October 20, 200521 yr The Red Sox are offering outfielder Manny Ramirez to the Mets for center fielder Carlos Beltran. http://www.usatoday.com/sports/bbw/columni...19-majors_x.htm
October 20, 200521 yr So then it's not going to happen because Beltran said he wouldn't waive the no-trade. However, if the no-trade didn't exist, this would be done in 3 seconds.
October 20, 200521 yr You have to think 2005 was an off season for Beltran (think A-Rod 2004) and that the upside on Beltran is more than Manny
October 20, 200521 yr You have to think 2005 was an off season for Beltran (think A-Rod 2004) and that the upside on Beltran is more than Manny Actually 2005 was just about what Beltran does every season.
October 20, 200521 yr You have to think 2005 was an off season for Beltran (think A-Rod 2004) and that the upside on Beltran is more than Manny Actually 2005 was just about what Beltran does every season. :blink: 2005: 16 HR / 78 RBI / 17 SB 2004: 38 HR / 104 RBI / 42 SB 2003: 26 HR / 100 RBI / 41 SB 2005 sure looks like an off year to me
October 20, 200521 yr Well I was speaking from a batting average standpoint, and he was hurt this year. He is not the player seen in the 04 playoffs.
October 20, 200521 yr You have to think 2005 was an off season for Beltran (think A-Rod 2004) and that the upside on Beltran is more than Manny Actually 2005 was just about what Beltran does every season. :blink: 2005: 16 HR / 78 RBI / 17 SB 2004: 38 HR / 104 RBI / 42 SB 2003: 26 HR / 100 RBI / 41 SB 2005 sure looks like an off year to me Yeah, but 2004 is also an aberration. Beltran's not a consistent .320 guy, he's a .280 hitter who adds 25 homers, and he's also probably the most overrated player in baseball. He's going to be 29 next season and he's still just a tools guy.
October 20, 200521 yr You have to think 2005 was an off season for Beltran (think A-Rod 2004) and that the upside on Beltran is more than Manny Actually 2005 was just about what Beltran does every season. :blink: 2005: 16 HR / 78 RBI / 17 SB 2004: 38 HR / 104 RBI / 42 SB 2003: 26 HR / 100 RBI / 41 SB 2005 sure looks like an off year to me Yeah, but 2004 is also an aberration. Beltran's not a consistent .320 guy, he's a .280 hitter who adds 25 homers, and he's also probably the most overrated player in baseball. He's going to be 29 next season and he's still just a tools guy. Fenway Park will only boost his average and XBH numbers.
October 20, 200521 yr You have to think 2005 was an off season for Beltran (think A-Rod 2004) and that the upside on Beltran is more than Manny Actually 2005 was just about what Beltran does every season. :blink: 2005: 16 HR / 78 RBI / 17 SB 2004: 38 HR / 104 RBI / 42 SB 2003: 26 HR / 100 RBI / 41 SB 2005 sure looks like an off year to me Yeah, but 2004 is also an aberration. Beltran's not a consistent .320 guy, he's a .280 hitter who adds 25 homers, and he's also probably the most overrated player in baseball. He's going to be 29 next season and he's still just a tools guy. Fenway Park will only boost his average and XBH numbers. Houston didn't do much for his average, but yes, I agree, Beltran would help himself immeasurably by getting into a smaller ballpark.
October 20, 200521 yr Author As much as I want more speed and youth on this team, I dont know if Beltran is the best way to get it especially if you have to break up the best offensive duo since Ruth and Gehrig. That said, if the Red Sox did do this deal, they would have to get another bat to go with Beltran to replace Man-Ram and Passion. Paul Konerko or Brian Giles would be a must. Plus, Beltran and Giles is a big defensive upgrade. Getting those two and Manny and Damon leaving frees up cash to get another OFer or 1B (depending on Giles/Konerko). With the 6 million more freed up by the possibility that they part ways with The Pro and Kevin Millar leaving. That money could be put in to going after Ryan or Wagner. Id only do this if they were confident other moves could definitely be made after the deal was struck.
October 20, 200521 yr As much as I want more speed and youth on this team, I dont know if Beltran is the best way to get it especially if you have to break up the best offensive duo since Ruth and Gehrig. That said, if the Red Sox did do this deal, they would have to get another bat to go with Beltran to replace Man-Ram and Passion. Paul Konerko or Brian Giles would be a must. Plus, Beltran and Giles is a big defensive upgrade. Getting those two and Manny and Damon leaving frees up cash to get another OFer or 1B (depending on Giles/Konerko). With the 6 million more freed up by the possibility that they part ways with The Pro and Kevin Millar leaving. That money could be put in to going after Ryan or Wagner. Id only do this if they were confident other moves could definitely be made after the deal was struck. It would free up money to get Giles (who the Cards are going to make their #1) or Konerko, but there isn't a free agent on the market who fits Boston's needs that would want to play there above any of the other teams that figure to be in on the bidding, meaning that this is a big gamble. For the Mets it's a no-brainer, but the question for the Red Sox is who bats lead-off, and who's the new 3-hole hitter (Beltran, in my mind, would be the #2).
October 20, 200521 yr gotta agree with spike here..... but at the same time...... you really dont know what to expect from beltain the only reason he's so paid is cuz he had one the best post seasons eva....... hahahhaa i hope beltrain is a bust that way the muts get screwed and ill be happy
October 20, 200521 yr I think Mets need to give Beltran another year before dealing him But if they do, and he's a failure, an offer like this will never, ever, be on the table again. In Beltran you're talking about a guy who has the potential to be a .300 hitter and a 30/30 guy in a good season, but you're also talking about a guy who will be 30 in a year and hasn't really tapped into his 5 tool talent. With Manny, you have a guy who (when motivated) easily hits .320 with 40 homers...if money weren't an issue, Manny is probably one of the 5 most desireable players in baseball, but he makes a lot of money for a one dimensional player.
October 20, 200521 yr Author As much as I want more speed and youth on this team, I dont know if Beltran is the best way to get it especially if you have to break up the best offensive duo since Ruth and Gehrig. That said, if the Red Sox did do this deal, they would have to get another bat to go with Beltran to replace Man-Ram and Passion. Paul Konerko or Brian Giles would be a must. Plus, Beltran and Giles is a big defensive upgrade. Getting those two and Manny and Damon leaving frees up cash to get another OFer or 1B (depending on Giles/Konerko). With the 6 million more freed up by the possibility that they part ways with The Pro and Kevin Millar leaving. That money could be put in to going after Ryan or Wagner. Id only do this if they were confident other moves could definitely be made after the deal was struck. It would free up money to get Giles (who the Cards are going to make their #1) or Konerko, but there isn't a free agent on the market who fits Boston's needs that would want to play there above any of the other teams that figure to be in on the bidding, meaning that this is a big gamble. For the Mets it's a no-brainer, but the question for the Red Sox is who bats lead-off, and who's the new 3-hole hitter (Beltran, in my mind, would be the #2). Dustin Pedoria? Even though I think he will play a big role next year, not even Theo is maverick enough to pull that one off. And I agree with you, if they do do that deal I think another deal is going to have to be pulled off after that and another deal/signing after that. Giles wants to go to Atlanta to play with his brother, but I dont think the Braves have the green to get him there. The Sox would definitely make him a huge priority if Passion and Man-Ram were let go, he is a Moneyball GM's wet dream. Who knows, it will be very tricky, but I trust Theo to make it work.
October 20, 200521 yr As much as I want more speed and youth on this team, I dont know if Beltran is the best way to get it especially if you have to break up the best offensive duo since Ruth and Gehrig. That said, if the Red Sox did do this deal, they would have to get another bat to go with Beltran to replace Man-Ram and Passion. Paul Konerko or Brian Giles would be a must. Plus, Beltran and Giles is a big defensive upgrade. Getting those two and Manny and Damon leaving frees up cash to get another OFer or 1B (depending on Giles/Konerko). With the 6 million more freed up by the possibility that they part ways with The Pro and Kevin Millar leaving. That money could be put in to going after Ryan or Wagner. Id only do this if they were confident other moves could definitely be made after the deal was struck. It would free up money to get Giles (who the Cards are going to make their #1) or Konerko, but there isn't a free agent on the market who fits Boston's needs that would want to play there above any of the other teams that figure to be in on the bidding, meaning that this is a big gamble. For the Mets it's a no-brainer, but the question for the Red Sox is who bats lead-off, and who's the new 3-hole hitter (Beltran, in my mind, would be the #2). Reantaria can bat lead off :whistle
October 21, 200521 yr Take my contract, please! Funny, usually the Mets are the one taking on long contracts.
October 21, 200521 yr You have to think 2005 was an off season for Beltran (think A-Rod 2004) and that the upside on Beltran is more than Manny Exactly: Here is his career with the Royals and Astros. This is the first season in which he has played mainly throughout the entire year but had less then 100 RBi's and less then 20 homers. Wait till next year '99 - 22HR, 108 RBI's, .293 '00 (Only half a season) '01 - 24Hr's, 101 RBI's, .306 '02 - 29Hr's, 105 RBI's, 273 '03 - 26Hr's, 100Rbi's .307 '04 - 38Hr's, 104 RBi's. 278
October 21, 200521 yr Author Gammons latest: The Red Sox did throw out the idea of a Manny Ramirez-Carlos Beltran deal in July, but it was on the weekend of the trading deadline after Ramirez had ask to be traded. The Mets rejected the idea, and GMs Omar Minaya and Theo Epstein tried to construct two-, three-, and four-way deals -- none of which worked. "The ironic thing is that by the end of the weekend, Manny said he would not go to the Mets," says Ramirez's agent Greg Genske of Legacy Sports Group. "I know people have speculated about Pedro [Martinez] and his influence, but Manny does not want to be traded to the Mets." And, anyway, the Red Sox say they have not offered the superstar outfielder to the Mets -- or anyone -- as of now. Genske plans to meet with Boston owner John Henry next week in Florida, and after that meeting some determination will be made on whether Ramirez will repeat his July request to be traded, or the team will see what it can get on the market, with the knowledge that as a 10-5 player, Ramirez can veto any deal. If Ramirez does request to be traded, Genske says "his preference would be Anaheim. He also still loves Cleveland, and would go back there." Another possibility would be Arizona, if Boston would take some of the contracts the Diamondbacks are trying to move, including Troy Glaus and Luis Gonzalez. Texas was in play at the deadline. The problem is that if the Red Sox baseball operations had their way, the only way Ramirez would be traded is if they could restock themselves with a young corner outfielder, a center fielder and pitching. Their feeling is that with so much money floating around the industry and so few free quality free agents, Ramirez's contract -- three years remaining at a present-day value of slightly more than $17 million -- will not be that bad come spring training. Also, while Ramirez is unpredictable and sometimes had hustle lapses, he has played 150 or more games three straight seasons, bettered in Red Sox history by only Frank Malzone (7), Carl Yastrzemski (5), Jim Rice and Dwight Evans (4 each). http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2199067
October 21, 200521 yr Anaheim has the prospects and the money to get that done, but where would he play? He couldn't DH full time, and I don't think Anderson could switch to center, or would Anderson become the full-time DH? Interesting scenario, but unlikely considering the Angels need the two things that the Red Sox do, a center-fielder and a first-basemen. Heck, the two of them are going to be competing for the same free agents, so I don't think the Angels do the deal just because they'd be helping the Red Sox fill more needs while it doesn't really do all that much for the Angels.
October 21, 200521 yr Author Anaheim has the prospects and the money to get that done, but where would he play? He couldn't DH full time, and I don't think Anderson could switch to center, or would Anderson become the full-time DH? Interesting scenario, but unlikely considering the Angels need the two things that the Red Sox do, a center-fielder and a first-basemen. Heck, the two of them are going to be competing for the same free agents, so I don't think the Angels do the deal just because they'd be helping the Red Sox fill more needs while it doesn't really do all that much for the Angels. The Red Sox would be foolish not to get Anderson in that deal.
October 21, 200521 yr Anaheim has the prospects and the money to get that done, but where would he play? He couldn't DH full time, and I don't think Anderson could switch to center, or would Anderson become the full-time DH? Interesting scenario, but unlikely considering the Angels need the two things that the Red Sox do, a center-fielder and a first-basemen. Heck, the two of them are going to be competing for the same free agents, so I don't think the Angels do the deal just because they'd be helping the Red Sox fill more needs while it doesn't really do all that much for the Angels. The Red Sox would be foolish not to get Anderson in that deal. You think? If it's me, I say that Anderson's back is too much of a risk to justify giving him the kind of money he's making when a much more attractive player is available on the F.A. market in Brian Giles. If I'm the Red Sox, I ask for Casey Kotchman, Kendry Morales and Ervin Santana. Take the savings and sign Brian Giles, let Kotchman be the first-baseman, plug Santana into the rotation and then find a way to get Cameron or Hunter to be the centerfielder. But, that's a lot of maneuvering and it has to all work out perfectly, otherwise you broke up probably the most dangerous 3-4 in baseball and have a hole at leadoff (which, I know is still unaddressed in this scenario).
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