January 25, 200818 yr What if the Twins trade Johan Santana for Church, Heilman, and 2 of Mulvey/Humber/Guerra/Pelfrey. You think this would be a good trade? Johan Santana for Church, Heilman, Guerra, Pelfrey, and 1 of Martinez/Gomez Final deal and ink: Johan Santana for Carlos Gomez and minor-league pitchers Phil Humber, Deolis Guerra and Kevin Mulvey. "With all due respect, Bill Smith was 'owned'. From the Mets alone he could have had Aaron Heilman, Ryan Church, Mike Pelfrey, and Fernando Martinez. Those 4 are better than what he got. He's an inexperienced GM. He did a really great trade with Tampa Bay that was great for both teams. In this case, he really screwed up. His problem was trying to get the Red Sox and us (Yankees) in it at the last minute. When the Mets found out that neither gave him a final offer, they fell back on the original proposal and the Twins had no choice but to take it." article on trade: http://www.usatoday.com/sports/baseball/20...s-santana_N.htm
January 25, 200818 yr What if the Twins trade Johan Santana for Church, Heilman, and Mulvey and Humber/Guerra. You think this would be a good trade? Come on... :banghead
January 25, 200818 yr Duuuuude You scared the crap outta me. At least title the thread "Santana trade idea" You had me thinking Santana was officially on his way to the Mets
January 25, 200818 yr And to answer that question, no...the Twins would not be getting nearly enough. We're talking about one of the best pitchers, if not the best, pitchers in baseball in the last 4 years or so... Those guys that the Mets offering (except for guera, he's an up and coming prospect) are all guys who's stocks have dropped immensely. If I'm the Twins, I demand Fernando Martinez, Guerra, and maybe Mike Pelfrey or something even though his stock has dropped too...
January 25, 200818 yr my heart just skipped a beat -- the Twins were looking for 4 prospects (all of those you have listed are being offered by the Mets) from the Mets and possibly subbing Church for a prospect.
January 25, 200818 yr i thought he was a mut already. i hope this just stays as a trade idea and is never real.
January 25, 200818 yr Duuuuude You scared the crap outta me. At least title the thread "Santana trade idea" You had me thinking Santana was officially on his way to the Mets i sh*t myself when i read Santana to Mets...
January 25, 200818 yr Why does everyone think the Twins are in such a powerful position? They NEED to get rid of Santana. If they can't find a suitor, he's a free agent next year and signs with whoever shows him the green. It's that simple. As much as I'd like to see Santana on my team, I don't want to morgage the future of my franchise to do it. See: Heat, Miami.
January 25, 200818 yr Why does everyone think the Twins are in such a powerful position? They NEED to get rid of Santana. If they can't find a suitor, he's a free agent next year and signs with whoever shows him the green. It's that simple. As much as I'd like to see Santana on my team, I don't want to morgage the future of my franchise to do it. See: Heat, Miami. Meh. Santana is a unique talent and if you have to mortgage your future for a top 2 pitcher in all of baseball, you do it. He is an absolute difference maker that puts a good team over the top. I think the Miami Heat example you provide actually strengthens my position, because the Heat clearly made the right move by trading for Shaq. They won the championship. Sure they are awful right now, but if you keep Butler and Odom, they at best are a combo of the Pistons/Suns/08 Lakers for the new few years. Very good team, but they don't get a ring. We won, you can't question the move. Now if had lost in the finals, and then gone on this horrible losing run, then yea...second guess all you want.
January 26, 200818 yr What if the Twins trade Johan Santana for Church, Heilman, and 2 of Mulvey/Humber/Guerra/Pelfrey. You think this would be a good trade? Dude you've got problems!
January 26, 200818 yr Twins sign Morneau for 80 million, must mean they are close to making a deal for Santana or something along those lines...
January 26, 200818 yr Author Just to let you guys know, that trade idea wasn't really a trade idea. I just said it just in case if the negotiation does fall apart and I end up looking like a false rumor spreader. Right now the Twins have decided to choose Guerra and Pelfrey from the 4 players selection. Mets and Twins are now talking about adding Martinez or Gomez to the deal too.
January 26, 200818 yr id do it for Humber, Guerra, Gomez & Church. FMart should be untouchable and we cannot afford to lose Hielman.
January 26, 200818 yr id do it for Humber, Guerra, Gomez & Church. FMart should be untouchable and we cannot afford to lose Hielman. Humber- Sucks (ERA above 4 in the minors) Guerra- Very Young, not nearly major league ready Gomez- Sucks (has never done anything in the minor leagues) Church- Mediocre 28 year old outfielder Santana- One of the best, if not the best, pitchers in baseball Yeah that's a real even trade :|
January 26, 200818 yr id do it for Humber, Guerra, Gomez & Church. FMart should be untouchable and we cannot afford to lose Hielman. Humber- Sucks (ERA above 4 in the minors) Guerra- Very Young, not nearly major league ready Gomez- Sucks (has never done anything in the minor leagues) Church- Mediocre 28 year old outfielder Santana- One of the best, if not the best, pitchers in baseball Yeah that's a real even trade :| Church.... real medicore 113 OPS+ for his career in a huge pitchers ball park. He can play everyday for some teams. Gomez, oh ya he sucks except for that fact that he may be the fastest man in baseball, one the best defensive outfielders in baseball and has great size&potential. http://www.thebaseballcube.com/players/G/C...s-Gomez-1.shtml Hasnt done anything? And he's 21! Humber sucks... Nice job looking at the ERA above 4 in the minors but you dont realize. 1.) He's a year removed from tommy john surgery 2.) He plays in a hitting division in the minors. 3.) He's top 10 in nearly every meaningful pitcher statistic in his league. Guerra isnt major league ready but he is huge, 6'5 and what 18? THis is the year, he'd be getting drafted out of high school. He has one of the best changeups in minor league baseball and his FB was reaching 92-96 at only 18!
January 26, 200818 yr id do it for Humber, Guerra, Gomez & Church. FMart should be untouchable and we cannot afford to lose Hielman. Humber- Sucks (ERA above 4 in the minors) Guerra- Very Young, not nearly major league ready Gomez- Sucks (has never done anything in the minor leagues) Church- Mediocre 28 year old outfielder Santana- One of the best, if not the best, pitchers in baseball Yeah that's a real even trade :| Church.... real medicore 113 OPS+ for his career in a huge pitchers ball park. He can play everyday for some teams. Gomez, oh ya he sucks except for that fact that he may be the fastest man in baseball, one the best defensive outfielders in baseball and has great size&potential. http://www.thebaseballcube.com/players/G/C...s-Gomez-1.shtml Hasnt done anything? And he's 21! Humber sucks... Nice job looking at the ERA above 4 in the minors but you dont realize. 1.) He's a year removed from tommy john surgery 2.) He plays in a hitting division in the minors. 3.) He's top 10 in nearly every meaningful pitcher statistic in his league. Guerra isnt major league ready but he is huge, 6'5 and what 18? THis is the year, he'd be getting drafted out of high school. He has one of the best changeups in minor league baseball and his FB was reaching 92-96 at only 18! Church is the epitomy of mediocre. Who cares if he could play on most teams? He ain't worth no Johan Santana. Humber- Ok, why am I going to trade a dominant pitcher like Johan for a guy coming off of Tommy John surgery? Gomez- Ok he's young, sure, but he isn't not even close to being an elite prospect and he hasn't done much with the stick in the minors. Guerra is the only guy I like in the list, but again, way far from the bigs. All of these guys you named are huge question marks In order to obtain equal value for Santana, you have to give up elite, major league ready prospects like phil hughes, jacoby ellsbury and the like. And plain and simple, the Mets don't have any elite prospects. A lot of their prospects have had their stocks plummeted by injury and average minor league performance. A lot of people are saying the Twins might panic and trade Santana away for the Mets' damaged goods because nobody else will want to trade with them and they'll lose him to free agency. That's the only way I see the Twins making a trade like this
January 26, 200818 yr lol @ your argument. You keep saying Gomez hasnt done anything in the minor leagues but his numbers are pretty much comparable or even better to a guy he is compared to in Grady Sizmore at the minor league level. Gomez has almost 150 stolen bases in a little over 330 games in the minor leagues. But that's nothing. I admit, his power hasnt developed and he may have been a little rushed but if he was still ranked as a prospects(had the minimum ABs to be considered MLB) he would definitely be ranked with the other top OFs based on his size and raw tools alone. Humber isnt the center piece of a deal, he's a guy who was earlier projected as a middle of the rotation, now a 4-5 because his decrease of velocity but he was damn impressive last year int he minors and he almost pitched a no hitter, I believe 8.1 IP of no hit ball. Church hasnt even gotten the oppurtunity to play a full season but he's a solid bat and he's damn good defensively and he can play all 3 OF positons. http://www.baseball-reference.com/c/churcry01.shtml dont really see anything mediocore, he's solid. I doubt we are getting johan in my mind but if we have the chance, I am not trading Fernando Martinez.
January 26, 200818 yr A package of Gomez (like him or not, the Twins are really high on him), Guerra, Mulvey, & Church probably gets the job done. I don't think the Mets will deal Martinez at the this point. You could substitute Pelfrey for Mulvey.
January 26, 200818 yr keep Pelfrey, I loved what I saw in september. Whenever he pounds down in the zone and doesnt get cute, that 96 mph sinker just eats hitters up. Ahhh man, I remember that start against Atlanta he had, he was breaking bats like hell, he was untouchable pretty much.
January 26, 200818 yr f*** Pelfrey. He's had one good start and can't develop a consistent breaking ball. No way he holds up a deal for Santana.
January 26, 200818 yr f*** Pelfrey. He's had one good start and can't develop a consistent breaking ball. No way he holds up a deal for Santana. lol, I agree but If we could do mulvey+humber instead of pelf. i'd do it.
January 26, 200818 yr lol @ your argument. You keep saying Gomez hasnt done anything in the minor leagues but his numbers are pretty much comparable or even better to a guy he is compared to in Grady Sizmore at the minor league level. Not even close. Sizemore hit .343/.451/13 homers/17 rbi/934 in A ball....Carlos Gomez hasn't done anything close to that
January 27, 200818 yr lol @ your argument. You keep saying Gomez hasnt done anything in the minor leagues but his numbers are pretty much comparable or even better to a guy he is compared to in Grady Sizmore at the minor league level. Not even close. Sizemore hit .343/.451/13 homers/17 rbi/934 in A ball....Carlos Gomez hasn't done anything close to that lmao. http://www.thebaseballcube.com/players/S/g...-sizemore.shtml 13 homers? ya ok. how about 3. how about comparing their AAA numbers http://www.thebaseballcube.com/players/G/C...s-Gomez-1.shtml Gomez started the year at AAA, then got called up then got a hamate injury and then played at AAA some mmore and still held his own considering the number of ABs he recieved. I dont know the projections, maybe you do, he would of had better stats if he got the same 418 ABs that Sizemore had during his one and only stint at AAA.
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