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Pirates Want Treanor?


SongInTheAir
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Treanor really isn't bad for a backup, he isn't particularly strong at anything but his presence works well and I trust him with young pitchers.

I'd rather have Toby Hall if we're talking about a platoon partner for Baker.

Not sure Hall is the guy as he offers the same potential we already have with Treanor. We can probably do better. I'd like to see them bring in someone from David Ross, Michael Barrett (has abused left handed pitching from 2005-2008 and has been connected to this organization before. Maybe he just needs to get out of SD), Josh Bard, Javier Valentin, Johnny Estrada, or Greg Zaun. I'm not advocating one over another, or a major league contract, but these guys have at least a little power potential, have shown it in the recent seasons, and should be pretty low cost. Also, we have playing time to give in 2009 as Baker won't be starting 130 games. We are a good team for a once highly thought of catcher to try and get some playing time with for that reason, plus we do have an excellent starting rotation and can legitimately be a contender. Very attractive job for one of these guys.

 

Maybe the Marlins should hit the trade market and look for a catcher that Baker can back up. After all, Texas has 4 pretty decent catchers and they need pitching which is something the Marlins do have. I wonder which one of them they would give up for Anibal Sanchez?

Trading Anibal is a bad idea when your 5th starter competition would be, your favorite, Dan Meyer, versus Rich Vanden Hurk. And shame on the front office if they made a move like this and Pavano comes in. We are also lacking in the minors with West being the only great one, and huge question marks with Thompson, Trahern, and that's really the cumulation of decent SP candidates in the upper minors. Not the time to be moving SP. We need to preserve all our SP arms and let the bullpen sort itself out.

 

The only guy I think we can survive with off this team is Cantu. I'd try to do something hilarious, like try to move him to San Francisco, along with Amezaga, Treanor, AND Kensing (this is for salary deflection reasons, those 4 are going to make around $7 million combined) for Benji Molina and a few A ball fireballer arms SF doesn't care about right now. With Sandoval around, I don't think they'd care. They need a 3B badly and have Cantu's rights for 2 years, get their probable 2B or SS starter to groom Buriss, and Kensing would easily make their pen. The fun thing is, Molina is a Type A free agent after 2009 as long as we start him even 80 games, so we'd get huge two first round compensatory picks for him (which is probably more valuable than anything else we get back in trade looking at our offseason deals for marginal starting players), and we'd be able to completely protect Baker for a year to truly ease him into a role if he struggles (which is very likely). This is all at payroll neutral, and the rest of the field would be impacted only by having G. Sanchez/McPherson as the corner starters, Andino as the 25th man, and the bullpen takes no hit with all the reenforcements we have. All the team would have to do is acquire a left handed dude for 1B/LF to help out Gaby Sanchez at 1B and be the 4th outfielder, and that's that. 25 man roster done besides the intense 5/6/7 battle for the bullpen. Someone is going to freak out by this paragraph, so I am done wild playstation baseball speculating as 03 puts it, but the point is, it's going to take something absolutely wild for us to acquire a legit catcher as we've traded off our good expendable chips already. I find it pretty unlikely at this point.

 

Not many teams have 5 starting pitchers that they like Lou. You are right, I think Dan Meyer sucks, but I have no problem bringing in a cheap #5 starting pitcher trying to rebuild his career. To me, Sanchez is starting to look like he will never be able to start 30+ games in a season which trumps the talent that he does have. Adding a cheap catcher like Teagarden or Saltalamacchia makes perfect sense to me. Personally, I happen to like Cantu way more than Molina as a player and I think that would be somewhat of a downgrade for the Marlins because I'm definately not solid on Dallas McPherson who has never done much at the major league level. Banking on Sanchez and McPherson producing the same season is quite a risk for the Marlins.

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I'm using this thread rather than starting a new one.

 

As most here know I'm following Licey pretty regularly because I'm trying to learn a little bit more about Bonifacio - anyway funny how these things work out - I notice that a week or so ago Ronny Paulino is on the team and he's the starting catcher, and playing pretty darn well.

 

Knowing we are looking for a backup catcher and he and the Pirates are not exactly on the same page I look at his numbers via ESPN (ignore last season he had a grand total of 108 at bats before the Bucs shipped him out only to have a very good AAA season). He's a decent hitter, 2006 he hit .310/.360 in 400+ at bats, 2007 .262 in the same, good CS%, 10 points above Baker's so because I think Rotoworld really has a good news archive (although sometimes you have read past their editorializing) I check out Paulino there and I find this from two days ago:

 

Ronny Paulino-C- Pirates Nov. 28 - 9:21 am et

The Pittsburgh Post Gazette reports that the Pirates are shopping Jack Wilson, John Grabow and Ronny Paulino. The newspaper quotes an unnamed "American League executive" saying that "Wilson and Grabow are out there, and they're really pushing Paulino." Paulino could be appealing to many teams as a backup, but may not draw interest as a starter after being demoted to the minors last season.

 

Then from the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette where the story first was published was this two-thirds of the way down after the remarks above:

 

"Nearly a dozen teams had inquired about Grabow at the July deadline, but the Pirates were dissatisfied with all offers and kept him. The same should apply now, although Grabow's status as a pending free agent -- he is eligible after next season -- means his trade value could diminish with each game in 2009.

 

Paulino is different. Catching is a hot commodity, but the handful of teams who have discussed him with the Pirates apparently hope to capitalize on a perceived low-point value, as Paulino was banished to the minors in June. The Pirates are resisting that, given that they have not ruled out Paulino could back up Ryan Doumit next year."

 

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/08333/931282-63.stm

 

What does Huntington covet? Pitching prospects. What do the Marlins have coming out their ears? Pitching prospects.

 

Just sayin...

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I'm using this thread rather than starting a new one.

 

As most here know I'm following Licey pretty regularly because I'm trying to learn a little bit more about Bonifacio - anyway funny how these things work out - I notice that a week or so ago Ronny Paulino is on the team and he's the starting catcher, and playing pretty darn well.

 

Knowing we are looking for a backup catcher and he and the Pirates are not exactly on the same page I look at his numbers via ESPN (ignore last season he had a grand total of 108 at bats before the Bucs shipped him out only to have a very good AAA season). He's a decent hitter, 2006 he hit .310/.360 in 400+ at bats, 2007 .262 in the same, good CS%, 10 points above Baker's so because I think Rotoworld really has a good news archive (although sometimes you have read past their editorializing) I check out Paulino there and I find this from two days ago:

 

Ronny Paulino-C- Pirates Nov. 28 - 9:21 am et

The Pittsburgh Post Gazette reports that the Pirates are shopping Jack Wilson, John Grabow and Ronny Paulino. The newspaper quotes an unnamed "American League executive" saying that "Wilson and Grabow are out there, and they're really pushing Paulino." Paulino could be appealing to many teams as a backup, but may not draw interest as a starter after being demoted to the minors last season.

 

Then from the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette where the story first was published was this two-thirds of the way down after the remarks above:

 

"Nearly a dozen teams had inquired about Grabow at the July deadline, but the Pirates were dissatisfied with all offers and kept him. The same should apply now, although Grabow's status as a pending free agent -- he is eligible after next season -- means his trade value could diminish with each game in 2009.

 

Paulino is different. Catching is a hot commodity, but the handful of teams who have discussed him with the Pirates apparently hope to capitalize on a perceived low-point value, as Paulino was banished to the minors in June. The Pirates are resisting that, given that they have not ruled out Paulino could back up Ryan Doumit next year."

 

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/08333/931282-63.stm

 

What does Huntington covet? Pitching prospects. What do the Marlins have coming out their ears? Pitching prospects.

 

Just sayin...

 

Paulino reminds me a lot of Dioner Navarro. Navarro is talented but he was very lazy until 2008 when he played up to his ability and kept in good shape. Paulino has a good upside if he remains focused and the Marlins might be smart to take a flier on him as he is a good hitter.

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I'm using this thread rather than starting a new one.

 

As most here know I'm following Licey pretty regularly because I'm trying to learn a little bit more about Bonifacio - anyway funny how these things work out - I notice that a week or so ago Ronny Paulino is on the team and he's the starting catcher, and playing pretty darn well.

 

Knowing we are looking for a backup catcher and he and the Pirates are not exactly on the same page I look at his numbers via ESPN (ignore last season he had a grand total of 108 at bats before the Bucs shipped him out only to have a very good AAA season). He's a decent hitter, 2006 he hit .310/.360 in 400+ at bats, 2007 .262 in the same, good CS%, 10 points above Baker's so because I think Rotoworld really has a good news archive (although sometimes you have read past their editorializing) I check out Paulino there and I find this from two days ago:

 

Ronny Paulino-C- Pirates Nov. 28 - 9:21 am et

The Pittsburgh Post Gazette reports that the Pirates are shopping Jack Wilson, John Grabow and Ronny Paulino. The newspaper quotes an unnamed "American League executive" saying that "Wilson and Grabow are out there, and they're really pushing Paulino." Paulino could be appealing to many teams as a backup, but may not draw interest as a starter after being demoted to the minors last season.

 

Then from the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette where the story first was published was this two-thirds of the way down after the remarks above:

 

"Nearly a dozen teams had inquired about Grabow at the July deadline, but the Pirates were dissatisfied with all offers and kept him. The same should apply now, although Grabow's status as a pending free agent -- he is eligible after next season -- means his trade value could diminish with each game in 2009.

 

Paulino is different. Catching is a hot commodity, but the handful of teams who have discussed him with the Pirates apparently hope to capitalize on a perceived low-point value, as Paulino was banished to the minors in June. The Pirates are resisting that, given that they have not ruled out Paulino could back up Ryan Doumit next year."

 

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/08333/931282-63.stm

 

What does Huntington covet? Pitching prospects. What do the Marlins have coming out their ears? Pitching prospects.

 

Just sayin...

 

Great find. Paulino could be a great platoon for Baker, I just hope our office can notice this kid and make it happen.

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Actually thought about this a few days ago 03, but at the time thought he was arbitration eligible so I brushed it off. But since you bring it up, just checked and he missed the super 2 deadline by like a month. He's $420,000 for 2009. That eliminates problem number one. What pitcher is worth the value he has over Treanor? That is the only question to me. (I agree with you they will only want pitching, plus that we have no hitting to trade).

 

I'm ignoring every MLB option as they are of the table. This leaves West, Ceda, Tucker, Thompson, Cruz, Vanden Hurk, Leroux, Wood, Tankeresly... absolutely no to all of them.

 

Trahern, Sinkbiel, Meyer, and G. Taylor. I would put in the maybe category. We should probably keep them, the first two because they are young and still profile to be a backend starters or good relievers and shouldn't give up on him for a first down year, and the last two because we have left handed pitching issues and should preserve all lefties that are doing anything positive If these are the deal breakers though, maybe. None of them profile as potential plus pitchers as the above so we can live without them, but this is the 2nd tier.

 

Everyone else should be fair game. This group includes Kensing, J. Delgado, Badenhop, C. Martinez, and Garcia off the 40 man roster, and the rest of our system is a bunch of whatever pitchers who are going to be hit or miss like Mobley, Marceaux, Doolitte (these three are unprotected in the Rule V so they currently have limited value in trade discussions), Winters, Kaminska, Dean, Allison and some others.

 

Hungtinton is really smart so he's going to want something legit that he can have for awhile. I'm guessing he'd want Thompson, Cruz, Vanden Hurk, or Leroux, and I'm pretty sure Beinfest would never do that. I think the most the Marlins would realistic offer in a situation like this is one of Trahern/Sinkbiel, and then probably Badenhop or some really nominal single A arm that he really likes and isn't in our top 30 prospects. That wouldn't be a horrible 2-1 deal as it's marginal pitching for a legit young MLB backup that does have solid .750 OPS upside at the big league level. Pirates wouldn't be able to do better than that.

 

I think this would be a worthy gamble as long as it isn't in the 20 or so pitchers I detailed.

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Actually thought about this a few days ago 03, but at the time thought he was arbitration eligible so I brushed it off. But since you bring it up, just checked and he missed the super 2 deadline by like a month. He's $420,000 for 2009. That eliminates problem number one. What pitcher is worth the value he has over Treanor? That is the only question to me. (I agree with you they will only want pitching, plus that we have no hitting to trade).

 

I'm ignoring every MLB option as they are of the table. This leaves West, Ceda, Tucker, Thompson, Cruz, Vanden Hurk, Leroux, Wood, Tankeresly... absolutely no to all of them.

 

Trahern, Sinkbiel, Meyer, and G. Taylor. I would put in the maybe category. We should probably keep them, the first two because they are young and still profile to be a backend starters or good relievers and shouldn't give up on him for a first down year, and the last two because we have left handed pitching issues and should preserve all lefties that are doing anything positive If these are the deal breakers though, maybe. None of them profile as potential plus pitchers as the above so we can live without them, but this is the 2nd tier.

 

Everyone else should be fair game. This group includes Kensing, J. Delgado, Badenhop, C. Martinez, and Garcia off the 40 man roster, and the rest of our system is a bunch of whatever pitchers who are going to be hit or miss like Mobley, Marceaux, Doolitte (these three are unprotected in the Rule V so they currently have limited value in trade discussions), Winters, Kaminska, Dean, Allison and some others.

 

Hungtinton is really smart so he's going to want something legit that he can have for awhile. I'm guessing he'd want Thompson, Cruz, Vanden Hurk, or Leroux, and I'm pretty sure Beinfest would never do that. I think the most the Marlins would realistic offer in a situation like this is one of Trahern/Sinkbiel, and then probably Badenhop or some really nominal single A arm that he really likes and isn't in our top 30 prospects. That wouldn't be a horrible 2-1 deal as it's marginal pitching for a legit young MLB backup that does have solid .750 OPS upside at the big league level. Pirates wouldn't be able to do better than that.

 

I think this would be a worthy gamble as long as it isn't in the 20 or so pitchers I detailed.

 

 

I wouldn't mind trading 1 of Trahern/Meyer/Taylor to get Paulino. You have to give to get. The Marlins have some depth in terms of upcoming relievers/young pitching...I wouldn't mind a deal like that, at all.

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I wouldn't mind trading 1 of Trahern/Meyer/Taylor to get Paulino. You have to give to get. The Marlins have some depth in terms of upcoming relievers/young pitching...I wouldn't mind a deal like that, at all.

 

Just saying...the pirates didn't claim Meyer when he was on waivers, aka when they could have had him for free. They're not going to then trade a pretty good C for him after saying Meyer wasn't worth giving up nothing for.

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To use Lou's list of "untouchables", I am only because it's there and I have a few more guys I'd add to that list - if it was determined that the need was there and Paulino was the guy who could fill that need (although the deeper you look the less appealing his defense is) I'm not sure all these pitchers have to be excluded from trade discussions - Cruz, Vanden Hurk, Leroux, Wood and Tankersley.

 

If Cruz is out of options then it's play him or trade him, as for the rest of this list there isn't a single pitcher I wouldn't move "IF" the deal was one that pushed the 2009 Florida Marlins closer to the playoffs. I don't have to repeat their names and and explain why for each, it's a personal choice, and I reserve the right to be wrong about each one. Surprise me. Prove me wrong but the world doesn't stop spinning on its axis if one of them is moved.

 

Gotta give to get and whether it's for Paulino or someone else that catches the front office's eye, trading a tier B pitcher shouldn't kill a deal that makes us better.

 

The wildcard as it relates to the catching situation is as much Treanor's health post-surgery as money. In reality, there probably aren't that many backup catchers better suited to the Marlins when you consider his knowledge of the staff and his defense (and I'm a defense first guy at that position).

 

That is if Baker is your starting catcher. The catcher thing is a house of cards, regardless of what direction the team goes, you know there's problems with every pairing. I don't envy the FO on this one.

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According to league sources, for a little more than a week the Florida Marlins have been shopping catcher Matt Treanor. The team initiated talks with several clubs they felt were in the market for catchers.

 

Treanor, who underwent surgery on his left hip area after the season, is expected to be ready for Spring Training. Reports have already linked Treanor possibly heading to the Pirates or Tigers.

 

Entering his second season of arbitration, Treanor could make about $900,000 or $1 million, a price the Marlins don't seem to want to pay. John Baker has the edge to be the starting catcher. However, there is speculation from a league source that the Marlins are positioning themselves to pursue Ivan Rodriguez in free agency. Pudge, of course, was Florida's catcher on the 2003 World Series title team.

 

Source: MLB.com

 

Sweet....get me Pudge Rodriguez

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