How am I biased?? Sabean is the best GM in baseball.

He is ONE of the best in baseball, not the best. Theo Epstein is a better GM yea, Theo did a good job of getting 2nd place again for the Red Sox

-that bullpen by committee was a wonderful idea Well if I remeber right, that was Grady Little's idea, and he did try and bring in a closer in Byung-Hyung Kim but we all no how that turned

Beinfest deserved it. No one did more with less - just look at the payroll differences between Florida and SF. Then, look at all the moves that went into making this team a champion - Beinfest was robbed. There is still too much anti-Marlin sentiment (envy) out there. Yes, that is what I said.

 

If McKeon does not win NL Manager, then it will be a sham. This team went from 10 games under .500 to champs. When was the last time that was done? Cox should get some credit too, the Braves did pretty well considering, but they were still a playoff team on paper. Alou, please. When you have Barry Bonds in your lineup, you dont really have to figure things out that much. That team did not miss a beat because that team runs on Bonds alone. Look at what we did against them in the playoffs to see that example in place.

Sabean deserved it.

Beinfest made a deal at the beginning of the year (CJ, Preston) that took a TON of imagination and guts. He brought in Conine and Urbina at the deadline, two critical pieces of the puzzle to the World Series. He declared that Mike Lowell would NOT be traded, which is as good as any trade they made. He called up Willis and Cabs from AA, both intregal pieces as well. He signed Pudge, a HUGE risk with injuries and the money. Add a World Series title....and that's a pretty DAMN good resume.

Beinfest deserved it. No one did more with less - just look at the payroll differences between Florida and SF. Then, look at all the moves that went into making this team a champion - Beinfest was robbed. There is still too much anti-Marlin sentiment (envy) out there. Yes, that is what I said.

 

If McKeon does not win NL Manager, then it will be a sham. This team went from 10 games under .500 to champs. When was the last time that was done? Cox should get some credit too, the Braves did pretty well considering, but they were still a playoff team on paper. Alou, please. When you have Barry Bonds in your lineup, you dont really have to figure things out that much. That team did not miss a beat because that team runs on Bonds alone. Look at what we did against them in the playoffs to see that example in place.

I think Sabean needs to be given a minute amount of credit for at least signing Bonds.

 

But Beinfest deserved it THIS year, definitely. The biggest reason is the talent from the minor leagues that did well in the big leagues.

Beinfest deserved it. No one did more with less - just look at the payroll differences between Florida and SF. Then, look at all the moves that went into making this team a champion - Beinfest was robbed. There is still too much anti-Marlin sentiment (envy) out there. Yes, that is what I said.

 

If McKeon does not win NL Manager, then it will be a sham. This team went from 10 games under .500 to champs. When was the last time that was done? Cox should get some credit too, the Braves did pretty well considering, but they were still a playoff team on paper. Alou, please. When you have Barry Bonds in your lineup, you dont really have to figure things out that much. That team did not miss a beat because that team runs on Bonds alone. Look at what we did against them in the playoffs to see that example in place.

I think Sabean needs to be given a minute amount of credit for at least signing Bonds.

 

But Beinfest deserved it THIS year, definitely. The biggest reason is the talent from the minor leagues that did well in the big leagues. Sorry, it doesn't take a genius to sign one of the best players in baseball history. Especially if you have money to throw around.

Beinfest deserved it.? No one did more with less - just look at the payroll differences between Florida and SF.? Then, look at all the moves that went into making this team a champion - Beinfest was robbed.? There is still too much anti-Marlin sentiment (envy) out there.? Yes, that is what I said.

 

If McKeon does not win NL Manager, then it will be a sham.? This team went from 10 games under .500 to champs.? When was the last time that was done?? Cox should get some credit too, the Braves did pretty well considering, but they were still a playoff team on paper.? Alou, please.? When you have Barry Bonds in your lineup, you dont really have to figure things out that much.? That team did not miss a beat because that team runs on Bonds alone.? Look at what we did against them in the playoffs to see that example in place.

I think Sabean needs to be given a minute amount of credit for at least signing Bonds.

 

But Beinfest deserved it THIS year, definitely. The biggest reason is the talent from the minor leagues that did well in the big leagues. Sorry, it doesn't take a genius to sign one of the best players in baseball history. Especially if you have money to throw around. Hence the word "minute."

and for manager of the year, the only competition for McKeon should be Dusty Baker

i really don't think beinfest deserved it.

 

even though he got the team to 91 wins, it's not exactly like he built the ballclub. at the end of the regular season, i'm not convinced that other observers would have seen his moves as the most skillful and astute. the guy got burned on hampton, overpaid for pudge with deferred money (compromising future success), and basically traded away the entire farm for conine, fox, and uggy.

 

obviously the moves worked like a charm and netted us a world series, and i'd do them over again a million times, but you really can't give the guy credit for being blessed with a great core and a wealth of prospects to either trade away or call up.

 

the team was essentially built to contend for one season, and only one player was contracted through 2004 (before 9er came along).

 

big props to Admin for winning us a WS, but the guy doesn't deserve GM of the year. if his miserable signings with the expos are any indicator, i'm worried about the next couple of seasons.

How am I biased? Sabean is the best GM in baseball.

He is ONE of the best in baseball, not the best. Theo Epstein is a better GM, Admin Beinfest (This year), Jim Hendry, the list goes on...

 

Sabean did not deserve it this year, but he did last year. I admit he didn't deserve it this year, but since there's been 3 times when he did deserve it and didn't win, it's fair that he got it this year.

Sabean deserved it.

Beinfest made a deal at the beginning of the year (CJ, Preston) that took a TON of imagination and guts. He brought in Conine and Urbina at the deadline, two critical pieces of the puzzle to the World Series. He declared that Mike Lowell would NOT be traded, which is as good as any trade they made. He called up Willis and Cabs from AA, both intregal pieces as well. He signed Pudge, a HUGE risk with injuries and the money. Add a World Series title....and that's a pretty DAMN good resume. yeah, but consider 97, when Sabean took over as GM. In 96, they had a really s***ty team. Sabes takes over and they win the division, all because of the moves he makes. He loses the Executive of the Year award.

In 98 and 99, Sabes made sacrifices for those two years to make the team weaker to insure that they would have one of the best teams when they moved into a new park. They stayed competitive during those two years, and when they moved into Pac Bell in 2000 they had the best record in baseball. But again, he loses the executive of the year award.

In 2002, Sabean made numerous genious moves before and during the season, as well as genious moves before the 2001 season, which got the Giants to the World Series. He was clearly the best GM in baseball last year. But again, he loses the executive of the year award.

So he may not have been the best this year, but he still deserves the award, even if it is for the wrong year.

So because he was a good GM five years ago, he deserves it this year? I just wanna make sure I understand correctly.

he deserved it in 2002, 2000, and 1997. He got snubbed 3 times. He got 1 undeserving. Even if Sabes didn't deserve it, your GM didn't either. It should have gone to either Sabes, the Braves GM, or the Cubs GM.

And if Felipe Alou wins NL Manager of the Year....

 

there will be some? :chair ? :hanged ? :boxed

 

haha

Based on just the regular season, which is what they vote on, Alou is at least just as deserving as McKeon

What the hell did Alou do that was so special????

 

Like I posted in another thread....

 

Everybody expected the Giants to win a lot of games anyway and they did so it's not like Felipe Alou did some miracle managing, plus he has some guy named Barry Bonds too. Dusty Baker took over a losing club and turned them into a respective team like Jack but people already believed they could be a good team, FANS of them believed they could be a good team.

 

Nobody ever believed the Marlins could be a good team (expect all of us of course) so for 73-year-old McKeon to take over a team with their starting ace out, barely any fans in the seats, and a club sliding under .500 and turn them into a championship, full-stadium, bandwagon team is awesome. Of course the players deserve most of the credit but Jack is the one who made all the right managing moves, he's the one who taught them to relax and just have fun.

And if Felipe Alou wins NL Manager of the Year....

 

there will be some? :chair ? :hanged ? :boxed

 

haha

Can I join the mob if that happens. :hat

 

How the hell does Sabean win it. Sure he signed a completely different team to replace the world series contenders the year before but Beinfest made some of the best moves of the year like the Redman trade, signing Pudge, stealing Urbina, getting Conine, and most of all... Not trading the team away at the deadline. haha of course :burglar All right I'll get my mob car ready for it Hell yeah :cool

And if Felipe Alou wins NL Manager of the Year....

 

there will be some? :chair ? :hanged ? :boxed

 

haha

Based on just the regular season, which is what they vote on, Alou is at least just as deserving as McKeon What the hell did Alou do that was so special????

 

Like I posted in another thread....

 

Everybody expected the Giants to win a lot of games anyway and they did so it's not like Felipe Alou did some miracle managing, plus he has some guy named Barry Bonds too. Dusty Baker took over a losing club and turned them into a respective team like Jack but people already believed they could be a good team, FANS of them believed they could be a good team.

 

Nobody ever believed the Marlins could be a good team (expect all of us of course) so for 73-year-old McKeon to take over a team with their starting ace out, barely any fans in the seats, and a club sliding under .500 and turn them into a championship, full-stadium, bandwagon team is awesome. Of course the players deserve most of the credit but Jack is the one who made all the right managing moves, he's the one who taught them to relax and just have fun. the Giants had no closer, a team filled with injuries, an ace who was injured the entire second half and missed about 6 starts due to injury/ bereavement, a number two pitcher traded for a guy who can't pitch for s*** traded for another guy who can't pitch for s*** all to cut payroll (Sabes only bad move in 7 years), a number three pitcher who spent two months on the DL and over another month struggling due to injury, and a revolving door for the rest of the rotation due to injuries. Barry missed a combined month due to injuries and bereavement. The starting C, 1B, 2B, and SS all missed a lot of time due to injury, and the Giants still won 100 games.

If you take the playoffs into consideration, McKeon is hand down MOTY. But considering they vote before the playoffs start, Alou is at least just as deserving.

...the guy got burned on hampton, overpaid for pudge with deferred money (compromising future success)...

 

In the Hampton deal he cleared $23.5 million of net payroll, and the deferred payments to Pudge were actually offset by the payments being made by Colorado to the Marlins (roughly $2.5 mil per year for three years) due from the Wilson/Hampton/Johnson/Pierre trade. Frankly when I read those comments by the Rockies ownership regarding the Fish a few days ago I said to myself "today must be the day they're signing the check" to the Marlins.

 

The core issue regarding Beinfest was really, and to be fair it was pointed out, has more to do with the timing of the vote more than anything else. No one was thinking "World Champion Florida Marlins" when they voted a two months ago, they were thinking "wildcard winners" who would probably get knocked off in the first round.

 

Admin Beinfest did a terrific job for us this year and is due our gratitude. While I'm sure he would have liked to have won this award, he has the comfort of knowing he'll be the one wearing a World Series ring next season and no one else.

 

Congrats Admin.

And if Felipe Alou wins NL Manager of the Year....

 

there will be some? :chair ? :hanged ? :boxed

 

haha

Based on just the regular season, which is what they vote on, Alou is at least just as deserving as McKeon What the hell did Alou do that was so special????

 

Like I posted in another thread....

 

Everybody expected the Giants to win a lot of games anyway and they did so it's not like Felipe Alou did some miracle managing, plus he has some guy named Barry Bonds too. Dusty Baker took over a losing club and turned them into a respective team like Jack but people already believed they could be a good team, FANS of them believed they could be a good team.

 

Nobody ever believed the Marlins could be a good team (expect all of us of course) so for 73-year-old McKeon to take over a team with their starting ace out, barely any fans in the seats, and a club sliding under .500 and turn them into a championship, full-stadium, bandwagon team is awesome. Of course the players deserve most of the credit but Jack is the one who made all the right managing moves, he's the one who taught them to relax and just have fun. the Giants had no closer, a team filled with injuries, an ace who was injured the entire second half and missed about 6 starts due to injury/ bereavement, a number two pitcher traded for a guy who can't pitch for s*** traded for another guy who can't pitch for s*** all to cut payroll (Sabes only bad move in 7 years), a number three pitcher who spent two months on the DL and over another month struggling due to injury, and a revolving door for the rest of the rotation due to injuries. Barry missed a combined month due to injuries and bereavement. The starting C, 1B, 2B, and SS all missed a lot of time due to injury, and the Giants still won 100 games.

If you take the playoffs into consideration, McKeon is hand down MOTY. But considering they vote before the playoffs start, Alou is at least just as deserving. Very good point BUT....ur acting like the marlins season was so jolly....

 

Burnett (who was definitely considered our ace at the beginning of the year) was injured the WHOLE damn season. We had an empty stadium, no reliever for the 7th-8th inning until Uggy came along, no good leftfielder until Miguel came along, our 2B just came off hip surgery, we were 10 games under .500 at one point, we fired half the damn management, one of our best hitters was out the most important month of our regular season and guess what???

 

we still made tha playoffs and won 91 games!!! :mischief2

I think people are giving more credit to McKeon for turning the season around than blaming Torborg for the bad start. I remember looking at the standings early on and thinking this is a good team and wondering how the team could be so low in the standings.

I think the tournaround was more of getting rid of a lousy manager than hiring a great manager. It was both, but still.

All i'm saying is the award could go to either one and it would be deserving. If they voted after the postseason, that would be another story.

I think people are giving more credit to McKeon for turning the season around than blaming Torborg for the bad start. I remember looking at the standings early on and thinking this is a good team and wondering how the team could be so low in the standings.

I think the tournaround was more of getting rid of a lousy manager than hiring a great manager. It was both, but still.

All i'm saying is the award could go to either one and it would be deserving. If they voted after the postseason, that would be another story.

To say Sabean deserved it is one thing, but to say Beinfest DIDN'T is another.

I was referring to the Alou- McKeon thing, saying they are equally deserving

I think people are giving more credit to McKeon for turning the season around than blaming Torborg for the bad start. I remember looking at the standings early on and thinking this is a good team and wondering how the team could be so low in the standings.

I think the tournaround was more of getting rid of a lousy manager than hiring a great manager. It was both, but still.

All i'm saying is the award could go to either one and it would be deserving. If they voted after the postseason, that would be another story.

If McKeon doesn't deserve it for turning around the team or whatever you said, then why should Alou win it just because his team won in spite of injuries, the players won the games, not him. If that's the way you wanna see it with the Fish, then look at it like that too with the Giants.

I'm not saying McKeon is undeserving, all I'm saying is Alou is just as deserving.

Thank god they don't take playoffs into consideration

For once, we do agree because I also believe playoffs definitely should not be taken into consideratation because that's just not fair.

 

But you know what, I can't really argue with you because I personally don't follow the Giants so I couldn't even tell you what happened this season, all I know is that they made the playoffs and won 100 games. Like all that you said about all the injuries and trades, I never even knew so when you posted all that, I was like holy shyt how am I gonna beat that but I tried haha. I also didn't mean to take anything away from Felipe, I was just arguing Jack's deserving. But if we never had this debate and Alou would have won, I would have been mad but now that I know that the Giants actually had a handful of struggles this season as well and still reached the century mark, I won't be as mad

I won't be upset if McKeon beats out Alou, but if Cox or Baker beat out Alou, I'll be pissed.

I won't be upset if McKeon beats out Alou, but if Cox or Baker beat out Alou, I'll be pissed.

Baker did turn a 95 loss team around didnt he?