October 3, 200619 yr C/O ESPN Insider Too many bucks for these Bucs Sep 29 - The Pirates are unlikely to exercise reliever Damaso Marte's 2007 option for $3 million, the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette reports. "I like the team. I like Pittsburgh," Marte told the newspaper. "I hope I stay." I really like this guy. I think that for 2-3 million dollars he is a bargain. I really hope the front office takes a long look at him Thoughts?
October 3, 200619 yr This team is allergic to spending money, I like Marte but I just don't see them spending that kind of money on a player like him.
October 3, 200619 yr I too love him, but how could the front office justify spending 3 million on him, when there are people who think we're going to have to trade Dontrelle or Miguel due to their upcoming raises of between 6 and 14 million total? I would LOVE to add an arm like Marte's and most people DO undervalue a great middle reliever. But until Miggy and Dontrelle are officially locked in for next year, how can we even entertain such a thought. I WISH we had an owner that would make that move. Unfortunately it will be the Yanks, Dodgers, Mets, or someone like that to offer him 12 million over 3 years.
October 3, 200619 yr If we're set on spending money, he's not the best we could do. If we're not spending money, there's no way in hell we add anyone in that price level. Either way, he doesn't have a place on this team. Bullpen (current projections): Tankersley/Garcia (one at set up, one at closer). Resop (7th inning) Pinto (principle fireman) Messenger (mop-up) Bowyer (if he's alive) Herges or someone like him. Remember, a bullpen at most carries 7 guys.
October 3, 200619 yr What about Carlos Martinez? Would he be ready mid-season? It takes 12-18 months for recovery from TJ surgey and he didnt have it done till July 6th. I wouldnt expect him to contribute until 2008, same with Logan
October 3, 200619 yr I'll take Herges back if he wants. There are many worse. And I know we'll go out and grab at least another veteran arm to bring to ST. I don't trust Pinto, Garcia or Resop at all with the setup role (yet)
October 3, 200619 yr If we're set on spending money, he's not the best we could do. If we're not spending money, there's no way in hell we add anyone in that price level. Either way, he doesn't have a place on this team. Bullpen (current projections): Tankersley/Garcia (one at set up, one at closer). Resop (7th inning) Pinto (principle fireman) Messenger (mop-up) Bowyer (if he's alive) Herges or someone like him. Remember, a bullpen at most carries 7 guys. Pettit in the bullpen as well, Pinto at lefty specialist. Garcia into the rotation and an old reliever coming into help in the bullpen (foulke, dotel, etc) over the hill trying to reprove himself. Starting Pitching Johnson Olsen Sanchez Nolasco Garcia C Olivo 1B jacobs 2B Uggla SS Hanley 3B Cabrera RF Hermida/Dukes CF Baldelli LF Willingham In other words, I think the FO will trade Willis because of his expense and get Dukes/baldelli. Just a guess, not a hope or anything, but it seems to be everything they have been saying of late with no raising salaries and all. Personally I want Dtrain and Miggy locked up long term
October 3, 200619 yr why does everyone want to make Renyel Pinto a lefty specialist? he can get out righties...
October 3, 200619 yr We will be going under teh radar for bullpen help. It's what we do, we aren't going to change that method. Marte will sign with the Whitesox anyway...
October 3, 200619 yr Pinto, Petit, and Garcia will all get shots to start next spring training...and I believe Tank will get a chance to start games as well ala Papelbon. I don't think he had enough time in the minors to see if he's just a pen man. so we have... LOCKS for the rotation D-Train (unless dealt) Johnson Sanchez Olsen FREE SLOT Potentially 2 free slots with Garcia, Petit, and Pinto competing along with Tank possibly. Not sure where the FO will go there, but I'm sure Tank wants to opportunity at least in spring training.
October 3, 200619 yr Read my lips: Marte is not good. He has a penchant for blowing leads. He did it with the White Sox and then with the Pirates. I never liked that bum.
October 3, 200619 yr Spending $3 million on a subpar reliever for this cash-strapped team is totally ridiculous.
October 4, 200619 yr We will be going under teh radar for bullpen help. It's what we do, we aren't going to change that method. Marte will sign with the Whitesox anyway... We traded him to the bucs for Rob Mackowiak and Ozzie has issues with him, he will not be on the south side so long as Ozzie is at the helm. Also the white sox have enough left handed relievers Matt Thornton, Neal Cotts and Boooooooone! Logan 21yr old rookie ball phenom that failed at the show his first time up while skipping 3 levels but then settled into the knights closer and put up this line 11SV 42.2IP 57SO/12BB. Anyways the fish will not be getting Marte too much $, and they want to see what they've got in their system as far as BP help.
October 4, 200619 yr Why would we need him when we have Tank and Pinto? Mid-season I wasn't a fan of Pinto at all, but by the end of the year he developed into one of our most reliable relievers, who like Ramp said, could easily get righties out as well. I think he's going to be extremely valuable next year, and with Tank as well, our money could be better spent elsewhere.
October 4, 200619 yr Spending $3 million on a subpar reliever for this cash-strapped team is totally ridiculous. This man is preaching the truth.
October 4, 200619 yr Pinto, Petit, and Garcia will all get shots to start next spring training...and I believe Tank will get a chance to start games as well ala Papelbon. I don't think he had enough time in the minors to see if he's just a pen man. so we have... LOCKS for the rotation D-Train (unless dealt) Johnson Sanchez Olsen FREE SLOT Potentially 2 free slots with Garcia, Petit, and Pinto competing along with Tank possibly. Not sure where the FO will go there, but I'm sure Tank wants to opportunity at least in spring training. Tank has said that he prefers being a closer to starting
October 4, 200619 yr why does everyone want to make Renyel Pinto a lefty specialist? he can get out righties... MLB vs LHP .171 BAA, K% (K/AB) 33% vs RHP .200 BAA, K% (K/AB) 30% Fantastic numbers above. The problem is obvious though, he walked 27 guys and hit a batter in 29 innings. I want to make him a LOOGY just because I can't trust him to get more than 1-2 outs with that control. Not that he is ineffective versus right handers, because certainly he kills them as well on a pure "hits" standpoint. Tank is easily the # 1 lefty in the pen and will get the crucial situations, so really the only role I see for Pinto is to be the secondary guy to finish off innings. Let him focus on one thing - lefties - and see if he can consistently get them out. I don't think he'll ever be a starter with that control, so might as well groom him as a fireballer reliever right now. I think he can do it.
October 4, 200619 yr why does everyone want to make Renyel Pinto a lefty specialist? he can get out righties... MLB vs LHP .171 BAA, K% (K/AB) 33% vs RHP .200 BAA, K% (K/AB) 30% Fantastic numbers above. The problem is obvious though, he walked 27 guys and hit a batter in 29 innings. I want to make him a LOOGY just because I can't trust him to get more than 1-2 outs with that control. Not that he is ineffective versus right handers, because certainly he kills them as well on a pure "hits" standpoint. Tank is easily the # 1 lefty in the pen and will get the crucial situations, so really the only role I see for Pinto is to be the secondary guy to finish off innings. Let him focus on one thing - lefties - and see if he can consistently get them out. I don't think he'll ever be a starter with that control, so might as well groom him as a fireballer reliever right now. I think he can do it. I was also looking at his minor league numbers from this past year. vs lefties: 4.44era | 26.1ip | 32h | 2hr | 16bb | 32k | .299baa vs righties: 3.00era | 69ip | 50h | 6hr | 31bb | 64k | .203baa
October 4, 200619 yr why does everyone want to make Renyel Pinto a lefty specialist? he can get out righties... MLB vs LHP .171 BAA, K% (K/AB) 33% vs RHP .200 BAA, K% (K/AB) 30% Fantastic numbers above. The problem is obvious though, he walked 27 guys and hit a batter in 29 innings. I want to make him a LOOGY just because I can't trust him to get more than 1-2 outs with that control. Not that he is ineffective versus right handers, because certainly he kills them as well on a pure "hits" standpoint. Tank is easily the # 1 lefty in the pen and will get the crucial situations, so really the only role I see for Pinto is to be the secondary guy to finish off innings. Let him focus on one thing - lefties - and see if he can consistently get them out. I don't think he'll ever be a starter with that control, so might as well groom him as a fireballer reliever right now. I think he can do it. I was also looking at his minor league numbers from this past year. vs lefties: 4.44era | 26.1ip | 32h | 2hr | 16bb | 32k | .299baa vs righties: 3.00era | 69ip | 50h | 6hr | 31bb | 64k | .203baa That is really eye opening compared to the relative even numbers at the MLB level, especially in batting average. I wonder if he has stamina issues after X amount of pitches/innings and that accounts for a decrease in success versus lefties. Guess we'll find out next year if he can keep the trend up, or if it levels out to his historical performance.
October 4, 200619 yr Pinto, Petit, and Garcia will all get shots to start next spring training...and I believe Tank will get a chance to start games as well ala Papelbon. I don't think he had enough time in the minors to see if he's just a pen man. so we have... LOCKS for the rotation D-Train (unless dealt) Johnson Sanchez Olsen FREE SLOT Potentially 2 free slots with Garcia, Petit, and Pinto competing along with Tank possibly. Not sure where the FO will go there, but I'm sure Tank wants to opportunity at least in spring training. Tank has said that he prefers being a closer to starting Maybe. I can't really trust those public statements though because SP is where the money is at unless you're the closer. If he stays in the pen I hope it's as a setup because saves would inflate arby money. Still I think there's a decent chance they try him as a SP in spring training.
October 4, 200619 yr why does everyone want to make Renyel Pinto a lefty specialist? vs. Left: .171 vs. Right: .200 he can get out righties... Agreed. I wouldn't want to make him a lefty specialist, either. More versitility in the pen is always a good thing, IMO.
October 4, 200619 yr Marte has nasty stuff, but he's never put it together. He's better than some of our guys, but I don't think he's going to be a top value for a team like the Marlins of 2007, with all the talk of keeping payroll low, I don't see anybody getting more than league minimum other than Willis and Cabrera. I see the same situation next spring, with all the washed up has beens showing up as non roster invitees battling youngsters for roster spots.
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