amsterdam 5. Las Vegas 4. London 3. Rome 2. Paris 1. New York City --------------------------------------------------------- Hawaii tops the list of destinations where American travelers plan to go in 2004, according to a survey released yesterday. The survey of American Express travel agents also indicated that Honolulu; Orlando, Fla.; New York, Las Vegas and Miami are expected to be the top U.S. destinations for the rest of the year. Star Bulletin: October 2003 http://starbulletin.com/2003/10/23/business/story2.html http://www.hotwire.com/destination/travel-value-index2.jsp
February 23, 200719 yr That's like saying Las Vegas would be a great place for professional sports because of all of the tourist that come through town. You think somebody from BFE is going to give a damn enough to go out and watch the Marlins after spending hundreds of dollars with their familes at Disney?
February 23, 200719 yr and how are alot of us gona see the games? or maybe even be able to watch them? Are you kidding? Obviously the fan base isn't strong enough down there, why not try a place that would actually embrace a major league team. The Marlins need REVENUE that they aren't getting right now. You can watch the game on TV, like the majority of Floridians that care about the Marlins. And if you think Orlando isn't as popular as Miami and Fort Lauderdale for vacation, do some research. From a 2004 American Society of Travel Agents Press Release: According to the American Society of Travel Agents (ASTA)/Fodor`s Winter Hot Spots Survey, travelers are returning to popular domestic destinations during the 2003-2004 winter season. Orlando, Las Vegas and New York City are once again the top three locations for Americans.? 2003-2004 Top Destination % of Total 1. Orlando 23.0 2. Las Vegas 21.3 3. New York 9.4 4. Miami 4.2 5. Honolulu 4.0 6. Phoenix 4.0 http://www.astanet.com/news/releasearchive04/01_29_04.asp 7. Los Angeles 8. Denver 9. San Diego 10. Hawaii http://www.travelsense.org/destinations/hotspots.asp --------------------------------------------------------- The American Society of Travel Agents' (ASTA)/ Fodor's Summer Hot Spots Survey of popularity of U.S. city destinations for the summer of 2003 Orlando (24.8 %) Las Vegas (22.2 %) New York (8.9 %) San Francisco (7.3 %) Honolulu (6.2 %) Los Angeles (3.8 %) San Diego (3.6 %) Seattle (2.4 %) Miami (2.3 %) Phoenix (2.1 %) http://www.travelcomexpo.com/travelcomrepo...sp?IssueID=1025 --------------------------------------------------------- Top 10 Domestic Destinations: 2004 1 - Las Vegas, NV 85.0% 2 - Orlando, FL 77.0% 3 - Maui, HI 54.7% 4 - Honolulu, HI 49.1% 5 - Phoenix/Scottsdale, AZ 23.7% 6 - New York City, NY 23.3% 7 (tie) - Anchorage, AK 15.7% 7 (tie) - Fort Myers, FL 15.7% 9 - San Francisco, CA 14.3% 10 - Los Angeles, CA 10.5% Top 10 Domestic Destinations: 2003* 1 - Las Vegas, NV 80% 2 - Orlando, FL 66% 3 - AK Cruisetours 52% 4 (tie) - Honolulu, HI 50% 4 (tie) - Maui, HI 50% 6 - New York City, NY 25% 7 - Kauai, HI 18% 8 (tie) - Fort Myers, FL 13% 8 (tie) - Phoenix/Scottsdale, AZ 13% 10 - Los Angeles, CA 11% Source: Carlson Wagonlit Travel Associates' 2004 Travel Trends Survey ?Carlson Wagonlit Travel Associates' 2004 Travel Trends Survey is the travel agency powerhouse's most comprehensive survey to date, also offers insight into current leisure travel trends, such as the increasing popularity of cruising. The survey, conducted October 20 - November 19, 2003? Yahoo News http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/040102/cgf007_1.html --------------------------------------------------------- According to the United States Tour Operators Association: Top United States Destinations 1. Las Vegas 2. Orlando 3. Various California Disneyland, San Francisco, and Yosemite cited. United States Tour Operators Association http://www.ustoa.com/_docs/surveytable.doc --------------------------------------------------------- Here is another list of the 10 most visited cities in the United States. Orlando, Florida Las Vegas, Nevada New York, New York San Francisco, California Los Angeles, California New Orleans, Louisiana Phoenix, Arizona Miami, Florida San Diego, California Seattle, Washington http://www.cheap-airline-tickets-now.com/trips.html --------------------------------------------------------- CNN Travel November 2003 ?A survey of American Express travel agents reported that they expect Honolulu, Orlando, New York City, Las Vegas and Miami to be the top U.S. destinations for the rest of the year. Hawaii also tops the list of U.S. destinations in 2004. Next year, agents said they expect Hawaii, Alaska, Las Vegas, New York City and Orlando to be the top destinations.? http://www.cnn.com/2003/TRAVEL/11/10/travel.survey.ap/ Top 50 Destinations of the Year: 2006 50. Krakow 49. Rio de Janeiro 48. Phoenix 47. Auckland 46. Ayers Rock 45. Dallas 44. Zurich 43. Brisbane 42. Berlin 41. Nassau 40. Salzburg 39. Edinburgh 38. Vancouver 37. Prague 36. Milan 35. Punta Cana 34. Montreal 33. Toronto 32. San Diego 31. Cancun 30. Anaheim - Buena Park 29. Cairns 28. Dubai 27. Munich 26. Bangkok 25. Tokyo 24. Madrid 23. Dublin 22. Vienna 21. Chicago 20. Venice 19. Oahu 18. Miami 17. Boston 16. Florence 15. Hong Kong 14. Barcelona 13. Melbourne 12. Washington D.C. 11. Los Angeles 10. Orlando 9. San Francisco 8. Sydney 7. Singapore 6. Amsterdam 5. Las Vegas 4. London 3. Rome 2. Paris 1. New York City --------------------------------------------------------- Hawaii tops the list of destinations where American travelers plan to go in 2004, according to a survey released yesterday. The survey of American Express travel agents also indicated that Honolulu; Orlando, Fla.; New York, Las Vegas and Miami are expected to be the top U.S. destinations for the rest of the year. Star Bulletin: October 2003 http://starbulletin.com/2003/10/23/business/story2.html http://www.hotwire.com/destination/travel-value-index2.jsp haha those people are laughing now....MLB picked the wrong city (Orlando is much better than Tampa) but baseball is needed in Miami because of the hispanic population but they need to get the stadium deal done now...this is getting crazy. That's like saying Las Vegas would be a great place for professional sports because of all of the tourist that come through town. You think somebody from BFE is going to give a damn enough to go out and watch the Marlins after spending hundreds of dollars with their familes at Disney? Yes.....I work for Marriott Vacation Club and trust me- families have LOTS of money to throw around. From what I hear, the Wide World of Sports is one of the best Spring Training Sites there is.....!
February 23, 200719 yr Author The Hispanic population IS important, but if they haven't embraced the team like Marlin organization hoped yet, they might never fully embrace it. By the way, the Knights now have 20 victories. The game last night was AMAZING. Go Knights!
February 23, 200719 yr :notworthy :notworthy :notworthy at this thread. How old are you? Twelve? I bet you rocked the FCAT.
February 23, 200719 yr Author :notworthy :notworthy :notworthy at this thread. How old are you? Twelve? I bet you rocked the FCAT. I sincerely hope you aren't talking about me. I proposed an idea that is based in logic and reason. Is there a reason that this seems so ridiculous to you?
February 23, 200719 yr The tourist idea is probably the worst argument you could have used. So you want to rely on fans of other teams who happen to be visiting orlando at the time to go out of their way to go watch the marlins? Sorry but thats a terrible idea. This thread also wasted a few min of my life so please close it.
February 23, 200719 yr I sincerely hope you aren't talking about me. I proposed an idea that is based in logic and reason. Is there a reason that this seems so ridiculous to you? You've just put forth a rock-solid, logical argument for why the NFL should place its next NFL franchise in Orlando. I mean, Orlando is clearly a bigger tourist destination than Los Angeles. And no, its distance from Tampa isn't a factor.
February 23, 200719 yr Author The Marlins are a team that are not supported by the local community or the local government. They struggle with the pay roll and have no place to play. How could relocating to an area that will potentially help create great opportunities for the Marlin organization not resonate with you, the fans. If you really cared about the future of the Marlins, you would not automatically reject this idea. Please, instead of ridiculing this possibility, look at the possible implications of such a decision. If you still believe that it is as ludicrous as you do now, post reasons behind this belief.
February 23, 200719 yr The Marlins are a team that are not supported by the local community or the local government. They struggle with the pay roll and have no place to play. How could relocating to an area that will potentially help create great opportunities for the Marlin organization not resonate with you, the fans. If you really cared about the future of the Marlins, you would not automatically reject this idea. That's an argument for moving the team to a better location. Orlando is quite possibly the worst place to move the team. Divvying up the D-rays' territory does not equal a recipe for success.
February 23, 200719 yr Author Tourists would in fact visit a Marlin game. You don't think that the parks get old? You can only go to Universal for so long before you need a break. A baseball game would be a nice departure from the grueling standing all day. Who is impacted the most by the Disney/Orlando experience? CHILDREN. Building a fanbase of children from around the country will allow for a great national fanbase as they grow up. The sales of apparel and Marlin gear would increase across the country, and the commercial appeal of the Marlin organization would grow as well. Children would associate Disney experience, which they see as "magical", with the Marlins. As the magic of Disney began to fade with time, the love of the Marlins would continue to grow. Baseball never loses its appeal, no matter the age (or as I've observed) Of course, this is not the only possibility, but it is something that must be looked at and must not be immediately cast aside. The Marlins are a team that are not supported by the local community or the local government. They struggle with the pay roll and have no place to play. How could relocating to an area that will potentially help create great opportunities for the Marlin organization not resonate with you, the fans. If you really cared about the future of the Marlins, you would not automatically reject this idea. That's an argument for moving the team to a better location. Orlando is quite possibly the worst place to move the team. Divvying up the D-rays' territory does not equal a recipe for success. D-rays territory? From experience, there are a lot more Marlin fans than D-ray fans here. Also, look at teams in California and in New York. I don't see them complaining about infringement of their "territory"
February 23, 200719 yr Tourists would in fact visit a Marlin game. That would explain why the Orlando Magic ranked #27 out of 30 NBA teams in attendance last year. Next.
February 23, 200719 yr The Marlins are a team that are not supported by the local community or the local government. They struggle with the pay roll and have no place to play. How could relocating to an area that will potentially help create great opportunities for the Marlin organization not resonate with you, the fans. If you really cared about the future of the Marlins, you would not automatically reject this idea. Please, instead of ridiculing this possibility, look at the possible implications of such a decision. If you still believe that it is as ludicrous as you do now, post reasons behind this belief. You do realize that all these tourist never make it to down town orlando right? I have been to "orlando" about 15 times and never once went to the downtown area. Most people go for theme parks and then leave. Check the magic attendance stats before you throw out your brilliant theories. The magic were ranked then the bottom 5 of attendance each of the past 5 seasons. Why arent all these tourists jumping at the chance to go see the magic? Cant they all be converted to magic fans?
February 23, 200719 yr Author Did I propose downtown Orlando? please, point out where I said downtown.
February 23, 200719 yr Tourists would in fact visit a Marlin game. You don't think that the parks get old? You can only go to Universal for so long before you need a break. A baseball game would be a nice departure from the grueling standing all day. Who is impacted the most by the Disney/Orlando experience? CHILDREN. Building a fanbase of children from around the country will allow for a great national fanbase as they grow up. The sales of apparel and Marlin gear would increase across the country, and the commercial appeal of the Marlin organization would grow as well. Children would associate Disney experience, which they see as "magical", with the Marlins. As the magic of Disney began to fade with time, the love of the Marlins would continue to grow. Baseball never loses its appeal, no matter the age (or as I've observed) Of course, this is not the only possibility, but it is something that must be looked at and must not be immediately cast aside. The Marlins are a team that are not supported by the local community or the local government. They struggle with the pay roll and have no place to play. How could relocating to an area that will potentially help create great opportunities for the Marlin organization not resonate with you, the fans. If you really cared about the future of the Marlins, you would not automatically reject this idea. That's an argument for moving the team to a better location. Orlando is quite possibly the worst place to move the team. Divvying up the D-rays' territory does not equal a recipe for success. D-rays territory? From experience, there are a lot more Marlin fans than D-ray fans here. Also, look at teams in California and in New York. I don't see them complaining about infringement of their "territory" Because these kids dont have teams of their own already? You argument only makes sense if all the tourists are coming from montana and dont have a basseball team of their own. It also makes sense to believe that all these people going to a game one day every few years is going to make them A)giant fans, B)sell alot of tickets, C) build a constant fan base and most imporantly D)make them actually care about the side show marlins, the distraction from the theme parks as you put it. Did I propose downtown Orlando? please, point out where I said downtown. HAHAHA I hope your not serious? Downtown would be the only place to put it. You do want some regular people going to games dont you? So basically you want only tourists to go to games? Hell why dont they put it at universal studies that way people can catch the Indiana Jones Stunt show at 5pm and still make it to the Marlins game at 7. Dam thats going to be an awesome idea.
February 23, 200719 yr This thread is pointless, but just like a car wreck or a Britney Spears sighting, I'm compelled to comment. Your rationale for why Orlando would be successful is shortsighted and contrary to simple baseball logic. For starters, assuming that "tourists" would flock to a baseball game while in Orlando might make sense to you "logically," practically speaking it is not the case. For starters, if the team is not actually owned and operated by either Disney or Universal, there is no way that ballpark or team will even be marketed by either park. Most of the folks that visit Disney from outside of Florida basically are buying a package deal. Disney picks them up at the airport and buses them right to the grounds, basically making them their "captives." That's one of the main reasons the Walt Disney Company has fought the construction of a mass transit line from Orlando International Airport to Disney World, because while Orange County wanted to include stops at International Drive, Sea World, etc., Disney said, "It's either an express to us, or nothing!" Most of these folks don't necessarily rent a car. A family of four or five with kids under 10 are not going to go out of their way to leave the Disney grounds to see a ballgame. And you could forget about the notion of Disney "owning" a team since they couldn't get rid of the Angels and Ducks fast enough. The same would hold true for Universal. So that would mean any new ballpark would need to be built downtown or outside of the two parks properties. As for tourists "flocking" to a game after going to the parks, why aren't the tourists "flocking" to see the Magic play? If I had a family of four and were from Montana, wouldn't I want to go see players like Shaq, Kobe, LeBron, D-Wade, Nash, Dirk, etc. if I had the opportunity? But the Magic are near the bottom in attendance. Families are there for the parks, not to go to a baseball game. Remember "Boardwalk and Baseball?" If Universal and Disney don't encourage their "visitors" to go to an NBA game now, what makes you think they'll encourage them to see an MLB game? For this current season, the Magic rank 17th out of 30 NBA teams. In the 2005-2006 season, the Magic ranked 27th out of 30. The other rankings for the Magic: 2004-2005: 27 out of 30; 2003-2004: 27 out of 29; 2002-2003: 26 out of 29. So what makes you think Orlando would rank high in MLB attendance? Also a baseball team does not generate the majority of its revenue from attendance, but from TV market share (that's why NYC is a top market) and corporate sponsorship. The Orlando TV market is much smaller than the combined Miami-Fort Lauderale/West Palm Beach-Fort Pierce TV market. Then, you're basically eliminating any posibility of tapping into the Tampa Bay TV market, and no Orlando based MLB team will be able to count on a South Florida TV market. And as noted above, it's not like Disney and Universal are out there "helping" out the Magic in corporate assistance and sponsorship. Orlando was skipped over in 1991 and 1996 when expansion was on the table and they were a finalist. I'm sure you're probably too young to remember the 1991 expansion rounds when the cities displayed their "Dog & Pony Shows". Finally, the Orange County Convention Bureau is tapped out and hasn't been able to fund improvements to the O-Rena (or whatever the hell it's called today, I think it's the Amway Arena, which means if you buy a ticket, you must bring another friend to buy another ticket as well...) or the Citrus Bowl. What makes you think they'd be as flush with cash, or more receptive to spending than Miami-Dade County? The Magic have been trying to get the same rebate the Marlins are trying to get for years, it's not like they're reeling in the dough! I'm sure you're an Orlando resident who wants to see MLB in your town. However, there will never be an MLB team in Orlando as long as the Devil Rays exist in Tampa (or why you won't see an NBA team in Tampa as long as the Magic exist in Orlando). So, with that this debate should be over. THANK YOU, COME AGAIN!
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