I booed Alex Gonzalez the last two games I attended and I will again.

 

You wanna leave because you can't take it anymore, works for me. Just keep come back for more games.

 

This too shall pass. The sun or the baseball gods will shine down on the Marlins again.

i cant get over this s***

 

is our lineup really this bad or are we just in a GINORMOUS slump?

Top-down we have a more talented lineup than last May.

That may be the problem.

We may rely too much of all of our batters to perform instead of 3 or 4 at a time last year. Not sure how you could say that:

 

I mean:

 

Pierre this year -v- last year is a wash as far as I'm concerned.

 

Castillo this year < last year.

 

Castro last year

 

Cabrera > Hollandsworth (because that's technically who he replaced from last year)

 

Conine < Encarnacion (sad but true, Nunez deserves to start over him).

 

Choi < Lee (Lee led us in OPS the last two years)

 

Gonzalez this year < last year (if that's even possible )

 

Go ahead and trash me, but look at the numbers. We've got 3 guys either below .200, dangerously close, or right there. Our pitchers are less of an automatic out than our 7/8 hitters, and Conine can't do s*** when there are guys on base, especially in scoring position....

The problem with looking at the numbers is that I already admitted not everyone in the lineup is hitting as well as they could.

 

Also I don't agree with your comparision chart. Why should we look for Castro to contribute what Pudge did hitting-wise? Pudge hit in the 3-hole, Castro in the 7 or 8. Two completly different positions in the lineup.

The problem with looking at the numbers is that I already admitted not everyone in the lineup is hitting as well as they could.

 

Also I don't agree with your comparision chart. Why should we look for Castro to contribute what Pudge did hitting-wise? Pudge hit in the 3-hole, Castro in the 7 or 8. Two completly different positions in the lineup.

Well, considering this is the player replaced, it's only fair. I know what you mean about production from spots in the lineup, but that doesn't produce much prettier results either.

the only teams we've managed to score more runs than are the giants (24 losses), the mariners (25 losses), the devil rays (28 losses), and the expos (26 losses).

 

i don't care how you cut it, the current lineup sucks.

Conine is definetely not the problem, hes batting .260 but hes had back problems and sinus problems. Not only that but the last few games hes played hes been hitting the ball well, last night he hit the ball hard to opposite field twice one almost for a homerun even though they were outs hes seeing the ball better.Conine cannot/should not be benched, that wouldnt be useful for the team. Choi however has been hitting plenty of homeruns but is hitting .238. Finally easley is a great hitter but defensively he is no where near gonzalez at SS, mostly b/c easley isnt really a SS. If anything give castillo a few days off to heal let easley start, but gonzo as terrible as he is with the bat is necessary to have on the field especially since we are a defensive minded team and no one turns the double play like castillo and sea bass.

Conine is not THE problem, but he is A problem. The guy's been batting 5th & 6th in the order and has a grand total of 11 RBIs. I realize RBIs are a subjective stat, but c'mon...

 

I wouldn't bench him either, I'm just saying he's one of the big causes of it right now. Castro, Niner, Alex, Luis, Choi in that order.

Niner has been slumping but hes also missed some games b/c of his back and sinuses so his RBIs will be affected by that. And there is no way Niner is more of a problem now than sea bass, who struggles to hit .200. Niner hasnt been hitting with runners in scoring position, but hes a veteran player who has been in slumps before and the rbi will come. Castro is playing terrible in a year which he finally got a chance to prove himself, and we already know of sea bass's ineffectiveness even though he is the 8th bat. Finally its hard to criticize Choi after that inside the park HR yesterday, but 80% of his homers were hit in april and he has been striking out way too much. And then Castillo is a problem b/c of his injury. In order i would list Castro, Gonzo, Castillo,Niner, Choi(over the last 10 games). Cordero is also a problem b/c he hasnt been effecrtive when put in to hit lefties.

Choi < Lee (Lee led us in OPS the last two years)

Um, how again?

This too shall pass. The sun or the baseball gods will shine down on the Marlins again.

I hope so..I wanna shut these damn Phillies fan up

Well, considering this is the player replaced, it's only fair. I know what you mean about production from spots in the lineup, but that doesn't produce much prettier results either.

Early 2003 /// Early 2004

1. JP /// faster JP

2. Luiy coming off surgery /// Luiy with a healthy hip

3. Pudge /// Cabrera - steady hitter or emerging hitter who might already be better

4. Lowell /// Lowell - there were questions if he could meet last year's numbers

5. Lee / Choi - two identical type of hitters with Lee having the edge because of his versatility offensively (SBs, gappers)

6. Encarnacion /// Conine - take your choice .750 OPS with speed or .775 OPS with a patient eye

7. Hollandsworth /// Castro/Redmond - there's a reason why we caled him Hollandsworthless

8. Gonzalez /// Gonzalez - with 18 HRs last year, coming into the usual prime age for hitters

 

But OBVIOUSLY not all of them have lived up to that yet.

 

 

The question I and many others are asking is 'why?'. We're looking for serious answers, not "we suck," or "we should have done this or that in the offseason." If you have one share it. Don't devolve into the stupidity that usually reserved for "Trade for Helton" threads.

Well, considering this is the player replaced, it's only fair.? I know what you mean about production from spots in the lineup, but that doesn't produce much prettier results either.

Early 2003 /// Early 2004

1. JP /// faster JP

2. Luiy coming off surgery /// Luiy with a healthy hip

3. Pudge /// Cabrera - steady hitter or emerging hitter who might already be better

4. Lowell /// Lowell - there were questions if he could meet last year's numbers

5. Lee / Choi - two identical type of hitters with Lee having the edge because of his versatility offensively (SBs, gappers)

6. Encarnacion /// Conine - take your choice .750 OPS with speed or .775 OPS with a patient eye

7. Hollandsworth /// Castro/Redmond - there's a reason why we caled him Hollandsworthless

8. Gonzalez /// Gonzalez - with 18 HRs last year, coming into the usual prime age for hitters

 

But OBVIOUSLY not all of them have lived up to that yet.

 

 

The question I and many others are asking is 'why?'. We're looking for serious answers, not "we suck," or "we should have done this or that in the offseason." If you have one share it. Don't devolve into the stupidity that usually reserved for "Trade for Helton" threads. My evaluation of your comparable players:

 

This Year/Last Year

 

1. Pierre = Pierre (although he's on pace for 46 SB's, last year he had 65)

2. CastilloLowell (he's the only guy we can rely on right now)

5. Choi

Feel my pain as I live in Phillies country. The lineup has to change. This was the number one weakness as far as I was concerned before the season began. The RBI opportunities are just not there for Lowell. Cabrera is tryin to do too much and the 7-8-9 hitters are hitting like 7-8-9 hitters in intermurals. Their pretty close to easy outs. I'd almost say put Donny at SS and sit Sea-Bass down.

Great post Ramper.

My 2 cents

 

The key to the lineup is Castillo and the 1-2 punch him and Pierre are. If Castillo doesnt get on base to be driven in the team will continue to struggle.

 

The should platoon Conine/Choi/Nunez between LF and 1B to get something going.

 

Castro just sucks and he needs his ass to be sent down to the minor now. And bring Treanor and Willingham up any of them could do better than Castro right now.

 

Once again I think we could live with Gonzalez not hitting because his defense is just so good but since the lineup is struggling I think its time to see Easley there more often.

 

And I dont recall booing any Marlins the last 3-4 seasons I've attended Marlin games. I just dont think it accomplishes anything and just show a lack of support for the player. I might have booed when I was a child but not anymore.

 

I am coming close to booing Castro tho. :mad :

Great post Ramper.

I do my best work when Im pissed

They should sit Sea Bass for a little while and start Easly. Easly has been solid the few times he has started or played. Put Louie in the first spot in the lineup,if he gets on base, pierre is red hot and can drive him in.