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Old, but a good read. sorry if previously posted

 

Cabrera is baseball's most underrated player

 

Dayn Perry / Special to FOXSports.com

Posted: 20 days ago

 

Calling any player "underrated" or "overrated" is by definition a subjective exercise. It's also fraught with hazards. After all, if enough people call a certain player underrated, then it's entirely possible that subsequent temperature readings will reveal him to be overrated. Or vice versa. Still, with those caveats laid out, let's promptly defy them by saying this: Miguel Cabrera is the most underrated player in baseball.

 

Going into Tuesday play, the Florida Marlins third baseman ranked sixth in the NL with a .435 on-base percentage, fifth with a .604 slugging percentage and sixth with a .349 batting avergae. What's notable about those numbers is that A) they're awesome and B) they're being put up by a 24-year-old who's playing his home games in one of the best pitcher's parks in baseball.

 

On that final point, Dolphins Stadium over the last three full seasons has reduced run scoring by roughly 10 percent, and it's especially tough on right-handed batters who hit for average (that's Cabrera). So on that front, circumstances are working against him, as they have been his entire career.

 

And did we mention he's still only 24? Yes, we did, but that's a point worth re-emphasizing. Signed in 1999 as a non-drafted free agent out of Venezuela, Cabrera earned early praise for his bat speed, plate coverage and ability to hit to all fields. In 2003, he busted out in a big way. Despite toiling in the pitcher-friendly Southern League, Cabrera authored a batting line of .365 AVG/.429 OBP/.609 SLG and tallied 42 extra-base hits in 266 at bats. When a 20-year-old produces like that in Double-A, you can assume he's going to be something special.

 

Let's take a jaunt through the numbers to put Cabrera's bestowals in a better light:

 

As a 20-year-old in 2003, he became just the third player since 1900 to hit a walk-off home run in his first major-league game. That season, he also hit .333 AVG/.394 OBP/.633 SLG in the Marlins' NLCS victory over the Cubs. He also tallied four home runs in the 2003 postseason (including one off Roger Clemens). The Marlins, of course, topped the Yankees in that World Series. In 2005, he became the youngest player in major-league history to record back-to-back 30-homer seasons. He's played only three full seasons in the majors, and already he's a three-time All-Star and two-time Silver Slugger. Coming into this season, on the all-time list for players age 24 and younger, Cabrera ranked ninth in career doubles, 21st in career total bases, 17th in career extra-base hits and 30th in career hits. Right now, if paces hold, Cabrera this season will join Lou Gehrig (1927) and Jimmie Foxx (1932) as the only players ever to total at least 200 hits, 40 homers and 90 walks in a season before age 25. Elite company, to say the least. (Kathy Willens / Associated Press)

 

There's a Bill James statistical tool called the "Favorite Toy" that provides career projections based on a player's age and accomplishments to date. It's quick and dirty in the extreme, but it does provide a reasonable guess as to where a player might end up. In Cabrera's case, the Favorite Toy predicts that by the time his career is over he'll wind up with 394 career home runs (which would be good for 48th place on the all-time list), 578 doubles (good for 18th place), 2,544 hits (good for 77th place), 1,523 RBI (good for 45th place), 1,416 runs scored (good for 77th place), 998 extra-base hits (good for 27th place), 4,356 total bases (good for 44th place) and 3,614 times on base (good for 70th place).

 

In other words, he'd be a Hall of Famer.

 

So where's the love/admiration/column inches for such a lavishly gifted young hitter? Part of it, of course, is that he bides his time on baseball's rural route, and part of it, of course, is that in recent seasons he's shared the stage with Barry Bonds and Albert Pujols, who both managed to (narrowly) out-do him in one season or another. Whatever the reasons, Cabrera doesn't get his due as one of the most productive hitters in the game today.

 

This isn't to say he's without weaknesses. He's not an optimal defender at third, and this spring he reportedly showed up at camp weighing 260 pounds, which doesn't bode well for his ability to age well and retain his skills. Still, in the here and now he's an offensive powerhouse of the first order. Playing on a team that doesn't get much ink and for an organization that seems to care more about bilking taxpayers than winning ballgames doesn't help his cause, but that doesn't change the reality.

 

So on those rare occasions when Miguel Cabrera and the Marlins show up on your television screen, take the opportunity to appreciate this amazing young talent. Or you can just wait around until the winter of 2009, when Cabrera becomes a free agent and everyone will be squarely aboard the bandwagon.

 

Dayn Perry is a frequent contributor to FOXSports.com and author of the new book, "Winners: How Good Baseball Teams Become Great Ones"

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It hurts me to say this and I know I will most likely get killed for it but:

 

I think he is the most overrated player in the league....at least by us fish fans.

 

Obviously he is a great hitter, but he isn't a 'clutch' hitter, he makes a lot of errors, and he seems to have a poor work ethic.

 

Let me qualify this by saying I think if he wanted to work hard, drop some of his extra weight, he could be the best player in the league.

 

I mean THIS season, last year he was great. This year he is flailing at pitches out of the zone and looking foolish far to often.

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Hahaha, overrated, that's a good one.

 

Is he in the same league as Pujols' last three years? No, but he's certainly an incredible talent, and given his positional scarcity, he deserves every accolade he receives, and then some.

 

 

If you read it I said he was a great player and could be the best in the league if he worked harder.

 

The problem isn't him, it is the level some of us put him on. You have to take his errors and constant strikeouts this season into consideration. (Though everyone is striking out on this team)

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It hurts me to say this and I know I will most likely get killed for it but:

 

I think he is the most overrated player in the league....at least by us fish fans.

 

Obviously he is a great hitter, but he isn't a 'clutch' hitter, he makes a lot of errors, and he seems to have a poor work ethic.

 

Let me qualify this by saying I think if he wanted to work hard, drop some of his extra weight, he could be the best player in the league.

 

I mean THIS season, last year he was great. This year he is flailing at pitches out of the zone and looking foolish far to often.

:blink:

Overrated? I absolutely agree he's been striking out too much this past month. It's actually completely un Cabrera-like lately with all the K's, but part of that is attributed to teams pitching around him. He needs to be more patient (like in 2006). I don't care how good Hammer has been doing, Cabs doesn't have any real protection in that lineup. He's been pressing a bit lately and swinging at pitches that he would normally never swing at. But bet on Cabrera batting .330-.340 this season w/ 30+ HRs & 100+ RBIs.

 

Not "clutch"? What exactly does that mean? He's batting .340 with RISP this season, including 2 walk-offs. With runners on base, he is batting .370. Men on and 2 out? .333.

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It hurts me to say this and I know I will most likely get killed for it but:

 

I think he is the most overrated player in the league....at least by us fish fans.

 

Obviously he is a great hitter, but he isn't a 'clutch' hitter, he makes a lot of errors, and he seems to have a poor work ethic.

 

Let me qualify this by saying I think if he wanted to work hard, drop some of his extra weight, he could be the best player in the league.

 

I mean THIS season, last year he was great. This year he is flailing at pitches out of the zone and looking foolish far to often.

 

 

:blink:

Overrated? I agree he's been striking out too much this past month, but part of that is attributed to teams pitching around him. I don't care how good Hammer has been doing, Cabs doesn't have any real protection in that lineup. He's been pressing a bit lately and swinging at pitches that he would normally never swing at. But bet on Cabrera batting .330-.340 this season w/ 30+ HRs & 100+ RBIs.

 

Not "clutch"? What exactly does that mean? He's batting .340 with RISP this season, including 2 walk-offs. With runners on base, he is batting .370. Men on and 2 out? .333.

 

Got me with those numbers at the end, I'll admit that. Do you have the numbers for 7th inning or later? I'd like to see those, because to me that is when he seems to struggle at times.

 

Again he is a top 6 player in the league most likely that's not what I'm saying. What I'm saying is that a lot of us treat him like God and don't criticize him when he is playing poorly. The errors need to cut down and so do the strikeouts. I'm glad he is a player on our team and not someone elses. I just see a few flaws in his game, and don't think he is underrated (especially by Marlin fans)

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It hurts me to say this and I know I will most likely get killed for it but:

 

I think he is the most overrated player in the league....at least by us fish fans.

 

Obviously he is a great hitter, but he isn't a 'clutch' hitter, he makes a lot of errors, and he seems to have a poor work ethic.

 

Let me qualify this by saying I think if he wanted to work hard, drop some of his extra weight, he could be the best player in the league.

 

I mean THIS season, last year he was great. This year he is flailing at pitches out of the zone and looking foolish far to often.

:blink:

Overrated? I absolutely agree he's been striking out too much this past month. It's actually completely un Cabrera-like lately with all the K's, but part of that is attributed to teams pitching around him. He needs to be more patient (like in 2006). I don't care how good Hammer has been doing, Cabs doesn't have any real protection in that lineup. He's been pressing a bit lately and swinging at pitches that he would normally never swing at. But bet on Cabrera batting .330-.340 this season w/ 30+ HRs & 100+ RBIs.

 

Not "clutch"? What exactly does that mean? He's batting .340 with RISP this season, including 2 walk-offs. With runners on base, he is batting .370. Men on and 2 out? .333.

 

Maybe he is thinking about last night

 

It hurts me to say this and I know I will most likely get killed for it but:

 

I think he is the most overrated player in the league....at least by us fish fans.

 

Obviously he is a great hitter, but he isn't a 'clutch' hitter, he makes a lot of errors, and he seems to have a poor work ethic.

 

Let me qualify this by saying I think if he wanted to work hard, drop some of his extra weight, he could be the best player in the league.

 

I mean THIS season, last year he was great. This year he is flailing at pitches out of the zone and looking foolish far to often.

 

 

:blink:

Overrated? I agree he's been striking out too much this past month, but part of that is attributed to teams pitching around him. I don't care how good Hammer has been doing, Cabs doesn't have any real protection in that lineup. He's been pressing a bit lately and swinging at pitches that he would normally never swing at. But bet on Cabrera batting .330-.340 this season w/ 30+ HRs & 100+ RBIs.

 

Not "clutch"? What exactly does that mean? He's batting .340 with RISP this season, including 2 walk-offs. With runners on base, he is batting .370. Men on and 2 out? .333.

 

Got me with those numbers at the end, I'll admit that. Do you have the numbers for 7th inning or later? I'd like to see those, because to me that is when he seems to struggle at times.

 

Again he is a top 6 player in the league most likely that's not what I'm saying. What I'm saying is that a lot of us treat him like God and don't criticize him when he is playing poorly. The errors need to cut down and so do the strikeouts. I'm glad he is a player on our team and not someone elses. I just see a few flaws in his game, and don't think he is underrated (especially by Marlin fans)

 

in terms of baseball, he is a god.

 

I think he goes underappreciated by the fans. We will miss him dearly the day he hits free agency or the FO decides to trade him

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It hurts me to say this and I know I will most likely get killed for it but:

 

I think he is the most overrated player in the league....at least by us fish fans.

 

Obviously he is a great hitter, but he isn't a 'clutch' hitter, he makes a lot of errors, and he seems to have a poor work ethic.

 

Let me qualify this by saying I think if he wanted to work hard, drop some of his extra weight, he could be the best player in the league.

 

I mean THIS season, last year he was great. This year he is flailing at pitches out of the zone and looking foolish far to often.

 

clutch doesnt exist but to play the game he has over 400 OBP with Bases loaded

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It hurts me to say this and I know I will most likely get killed for it but:

 

I think he is the most overrated player in the league....at least by us fish fans.

 

Obviously he is a great hitter, but he isn't a 'clutch' hitter, he makes a lot of errors, and he seems to have a poor work ethic.

 

Let me qualify this by saying I think if he wanted to work hard, drop some of his extra weight, he could be the best player in the league.

 

I mean THIS season, last year he was great. This year he is flailing at pitches out of the zone and looking foolish far to often.

 

 

:blink:

Overrated? I agree he's been striking out too much this past month, but part of that is attributed to teams pitching around him. I don't care how good Hammer has been doing, Cabs doesn't have any real protection in that lineup. He's been pressing a bit lately and swinging at pitches that he would normally never swing at. But bet on Cabrera batting .330-.340 this season w/ 30+ HRs & 100+ RBIs.

 

Not "clutch"? What exactly does that mean? He's batting .340 with RISP this season, including 2 walk-offs. With runners on base, he is batting .370. Men on and 2 out? .333.

 

Got me with those numbers at the end, I'll admit that. Do you have the numbers for 7th inning or later? I'd like to see those, because to me that is when he seems to struggle at times.

 

Again he is a top 6 player in the league most likely that's not what I'm saying. What I'm saying is that a lot of us treat him like God and don't criticize him when he is playing poorly. The errors need to cut down and so do the strikeouts. I'm glad he is a player on our team and not someone elses. I just see a few flaws in his game, and don't think he is underrated (especially by Marlin fans)

 

7th inning or later: .281 (cnnsi.com). For "close and late" games, I have conflicting numbers. ESPN.com has him at .167, but MLB.com has his average at .333.

 

And I would be lying if I didn't say I am a bit alarmed at the abundance of strikeouts by him. He's 5-9 in the Cubs' series, but the 4 outs were all K's. Hmm, Cabs. When you make contact, good things normally happen. :mischief

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I will say this, I don't agree that he's baseball's most underrated player. I think you just look at the All-Star voting and see Cabrera's name up there and you realize that fans of teams other than the Marlins are voting for him.

 

To me, the most underrated player is either Roy Halladay, Hanley Ramirez or Roy Oswalt.

 

I think "under appreciated" would be a better description for Miggy.

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It hurts me to say this and I know I will most likely get killed for it but:

 

I think he is the most overrated player in the league....at least by us fish fans.

 

Obviously he is a great hitter, but he isn't a 'clutch' hitter, he makes a lot of errors, and he seems to have a poor work ethic.

 

Let me qualify this by saying I think if he wanted to work hard, drop some of his extra weight, he could be the best player in the league.

 

I mean THIS season, last year he was great. This year he is flailing at pitches out of the zone and looking foolish far to often.

 

clutch doesnt exist but to play the game he has over 400 OBP with Bases loaded

 

Actually, his OBP w/ bases loaded is .600.

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http://mlb.mlb.com/stats/individual_stats_...playerID=408234

 

close/late is right there but over a 400 OBP

 

His stats away are better then home, his RISP are better as well, etc etc.

 

pretty sick stats

 

I will say this, I don't agree that he's baseball's most underrated player. I think you just look at the All-Star voting and see Cabrera's name up there and you realize that fans of teams other than the Marlins are voting for him.

 

To me, the most underrated player is either Roy Halladay, Hanley Ramirez or Roy Oswalt.

 

I think "under appreciated" would be a better description for Miggy.

 

halladay gets mentioned with santana by many and he cant keep healthy.

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It hurts me to say this and I know I will most likely get killed for it but:

 

I think he is the most overrated player in the league....at least by us fish fans.

 

Obviously he is a great hitter, but he isn't a 'clutch' hitter, he makes a lot of errors, and he seems to have a poor work ethic.

 

Let me qualify this by saying I think if he wanted to work hard, drop some of his extra weight, he could be the best player in the league.

 

I mean THIS season, last year he was great. This year he is flailing at pitches out of the zone and looking foolish far to often.

 

 

:blink:

Overrated? I agree he's been striking out too much this past month, but part of that is attributed to teams pitching around him. I don't care how good Hammer has been doing, Cabs doesn't have any real protection in that lineup. He's been pressing a bit lately and swinging at pitches that he would normally never swing at. But bet on Cabrera batting .330-.340 this season w/ 30+ HRs & 100+ RBIs.

 

Not "clutch"? What exactly does that mean? He's batting .340 with RISP this season, including 2 walk-offs. With runners on base, he is batting .370. Men on and 2 out? .333.

 

Got me with those numbers at the end, I'll admit that. Do you have the numbers for 7th inning or later? I'd like to see those, because to me that is when he seems to struggle at times.

 

Again he is a top 6 player in the league most likely that's not what I'm saying. What I'm saying is that a lot of us treat him like God and don't criticize him when he is playing poorly. The errors need to cut down and so do the strikeouts. I'm glad he is a player on our team and not someone elses. I just see a few flaws in his game, and don't think he is underrated (especially by Marlin fans)

 

7th inning or later: .281 (cnnsi.com). For "close and late" games, I have conflicting numbers. ESPN.com has him at .167, but MLB.com has his average at .333.

 

And I would be lying if I didn't say I am a bit alarmed at the abundance of strikeouts by him. He's 5-9 in the Cubs' series, but the 4 outs were all K's. Hmm, Cabs. When you make contact, good things normally happen. :mischief

 

Teams always say they're not going to let Miggy beat them. Consequently, no one pitches to him when it's "close and late." So I am not sure that's a fair measure of his "clutchness."

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I will say this: Even though Cabs' strikeouts have alarmed me, I don't think it's something to worry about because it is completely unlike him. Each of his years in the majors, he has cut down on his K's. He's just going through a bad strikeout streak right now, whether he's pressing or not quite seeing the ball well (and still batting .323).

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He's only underrated if you are talking about people that don't know or follow the game.

 

Plus, when a lot of people start calling you underrated - including the media - you cease to have that title.

 

Now Hanley, is very much underrated. Not to mention the best deal in the entire majors (production v. cost).

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He's only underrated if you are talking about people that don't know or follow the game.

 

Plus, when a lot of people start calling you underrated - including the media - you cease to have that title.

 

Now Hanley, is very much underrated. Not to mention the best deal in the entire majors (production v. cost).

 

:thumbup

 

The whole Brian Giles thing from a few years back too, so "underrated" to the point he became overrated.

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It hurts me to say this and I know I will most likely get killed for it but:

 

I think he is the most overrated player in the league....at least by us fish fans.

 

Obviously he is a great hitter, but he isn't a 'clutch' hitter, he makes a lot of errors, and he seems to have a poor work ethic.

 

Let me qualify this by saying I think if he wanted to work hard, drop some of his extra weight, he could be the best player in the league.

 

I mean THIS season, last year he was great. This year he is flailing at pitches out of the zone and looking foolish far to often.

 

:blink:

 

Come on now, it's not THAT bad.

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It hurts me to say this and I know I will most likely get killed for it but:

 

I think he is the most overrated player in the league....at least by us fish fans.

 

Obviously he is a great hitter, but he isn't a 'clutch' hitter, he makes a lot of errors, and he seems to have a poor work ethic.

 

Let me qualify this by saying I think if he wanted to work hard, drop some of his extra weight, he could be the best player in the league.

 

I mean THIS season, last year he was great. This year he is flailing at pitches out of the zone and looking foolish far to often.

 

I agree...Cabrera has the potential to be an Albert Pujols type player, but it seems he lacks the will. There is absolutely no excuse for showing up overweight two years in a row...much less as a 24 year old. There's no excuse for that at all. His career won't last long, and it won't be as illustrious as it should be, if he doesn't change his attitude.

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It hurts me to say this and I know I will most likely get killed for it but:

 

I think he is the most overrated player in the league....at least by us fish fans.

 

Obviously he is a great hitter, but he isn't a 'clutch' hitter, he makes a lot of errors, and he seems to have a poor work ethic.

 

Let me qualify this by saying I think if he wanted to work hard, drop some of his extra weight, he could be the best player in the league.

 

I mean THIS season, last year he was great. This year he is flailing at pitches out of the zone and looking foolish far to often.

 

I agree...Cabrera has the potential to be an Albert Pujols type player, but it seems he lacks the will. There is absolutely no excuse for showing up overweight two years in a row...much less as a 24 year old. There's no excuse for that at all. His career won't last long, and it won't be as illustrious as it should be, if he doesn't change his attitude.

 

Babe Ruth didn't have a problem being a fatass. lol.

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