July 10, 200421 yr srry but Miami with shaq Miami>Indiana, y? Shaq> J oneal Wade> next best pacer Butler>miller and if the pistons dont keep rasheed Miami>Detroit 450166[/snapback] Butler is no better than Artest, who you conviently fail to mention. Pacers Bench >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Heat Bench It's a 48 minute game. It's not hands down or anything, but Shaq is still only one player and the Lakers this year proved it takes more than 2 stars to win a title.
July 10, 200421 yr exactly^^ and for AJB id rather take the risk and there not be any talent in 2 yrs and still have odom,wade,butler than have lost them and then lose shaq in 2 yrs and there be no talent.
July 10, 200421 yr exactly, AFTER next year when wade/butler/wright will have 2 more years of experience. now subract jones and you have 40 million in cap space. tell me please how this is a bad move for miami!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 450163[/snapback] Well, when the Heat fail to win the championship with Shaq, it is pointless. Cap space is overrated. There are no guarantees. All cap space does is increase the chances your team does something dumb (like give Okur 50 million or Alston 29 million). And I'd rather have Wade/Odom/Butler and 20 million in cap space. All I'm saying is you get Shaq and you're crippled money-wise. You've got a team (even with Butler) that has an eerie look like the Lakers of this past year, except Wade (while awesome) is no Kobe. Haslem isn't that great, if he played for the Celtics, you'd say he sucked. The bench is thin already, you lost your backup PG. I fail to see how filling one hole by creating a bunch of others makes any sense. Especially with a contract as crippling as Shaq's, even if it does come off the books in 2 years. There's no guarantee the FA class will be any good in 2 years. 450168[/snapback] well, im sure we will have a better chance now with shaq than with odom. and do you realize what you said, that ud rather be 20 under than 40 under?!?! come on dude, get real
July 10, 200421 yr srry but Miami with shaq Miami>Indiana, y? Shaq> J oneal Wade> next best pacer Butler>miller and if the pistons dont keep rasheed? Miami>Detroit 450166[/snapback] Butler is no better than Artest, who you conviently fail to mention. Pacers Bench >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Heat Bench It's a 48 minute game. It's not hands down or anything, but Shaq is still only one player and the Lakers this year proved it takes more than 2 stars to win a title. 450170[/snapback] u dont need more than 2 stars says the 3 rings they have on their finger. they didnt do it this year but they did it 3 years strait
July 10, 200421 yr exactly, AFTER next year when wade/butler/wright will have 2 more years of experience. now subract jones and you have 40 million in cap space. tell me please how this is a bad move for miami!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 450163[/snapback] Well, when the Heat fail to win the championship with Shaq, it is pointless. Cap space is overrated. There are no guarantees. All cap space does is increase the chances your team does something dumb (like give Okur 50 million or Alston 29 million). And I'd rather have Wade/Odom/Butler and 20 million in cap space. All I'm saying is you get Shaq and you're crippled money-wise. You've got a team (even with Butler) that has an eerie look like the Lakers of this past year, except Wade (while awesome) is no Kobe. Haslem isn't that great, if he played for the Celtics, you'd say he sucked. The bench is thin already, you lost your backup PG. I fail to see how filling one hole by creating a bunch of others makes any sense. Especially with a contract as crippling as Shaq's, even if it does come off the books in 2 years. There's no guarantee the FA class will be any good in 2 years. 450168[/snapback] well, im sure we will have a better chance now with shaq than with odom. and do you realize what you said, that ud rather be 20 under than 40 under?!?! come on dude, get real 450172[/snapback] You notice in my scenarion YOU STILL HAVE ODOM! Who is guaranteed to be there, unlike some mystery free agent.
July 10, 200421 yr exactly, AFTER next year when wade/butler/wright will have 2 more years of experience. now subract jones and you have 40 million in cap space. tell me please how this is a bad move for miami!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 450163[/snapback] Well, when the Heat fail to win the championship with Shaq, it is pointless. Cap space is overrated. There are no guarantees. All cap space does is increase the chances your team does something dumb (like give Okur 50 million or Alston 29 million). And I'd rather have Wade/Odom/Butler and 20 million in cap space. All I'm saying is you get Shaq and you're crippled money-wise. You've got a team (even with Butler) that has an eerie look like the Lakers of this past year, except Wade (while awesome) is no Kobe. Haslem isn't that great, if he played for the Celtics, you'd say he sucked. The bench is thin already, you lost your backup PG. I fail to see how filling one hole by creating a bunch of others makes any sense. Especially with a contract as crippling as Shaq's, even if it does come off the books in 2 years. There's no guarantee the FA class will be any good in 2 years. 450168[/snapback] well, im sure we will have a better chance now with shaq than with odom. and do you realize what you said, that ud rather be 20 under than 40 under?!?! come on dude, get real 450172[/snapback] he is real. id rather be 20 under with all 3 of my core odom,wade,butler than 40 under and have only one of them.with 20 mill and them 3 u have more than enough to go out and sign the best player in the nba if u wanted.
July 10, 200421 yr exactly^^ and for AJB id rather take the risk and there not be any talent in 2 yrs and still have odom,wade,butler than have lost them and then lose shaq in 2 yrs and there be no talent. 450171[/snapback] exactly. odom,wade,butler. notice a trend?!?! none of the 3 is a big man. get real people, the heat are this close to gettting shaq, and people are not exited about it.
July 10, 200421 yr exactly^^ and for AJB id rather take the risk and there not be any talent in 2 yrs and still have odom,wade,butler than have lost them and then lose shaq in 2 yrs and there be no talent. 450171[/snapback] exactly. odom,wade,butler. notice a trend?!?! none of the 3 is a big man. get real people, the heat are this close to gettting shaq, and people are not exited about it. 450177[/snapback] because we dont know what u are smoking. u hear the name shaq and ur all over it. hes not the same shaq. hes declining and un motivated,makes to much money and ur giving up 2 players Odom and Butler than are on the accend not the decline. period.
July 10, 200421 yr exactly, AFTER next year when wade/butler/wright will have 2 more years of experience. now subract jones and you have 40 million in cap space. tell me please how this is a bad move for miami!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 450163[/snapback] Well, when the Heat fail to win the championship with Shaq, it is pointless. Cap space is overrated. There are no guarantees. All cap space does is increase the chances your team does something dumb (like give Okur 50 million or Alston 29 million). And I'd rather have Wade/Odom/Butler and 20 million in cap space. All I'm saying is you get Shaq and you're crippled money-wise. You've got a team (even with Butler) that has an eerie look like the Lakers of this past year, except Wade (while awesome) is no Kobe. Haslem isn't that great, if he played for the Celtics, you'd say he sucked. The bench is thin already, you lost your backup PG. I fail to see how filling one hole by creating a bunch of others makes any sense. Especially with a contract as crippling as Shaq's, even if it does come off the books in 2 years. There's no guarantee the FA class will be any good in 2 years. 450168[/snapback] well, im sure we will have a better chance now with shaq than with odom. and do you realize what you said, that ud rather be 20 under than 40 under?!?! come on dude, get real 450172[/snapback] he is real. id rather be 20 under with all 3 of my core odom,wade,butler than 40 under and have only one of them.with 20 mill and them 3 u have more than enough to go out and sign the best player in the nba if u wanted. 450176[/snapback] not 1 of them, 2 of them (note heat keep caron) and why doesnt anyone remember wright?!?!
July 10, 200421 yr exactly, AFTER next year when wade/butler/wright will have 2 more years of experience. now subract jones and you have 40 million in cap space. tell me please how this is a bad move for miami!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 450163[/snapback] Well, when the Heat fail to win the championship with Shaq, it is pointless. Cap space is overrated. There are no guarantees. All cap space does is increase the chances your team does something dumb (like give Okur 50 million or Alston 29 million). And I'd rather have Wade/Odom/Butler and 20 million in cap space. All I'm saying is you get Shaq and you're crippled money-wise. You've got a team (even with Butler) that has an eerie look like the Lakers of this past year, except Wade (while awesome) is no Kobe. Haslem isn't that great, if he played for the Celtics, you'd say he sucked. The bench is thin already, you lost your backup PG. I fail to see how filling one hole by creating a bunch of others makes any sense. Especially with a contract as crippling as Shaq's, even if it does come off the books in 2 years. There's no guarantee the FA class will be any good in 2 years. 450168[/snapback] well, im sure we will have a better chance now with shaq than with odom. and do you realize what you said, that ud rather be 20 under than 40 under?!?! come on dude, get real 450172[/snapback] he is real. id rather be 20 under with all 3 of my core odom,wade,butler than 40 under and have only one of them.with 20 mill and them 3 u have more than enough to go out and sign the best player in the nba if u wanted. 450176[/snapback] not 1 of them, 2 of them (note heat keep caron) and why doesnt anyone remember wright?!?! 450180[/snapback] we do remember wright. well i do (points to sig) but hes 1 or 2 years away from being a big time player. and even then hes a SG or SF.
July 10, 200421 yr exactly^^ and for AJB id rather take the risk and there not be any talent in 2 yrs and still have odom,wade,butler than have lost them and then lose shaq in 2 yrs and there be no talent. 450171[/snapback] exactly. odom,wade,butler. notice a trend?!?! none of the 3 is a big man. get real people, the heat are this close to gettting shaq, and people are not exited about it. 450177[/snapback] because we dont know what u are smoking. u hear the name shaq and ur all over it. hes not the same shaq. hes declining and un motivated,makes to much money and ur giving up 2 players Odom and Butler than are on the accend not the decline. period. 450179[/snapback] we keep butler!
July 10, 200421 yr Author get real people, the heat are this close to gettting shaq, and people are not exited about it. Yep, I love LO as much as anyone but I can't believe some people rather have Odom than Shaq.
July 10, 200421 yr exactly^^ and for AJB id rather take the risk and there not be any talent in 2 yrs and still have odom,wade,butler than have lost them and then lose shaq in 2 yrs and there be no talent. 450171[/snapback] exactly. odom,wade,butler. notice a trend?!?! none of the 3 is a big man. get real people, the heat are this close to gettting shaq, and people are not exited about it. 450177[/snapback] because we dont know what u are smoking. u hear the name shaq and ur all over it. hes not the same shaq. hes declining and un motivated,makes to much money and ur giving up 2 players Odom and Butler than are on the accend not the decline. period. 450179[/snapback] we keep butler! 450182[/snapback] mmmmm no we dont. if it comes down to money like they said the no butler deal will not work. so just presume that butler and odom are both gone. now what?
July 10, 200421 yr get real people, the heat are this close to gettting shaq, and people are not exited about it. Yep, I love LO as much as anyone but I can't believe some people rather have Odom than Shaq. 450183[/snapback] id rather have odom and butler over shaq.
July 10, 200421 yr u dont need more than 2 stars says the 3 rings they have on their finger. they didnt do it this year but they did it 3 years strait 450173[/snapback] Yeah, but this was back when they had effective role players and they played the triangle which maximizes those role players. The Heat won't be running that. Look, I'm not saying they wouldn't be good with Shaq, they would be, but they wouldn't be the favorites to win the league and they wouldn't be the favorites to win the East (provided, as you said, the Pistons keep Sheed). Their current team, with an addition of a solid backup point guard, is good enough to make the 2nd round of the playoffs, maybe even the conference finals. So why do you sacrifice an Odom to get a player like Shaq, who whether anyone wants to admit it or not, is NOT the player he was 3 years ago. He's only dominant sometimes.
July 10, 200421 yr just put it like this, if 2 years from now the heat have odom/butler/wade and there is NOTHING in the free agent market, they will not win a title. now if there is notable talent to pursue that means they could aquire shaq, have him leave, and there will be no harm done (and you have a GREAT shot for the seasons he is/was here)
July 10, 200421 yr Author Miami trades: PF Brian Grant (8.7 ppg, 6.9 rpg, 0.9 apg in 30.3 minutes) SF Lamar Odom (17.1 ppg, 9.7 rpg, 4.1 apg in 37.5 minutes) Miami receives: C Shaquille O'Neal (21.5 ppg, 11.5 rpg, 2.9 apg in 36.8 minutes) Change in team outlook: -4.3 ppg, -5.1 rpg, and -2.1 apg. L.A. Lakers trades: C Shaquille O'Neal (21.5 ppg, 11.5 rpg, 2.9 apg in 36.8 minutes) L.A. Lakers receives: PF Brian Grant (8.7 ppg, 6.9 rpg, 0.9 apg in 76 games) SF Lamar Odom (17.1 ppg, 9.7 rpg, 4.1 apg in 80 games) Change in team outlook: +4.3 ppg, +5.1 rpg, and +2.1 apg. TRADE ACCEPTED Due to Miami and L.A. Lakers being over the cap, the 15% trade rule is invoked. Miami and L.A. Lakers had to be no more than 115% plus $100,000 of the salary given out for the trade to be accepted, which did happen here. This trade satisfies the provisions of the Collective Bargaining Agreement. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- And the Lakers, as reported by Gray would take a 1st rounder or Butler.
July 10, 200421 yr get real people, the heat are this close to gettting shaq, and people are not exited about it. Yep, I love LO as much as anyone but I can't believe some people rather have Odom than Shaq. 450183[/snapback] id rather have odom and butler over shaq. 450185[/snapback] your insane, butler is overrated nonetheless IMO
July 10, 200421 yr u dont need more than 2 stars says the 3 rings they have on their finger. they didnt do it this year but they did it 3 years strait 450173[/snapback] Yeah, but this was back when they had effective role players and they played the triangle which maximizes those role players. The Heat won't be running that. Look, I'm not saying they wouldn't be good with Shaq, they would be, but they wouldn't be the favorites to win the league and they wouldn't be the favorites to win the East (provided, as you said, the Pistons keep Sheed). Their current team, with an addition of a solid backup point guard, is good enough to make the 2nd round of the playoffs, maybe even the conference finals. So why do you sacrifice an Odom to get a player like Shaq, who whether anyone wants to admit it or not, is NOT the player he was 3 years ago. He's only dominant sometimes. 450186[/snapback] whooaaaa dude im totally on your side we should be against AJB. i love odom and would rather have odom right now and keep the core than get shaq.i agree hes declining. keep this team intact and go after a free agent big man later
July 10, 200421 yr get real people, the heat are this close to gettting shaq, and people are not exited about it. Yep, I love LO as much as anyone but I can't believe some people rather have Odom than Shaq. 450183[/snapback] id rather have odom and butler over shaq. 450185[/snapback] your insane, butler is overrated nonetheless IMO 450189[/snapback] overatted?no way. u saw the glimpse of what is to become of butler last year and during the playoffs against the pacers this year.
July 10, 200421 yr u dont need more than 2 stars says the 3 rings they have on their finger. they didnt do it this year but they did it 3 years strait 450173[/snapback] Yeah, but this was back when they had effective role players and they played the triangle which maximizes those role players. The Heat won't be running that. Look, I'm not saying they wouldn't be good with Shaq, they would be, but they wouldn't be the favorites to win the league and they wouldn't be the favorites to win the East (provided, as you said, the Pistons keep Sheed). Their current team, with an addition of a solid backup point guard, is good enough to make the 2nd round of the playoffs, maybe even the conference finals. So why do you sacrifice an Odom to get a player like Shaq, who whether anyone wants to admit it or not, is NOT the player he was 3 years ago. He's only dominant sometimes. 450186[/snapback] whooaaaa dude im totally on your side we should be against AJB. i love odom and would rather have odom right now and keep the core than get shaq.i agree hes declining. keep this team intact and go after a free agent big man later 450190[/snapback] like you said, what if there no big man later?!?! what do you do then
July 10, 200421 yr u dont need more than 2 stars says the 3 rings they have on their finger. they didnt do it this year but they did it 3 years strait 450173[/snapback] Yeah, but this was back when they had effective role players and they played the triangle which maximizes those role players. The Heat won't be running that. Look, I'm not saying they wouldn't be good with Shaq, they would be, but they wouldn't be the favorites to win the league and they wouldn't be the favorites to win the East (provided, as you said, the Pistons keep Sheed). Their current team, with an addition of a solid backup point guard, is good enough to make the 2nd round of the playoffs, maybe even the conference finals. So why do you sacrifice an Odom to get a player like Shaq, who whether anyone wants to admit it or not, is NOT the player he was 3 years ago. He's only dominant sometimes. 450186[/snapback] whooaaaa dude im totally on your side we should be against AJB. i love odom and would rather have odom right now and keep the core than get shaq.i agree hes declining. keep this team intact and go after a free agent big man later 450190[/snapback] like you said, what if there no big man later?!?! what do you do then 450193[/snapback] put it this way. in 2 years we lose shaq anyways. so ask urself this question and then realize that u have been wrong. if we dont make this trade in 2 years would u rather have no shaq,no butler,no odom,and 40 mill in cap...or have odom and butler and over 20 mill cap
July 10, 200421 yr get real people, the heat are this close to gettting shaq, and people are not exited about it. Yep, I love LO as much as anyone but I can't believe some people rather have Odom than Shaq. 450183[/snapback] id rather have odom and butler over shaq. 450185[/snapback] that is easy for you to say when you dont write the checks and make the profits. do you have any idea how shaq would single - handedly put people in the seats? hes the most marketable player in the league! this is a buisness!!!
July 10, 200421 yr u dont need more than 2 stars says the 3 rings they have on their finger. they didnt do it this year but they did it 3 years strait 450173[/snapback] Yeah, but this was back when they had effective role players and they played the triangle which maximizes those role players. The Heat won't be running that. Look, I'm not saying they wouldn't be good with Shaq, they would be, but they wouldn't be the favorites to win the league and they wouldn't be the favorites to win the East (provided, as you said, the Pistons keep Sheed). Their current team, with an addition of a solid backup point guard, is good enough to make the 2nd round of the playoffs, maybe even the conference finals. So why do you sacrifice an Odom to get a player like Shaq, who whether anyone wants to admit it or not, is NOT the player he was 3 years ago. He's only dominant sometimes. 450186[/snapback] whooaaaa dude im totally on your side we should be against AJB. i love odom and would rather have odom right now and keep the core than get shaq.i agree hes declining. keep this team intact and go after a free agent big man later 450190[/snapback] like you said, what if there no big man later?!?! what do you do then 450193[/snapback] put it this way. in 2 years we lose shaq anyways. so ask urself this question and then realize that u have been wrong. if we dont make this trade in 2 years would u rather have no shaq,no butler,no odom,and 40 mill in cap...or have odom and butler and over 20 mill cap 450194[/snapback] ill take the 2 years with shaq and the 40 mil in cap. and so would the heats FO. especially if that involves a title
July 10, 200421 yr get real people, the heat are this close to gettting shaq, and people are not exited about it. Yep, I love LO as much as anyone but I can't believe some people rather have Odom than Shaq. 450183[/snapback] id rather have odom and butler over shaq. 450185[/snapback] that is easy for you to say when you dont write the checks and make the profits. do you have any idea how shaq would single - handedly put people in the seats? hes the most marketable player in the league! this is a buisness!!! 450195[/snapback] yea im sure the heat want to get so many ppl for 1 year then shaq is gone then u have no odom or butler,we suck again and lose ppl dont come again. make money 1 year vs. keeping ur core and being good for years to come..??
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