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I hope he can find a few income streams because it doesn't look like he's going to make it big in mlb.

 

 

That's a pretty interesting comment...

 

His OPS of .773 is pretty major league average among active 1B (would rank 17th in MLB if he had enough PA to qualify) and it's ahead of some pretty nice players (Adam Dunn, Justin Smoak, Anthony Rizzo, Mark Trumbo, Justin Morneau, Adam LaRoche, to name a few). It's also almost identical to his career OPS of .779.

 

I don't understand all the blind hate on this board for LoMo. He is one of our core offensive pieces, and for a team that is struggling with offense all over the place, first base is one of the least of our worries. Yet so many people want to replace one of the few batters on this team that IS hitting... it's absolutely mind boggling.

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It's not blind hate, it's the fact that he can be replaced by someone either already on the MLB roster [stanton, Yelich] or further in the system [Canha?]. He's not good defensively, either, but I'll let him have some more time readjusting to the position, give him the benefit of the doubt. He can be traded to help fill a hole elsewhere [catcher, second, short].

 

Do we need to trade him? Not at all.

Do we want to get rid of him? Not necessarily.

Is he the only option we have to play first and thus inexpendable? Absolutely not.

 

This is my thinking, not necessarily the board's train of thought. He's going into arbitration next year and is currently 26. If there's a team that could go for a first baseman or DH type player and they have a player we could use, don't be surprised if he's traded in the offseason.

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It's not blind hate, it's the fact that he can be replaced by someone either already on the MLB roster [stanton, Yelich] or further in the system [Canha?]. He's not good defensively, either, but I'll let him have some more time readjusting to the position, give him the benefit of the doubt. He can be traded to help fill a hole elsewhere [catcher, second, short].

 

Do we need to trade him? Not at all.

Do we want to get rid of him? Not necessarily.

Is he the only option we have to play first and thus inexpendable? Absolutely not.

 

This is my thinking, not necessarily the board's train of thought. He's going into arbitration next year and is currently 26. If there's a team that could go for a first baseman or DH type player and they have a player we could use, don't be surprised if he's traded in the offseason.

 

 

I don't disagree with you at all here. There's no doubt that LoMo could be wildly successful in the right place, league, ballpark, etc. And with a few years of club control left, that could probably make him pretty valuable on the open market.

 

If the right deal presents itself of course you move him and there are other options. But it would certainly have to be the right deal for the Marlins to have to go through the trouble of replacing a perfectly good, young, affordable player. Similar to their situation with Cishek, no need to move him unless it's on their terms, so I don't see this happening.

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His offensive production is average at best. That means he's far from the weakest link in the line-up but his position would probably be the easiest for the Marlins to upgrade if they really want to bring in some more bats, which they definitely need.

 

It's going to be hard for the Marlins to upgrade 3B (for 2014), 2B, SS, and C because of how bad the depth is in the minors and because of how hard it is to find decent talent for those positions outside of the organization at a reasonable price.

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His offensive production is average at best. That means he's far from the weakest link in the line-up but his position would probably be the easiest for the Marlins to upgrade if they really want to bring in some more bats, which they definitely need.

 

It's going to be hard for the Marlins to upgrade 3B (for 2014), 2B, SS, and C because of how bad the depth is in the minors and because of how hard it is to find decent talent for those positions outside of the organization at a reasonable price.

 

 

For third base, I'd have to guess a Coghlan/Lucas platoon would be what happens in 2014.

Not the best thing, but at least it'll be ... something.

 

Catcher, second, and short do suck right now, and that's why I mention if we can move Morrison to get something better in one of those spots, then I say we do it. First base has options.

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His offensive production is average at best. That means he's far from the weakest link in the line-up but his position would probably be the easiest for the Marlins to upgrade if they really want to bring in some more bats, which they definitely need.

 

It's going to be hard for the Marlins to upgrade 3B (for 2014), 2B, SS, and C because of how bad the depth is in the minors and because of how hard it is to find decent talent for those positions outside of the organization at a reasonable price.

 

 

Average production from first base is all we need. I don't know if you've noticed, but it is REALLY hard to find a first baseman better than LoMo on the FA market, and if you do, you are going to pay through the nose.

 

The only 1B ahead of him in OPS that have hit FA or signed extensions:

 

1. Joey Votto, 10 yr, $225 Million extension

2. Paul Goldschmidt 5 yr, $32 Million extension

3. Edwin Encarnacion 3 yr, $29 Million extension

4. Allen Craig 5 yr, $31 Million extension

5. Adam Lind 4 yr, $18 Million extension

6. Mike Napoli 1 yr, $5 Million (AFTER his 3 yr, $39 Mill deal fell through due to physical)

7. Prince Fielder 9 yr, $214 Million

8. Adrian Gonzalez 7 yr, $154 Million

9. James Loney 1 yr, $2 Million

 

Those first baseman, on average, will earn $15.69 Million per season during those contracts. Sure, it's easy to replace LoMo... if you want to spend that kind of money. It is hard to find young talented hitters, so hard that the Cubs locked up Rizzo to a 7 yr, $41 Million extension and even he isn't the hitter LoMo is yet.

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His offensive production is average at best. That means he's far from the weakest link in the line-up but his position would probably be the easiest for the Marlins to upgrade if they really want to bring in some more bats, which they definitely need.

 

It's going to be hard for the Marlins to upgrade 3B (for 2014), 2B, SS, and C because of how bad the depth is in the minors and because of how hard it is to find decent talent for those positions outside of the organization at a reasonable price.

 

 

Average production from first base is all we need. I don't know if you've noticed, but it is REALLY hard to find a first baseman better than LoMo on the FA market, and if you do, you are going to pay through the nose.

 

The only 1B ahead of him in OPS that have hit FA or signed extensions:

 

1. Joey Votto, 10 yr, $225 Million extension

2. Paul Goldschmidt 5 yr, $32 Million extension

3. Edwin Encarnacion 3 yr, $29 Million extension

4. Allen Craig 5 yr, $31 Million extension

5. Adam Lind 4 yr, $18 Million extension

6. Mike Napoli 1 yr, $5 Million (AFTER his 3 yr, $39 Mill deal fell through due to physical)

7. Prince Fielder 9 yr, $214 Million

8. Adrian Gonzalez 7 yr, $154 Million

9. James Loney 1 yr, $2 Million

 

Those first baseman, on average, will earn $15.69 Million per season during those contracts. Sure, it's easy to replace LoMo... if you want to spend that kind of money. It is hard to find young talented hitters, so hard that the Cubs locked up Rizzo to a 7 yr, $41 Million extension and even he isn't the hitter LoMo is yet.

 

 

Not paying through the nose at all. Morrison is arbitration eligible this coming offseason, not a free agent. The only way we "pay through the nose" is if we decide to sign Abreu. Like I said, we've got options available to replace him at the position.

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His offensive production is average at best. That means he's far from the weakest link in the line-up but his position would probably be the easiest for the Marlins to upgrade if they really want to bring in some more bats, which they definitely need.

 

It's going to be hard for the Marlins to upgrade 3B (for 2014), 2B, SS, and C because of how bad the depth is in the minors and because of how hard it is to find decent talent for those positions outside of the organization at a reasonable price.

 

 

Average production from first base is all we need. I don't know if you've noticed, but it is REALLY hard to find a first baseman better than LoMo on the FA market, and if you do, you are going to pay through the nose.

 

The only 1B ahead of him in OPS that have hit FA or signed extensions:

 

1. Joey Votto, 10 yr, $225 Million extension

2. Paul Goldschmidt 5 yr, $32 Million extension

3. Edwin Encarnacion 3 yr, $29 Million extension

4. Allen Craig 5 yr, $31 Million extension

5. Adam Lind 4 yr, $18 Million extension

6. Mike Napoli 1 yr, $5 Million (AFTER his 3 yr, $39 Mill deal fell through due to physical)

7. Prince Fielder 9 yr, $214 Million

8. Adrian Gonzalez 7 yr, $154 Million

9. James Loney 1 yr, $2 Million

 

Those first baseman, on average, will earn $15.69 Million per season during those contracts. Sure, it's easy to replace LoMo... if you want to spend that kind of money. It is hard to find young talented hitters, so hard that the Cubs locked up Rizzo to a 7 yr, $41 Million extension and even he isn't the hitter LoMo is yet.

 

 

Not paying through the nose at all. Morrison is arbitration eligible this coming offseason, not a free agent. The only way we "pay through the nose" is if we decide to sign Abreu. Like I said, we've got options available to replace him at the position.

 

 

 

 

That is exactly my point.

 

What it would cost to replace LoMo with a better player via Free Agency, as penguino suggested, would be ridiculous when you could just extend him to an Adam Lind-esque deal that buys out his arb years and a FA year or two through his prime. You just cross your fingers and hope he stays healthy.

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His offensive production is average at best. That means he's far from the weakest link in the line-up but his position would probably be the easiest for the Marlins to upgrade if they really want to bring in some more bats, which they definitely need.

 

It's going to be hard for the Marlins to upgrade 3B (for 2014), 2B, SS, and C because of how bad the depth is in the minors and because of how hard it is to find decent talent for those positions outside of the organization at a reasonable price.

 

 

Average production from first base is all we need. I don't know if you've noticed, but it is REALLY hard to find a first baseman better than LoMo on the FA market, and if you do, you are going to pay through the nose.

 

The only 1B ahead of him in OPS that have hit FA or signed extensions:

 

1. Joey Votto, 10 yr, $225 Million extension

2. Paul Goldschmidt 5 yr, $32 Million extension

3. Edwin Encarnacion 3 yr, $29 Million extension

4. Allen Craig 5 yr, $31 Million extension

5. Adam Lind 4 yr, $18 Million extension

6. Mike Napoli 1 yr, $5 Million (AFTER his 3 yr, $39 Mill deal fell through due to physical)

7. Prince Fielder 9 yr, $214 Million

8. Adrian Gonzalez 7 yr, $154 Million

9. James Loney 1 yr, $2 Million

 

Those first baseman, on average, will earn $15.69 Million per season during those contracts. Sure, it's easy to replace LoMo... if you want to spend that kind of money. It is hard to find young talented hitters, so hard that the Cubs locked up Rizzo to a 7 yr, $41 Million extension and even he isn't the hitter LoMo is yet.

 

 

Free agency isn't the only way to acquire players outside of the organization.

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Free agency isn't the only way to acquire players outside of the organization.

 

 

 

Was your statement suggesting we upgrade first base some other way?

 

Because I don't know of any first baseman in baseball that is available that the Marlins could trade for and upgrade the position. I also don't see the point in upgrading a position that isn't a problem... Seems kind of counter productive and redundant.

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Yes, and acquisition outside of the organization includes trades as well as free agency.

 

As I said before, Morrison isn't one of the biggest holes in the lineup but he's also not too spectacular either. In fact he wouldn't be that hard to replace compared to the other positions. Being an average 1B doesn't imply much value overall due to positional scarcity. That being, 1B is the least scarce position.

 

There aren't many options in FA to bolster 2B, SS, C, or 3B for 2014. The Marlins desperately need a big offensive bat and it might be easier for them acquire a 1B or an OF (perhaps consider moving Yelich to first) at a reasonable price.

 

Morrison isn't bad, he's mediocre. He's basically a platoon bat with so-so defense.

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Yes, and acquisition outside of the organization includes trades as well as free agency.

 

As I said before, Morrison isn't one of the biggest holes in the lineup but he's also not too spectacular either. In fact he wouldn't be that hard to replace compared to the other positions. Being an average 1B doesn't imply much value overall due to positional scarcity. That being, 1B is the least scarce position.

 

There aren't many options in FA to bolster 2B, SS, C, or 3B for 2014. The Marlins desperately need a big offensive bat and it might be easier for them acquire a 1B or an OF (perhaps consider moving Yelich to first) at a reasonable price.

 

Morrison isn't bad, he's mediocre. He's basically a platoon bat with so-so defense.

 

 

I guess what it comes down to is that I disagree with your way to improve this team, and I think my thoughts are more in line with the organization. LoMo is a fine first baseman, and this was also a comeback year for him. Let him build on this and come back next year stronger.

 

I also feel that second base is a position that will be OK. I believe in Dietrich, and I think the organization does as well. If he can post a .700+ OPS next year second base will no longer be an issue. Hopefully he can go to the AFL and put some questions to rest. I also believe in Coghlan as a stop-gap, there is no reason to spend money or deal prospects to land a third baseman that is only going to be just that, a stop gap. If Coghs can continue to do exactly what he has done this year, but just stay healthy, a platoon between him and Ed Lucas could be just fine.

 

That leaves us with SS and C as the positions that I feel need to be addressed. I can live with Hech at SS, and it doesn't look like that's going to change anyway. If I'm the FO, my only goal in the off-season is to acquire Brian McCann. If they can do that, this team can be interesting.

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Yes, and acquisition outside of the organization includes trades as well as free agency.

 

As I said before, Morrison isn't one of the biggest holes in the lineup but he's also not too spectacular either. In fact he wouldn't be that hard to replace compared to the other positions. Being an average 1B doesn't imply much value overall due to positional scarcity. That being, 1B is the least scarce position.

 

There aren't many options in FA to bolster 2B, SS, C, or 3B for 2014. The Marlins desperately need a big offensive bat and it might be easier for them acquire a 1B or an OF (perhaps consider moving Yelich to first) at a reasonable price.

 

Morrison isn't bad, he's mediocre. He's basically a platoon bat with so-so defense.

 

 

I guess what it comes down to is that I disagree with your way to improve this team, and I think my thoughts are more in line with the organization. LoMo is a fine first baseman, and this was also a comeback year for him. Let him build on this and come back next year stronger.

 

I also feel that second base is a position that will be OK. I believe in Dietrich, and I think the organization does as well. If he can post a .700+ OPS next year second base will no longer be an issue. Hopefully he can go to the AFL and put some questions to rest. I also believe in Coghlan as a stop-gap, there is no reason to spend money or deal prospects to land a third baseman that is only going to be just that, a stop gap. If Coghs can continue to do exactly what he has done this year, but just stay healthy, a platoon between him and Ed Lucas could be just fine.

 

That leaves us with SS and C as the positions that I feel need to be addressed. I can live with Hech at SS, and it doesn't look like that's going to change anyway. If I'm the FO, my only goal in the off-season is to acquire Brian McCann. If they can do that, this team can be interesting.

 

 

That's basically keeping the offense as is outside of the incredibly unlikely chance of landing McCann.

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Yes, and acquisition outside of the organization includes trades as well as free agency.

 

As I said before, Morrison isn't one of the biggest holes in the lineup but he's also not too spectacular either. In fact he wouldn't be that hard to replace compared to the other positions. Being an average 1B doesn't imply much value overall due to positional scarcity. That being, 1B is the least scarce position.

 

There aren't many options in FA to bolster 2B, SS, C, or 3B for 2014. The Marlins desperately need a big offensive bat and it might be easier for them acquire a 1B or an OF (perhaps consider moving Yelich to first) at a reasonable price.

 

Morrison isn't bad, he's mediocre. He's basically a platoon bat with so-so defense.

 

 

I guess what it comes down to is that I disagree with your way to improve this team, and I think my thoughts are more in line with the organization. LoMo is a fine first baseman, and this was also a comeback year for him. Let him build on this and come back next year stronger.

 

I also feel that second base is a position that will be OK. I believe in Dietrich, and I think the organization does as well. If he can post a .700+ OPS next year second base will no longer be an issue. Hopefully he can go to the AFL and put some questions to rest. I also believe in Coghlan as a stop-gap, there is no reason to spend money or deal prospects to land a third baseman that is only going to be just that, a stop gap. If Coghs can continue to do exactly what he has done this year, but just stay healthy, a platoon between him and Ed Lucas could be just fine.

 

That leaves us with SS and C as the positions that I feel need to be addressed. I can live with Hech at SS, and it doesn't look like that's going to change anyway. If I'm the FO, my only goal in the off-season is to acquire Brian McCann. If they can do that, this team can be interesting.

 

 

That's basically keeping the offense as is outside of the incredibly unlikely chance of landing McCann.

 

 

 

 

I mean, McCann is a gigantic difference maker. And so is a full season platoon of Coghs/Lucas and a full season from Dietrich. And a full season from LoMo, Stanton, and Yelich.

 

Tonight's lineup isn't the worst, and add Dietrich, it's even better. Add McCan, it's damn near league average.

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Yes, and acquisition outside of the organization includes trades as well as free agency.

 

As I said before, Morrison isn't one of the biggest holes in the lineup but he's also not too spectacular either. In fact he wouldn't be that hard to replace compared to the other positions. Being an average 1B doesn't imply much value overall due to positional scarcity. That being, 1B is the least scarce position.

 

There aren't many options in FA to bolster 2B, SS, C, or 3B for 2014. The Marlins desperately need a big offensive bat and it might be easier for them acquire a 1B or an OF (perhaps consider moving Yelich to first) at a reasonable price.

 

Morrison isn't bad, he's mediocre. He's basically a platoon bat with so-so defense.

 

 

I guess what it comes down to is that I disagree with your way to improve this team, and I think my thoughts are more in line with the organization. LoMo is a fine first baseman, and this was also a comeback year for him. Let him build on this and come back next year stronger.

 

I also feel that second base is a position that will be OK. I believe in Dietrich, and I think the organization does as well. If he can post a .700+ OPS next year second base will no longer be an issue. Hopefully he can go to the AFL and put some questions to rest. I also believe in Coghlan as a stop-gap, there is no reason to spend money or deal prospects to land a third baseman that is only going to be just that, a stop gap. If Coghs can continue to do exactly what he has done this year, but just stay healthy, a platoon between him and Ed Lucas could be just fine.

 

That leaves us with SS and C as the positions that I feel need to be addressed. I can live with Hech at SS, and it doesn't look like that's going to change anyway. If I'm the FO, my only goal in the off-season is to acquire Brian McCann. If they can do that, this team can be interesting.

 

 

That's basically keeping the offense as is outside of the incredibly unlikely chance of landing McCann.

 

 

 

 

I mean, McCann is a gigantic difference maker. And so is a full season platoon of Coghs/Lucas and a full season from Dietrich. And a full season from LoMo, Stanton, and Yelich.

 

Tonight's lineup isn't the worst, and add Dietrich, it's even better. Add McCan, it's damn near league average.

 

 

 

 

So you are basically counting on the Marlins offense becoming average next season only by acquiring one free agent who is likely out of the team's price range?

 

Outside of acquiring McCann that offense is little more than negligibly better than this season's. Of course, you are also doing that thing that people do here by assuming that everything goes right with injuries and upside of guys like Morrison/Dietrich.

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Even if Loria wants to spend money on McCann, I don't think it'd be wise to sign him for more than 4 years. I have a feeling that another team will give him more than that.

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For some reason I don't see that as an average offense. 3B, SS, and CF would still be huge liabilities. That's on top of counting on Dietrich and Morrison to improve.

 

 

Well, of course my scenario has its share of assumptions. It's assuming Coghlan and Lucas can handle third in a platoon capacity, which not only looks great on paper but would hopefully help keep Chris healthy. Of course SS is going to be an offensive liability, no question. Center field is a little less likely to be a problem, I am sure between Marisnick/Ozuna/Ruggiano somebody will step up. Morrison doesn't have to improve, simply maintain, but it is of my opinion he will improve. Dietrich would need minor improvement to be a serviceable starting second baseman, he left in a horrible skid that dropped his OPS to .679, and as long as he can keep it above .700 (seems likely with his power) then that's a major improvement over Solano. And again, it's actually my opinion he can post an OPS closer to .750, but I am being conservative.

 

Add McCann to this equation and you could definitely have an average major league lineup. All of the scenarios above are really not far fetched or reaching too far, but for any team to succeed things have to go right.

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Of course SS is going to be an offensive liability

 

Why would that necessarily be true?

 

He's a rookie with bad plate discipline and not a very good idea of what pitchers are going to do to him. Yet, he's hit 7 triples and 3 HRs. 35 RBI is 3rd on the team, which is pitiful, but more than LoMo has. There are inklings of some talent there. He's 24. Perhaps a good hitting coach will get him over .700 OPS.

 

In any case, he wasn't acquired to hit 20 HR, he was acquired to play SS. I'm not going to argue with Perry Hill about whether or not he can do it at a high level, never mind any "defensive metrics." I'd give him a year or two to step it up offensively, and the FO probably wants to give him more.

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Of course SS is going to be an offensive liability

 

Why would that necessarily be true?

 

He's a rookie with bad plate discipline and not a very good idea of what pitchers are going to do to him. Yet, he's hit 7 triples and 3 HRs. 35 RBI is 3rd on the team, which is pitiful, but more than LoMo has. There are inklings of some talent there. He's 24. Perhaps a good hitting coach will get him over .700 OPS.

 

In any case, he wasn't acquired to hit 20 HR, he was acquired to play SS. I'm not going to argue with Perry Hill about whether or not he can do it at a high level, never mind any "defensive metrics." I'd give him a year or two to step it up offensively, and the FO probably wants to give him more.

 

 

Oh, I actually agree with you. I think there is talent there, while he may never walk, I think eventually he will figure out how to hit some and put together around a .700 OPS. I just think it's going to take some time, and while he has shown "inklings" of talent, he isn't like Coghs or Dietrich who have actually proven their talent to some degree. Inklings of talent, and actual talent, are two different things... eventually I think it will come, but he is the biggest offensive liability next year assuming Mathis is not starting.

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Of course SS is going to be an offensive liability

 

Why would that necessarily be true?

 

He's a rookie with bad plate discipline and not a very good idea of what pitchers are going to do to him. Yet, he's hit 7 triples and 3 HRs. 35 RBI is 3rd on the team, which is pitiful, but more than LoMo has. There are inklings of some talent there. He's 24. Perhaps a good hitting coach will get him over .700 OPS.

 

In any case, he wasn't acquired to hit 20 HR, he was acquired to play SS. I'm not going to argue with Perry Hill about whether or not he can do it at a high level, never mind any "defensive metrics." I'd give him a year or two to step it up offensively, and the FO probably wants to give him more.

 

 

This is a dumb post. I mean, it's pretty silly to resort to counting statistics when Hechavarria trumps everyone on the team in terms of playing time. Yeah, he has 3 more RBI than Morrison but has also been to the plate 225 times more. He shouldn't be given credit just because he managed to stay healthy and have the benefit of the FO thinking that he's their perennial all-star (avoiding a demotion to the minor leagues).

 

There's really nothing positive to say about his stats this season. And there's nothing in the numbers to say that a .700 OPS is around the corner. It's even more ridiculous to claim that he's just a decent hitting coach away from being a capable hitter. Scouts had expressed concerns about his bat before the Marlins even acquired him. He didn't really hit in the minors.

 

He has been one of the absolute worst hitters in major league baseball this season. He'll need to play exceptional defense (much better than he's played this season) to compensate for that poor offense.

 

He has the worst WAR of any qualified player in MLB right now (-1.7). That is absolutely abysmal. The Marlins would be wise to find SS depth soon.

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I think there is talent there, while he may never walk, I think eventually he will figure out how to hit some and put together around a .700 OPS.

 

 

What are you basing this on?

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I think there is talent there, while he may never walk, I think eventually he will figure out how to hit some and put together around a .700 OPS.

 

 

 

What are you basing this on?Complete opinion. I don't think it will happen tomorrow or anything, but I think he has the ability to put it together, somewhat, eventually. I also think if "baseball people" didn't feel this way he wouldn't have a job. Some people rely wayyyyy too much on numbers alone much too often, use your eyes and form an opinion.

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