Though I was one of the MANY who wanted a different second baseman I understand why the Marlins wanted him so much. He and JP will kill pitchers and foul off plenty of tough pitches. Our line-up looks REAL good next year. JP, Louie, Lowell, Cabs, Gonzo, Conine.

whew....what a relief....we now have Lowell and Castillo, and got a decent 1b in the Lee trade. No matter the outcome of the Pudge thing, I feel extremely confident about our offense next season...why? Our 1-2 punch is the main reason. Coupled with Lowell, Cabs, Conine.....I dont have a problem with putting Castro in there. I do think it's safe to say that Encarnacion will be gone...correct?

i thought we were having a fire sale?

Encarnacion will probably be non-tendered

I think Enc will be traded this week. Probably for a catcher. We cannot forget that there is a very real possibility that Castro will be in jail next season and for several seasons after that.......Redmond is nice, but not as an everyday catcher.

redmond will cost too much to be a backup catcher

The Angels, Braves and Orioles might have interest in Encarnacion. But that's only been reported by wishful Marlins fans.

 

Baltimore only have one major-league catcher and have no need for another outfielder.

Atlanta need a starting catcher, and probably a better back-up too if they're planning on signing Benito.

Anaheim has a glut of catchers that could be had cheaper than other teams. Darin Ersatd's hamstring may force him to move to first base. Encarnacion in center? He's done it. He played half his games in 2002 in center effectively, so why not. But at a possible $6-7 million contract? Maybe with the Angels management, but I see them moving more towards the the Korean Lee, or maybe Rafael Palmeiro, and risk Erstad in center again.

 

Unfortunetly we've made it so publicly known that Encarnacion isn't coming back that no one is showing interest in actually giving up a player for him. So maybe we can add him and an excess starting pitcher to seal any deal?

 

The Padres are said to be interested in Redman. With the addition of Hernandez, they have no need to carry Miguel Ojeda, Wiki Gonzalez AND Humberto Quintero on the roster. Throw in a nice prospect and good reliever (MoCo college grad and lefty-specialist Mike Matthews, or UMD-Baltimore alumni Jay Witasick) and trade doesn't look too horrible.

 

But I have a feeling that if we dangle Carl Pavano we got get a better return. You gotta love his postseason heroics. And the presence of Alyssa Milano in the stands would be more than a pleasant sight come next October. But he was our 5th best starter in the regular season, 6th if want to give Burnett the benefit of the doubt. And his trade value is HOT HOT HOT. No better time to deal than after his World Series performance.

Redman is built for Pro Player. A crafty lefty fly ball pitcher. He'd only be useful to the Dodgers. Mark is also a workhorse. He was 33rd in pitcher abuse points in 2002 and came back to have a career year while climbly up the list to 4th on the list (really it's not that much of a jump). And if what every Marlins-basher says is true and D-Train struggles, Redman is our only other lefty starter. And did I mention that he was crafty? We've got Penny, Burnett, Beckett. All power pitchers that throw 95+ mph fastballs and hard fast breaking stuff. And Willis who makes his early 90-mph stuff look fast. Throw in a pitcher that breaks up the opponent's rhythm and you'll help them all.

The Angels, Braves and Orioles might have interest in Encarnacion. But that's only been reported by wishful Marlins fans.

yea, something like that

I don't understand why there isn't a very high level of interest in Encarnacion. A gold glove calibur corner outfielder with good power and major RBI potential, and there isn't serious interest from a lot of teams? It makes no sense to me, although i'm only going on what appears to be going on, maybe i'm wrong and a lot of teams are interested in him, but I haven't heard any such information.

I don't understand why there isn't a very high level of interest in Encarnacion. A gold glove calibur corner outfielder with good power and major RBI potential, and there isn't serious interest from a lot of teams? It makes no sense to me, although i'm only going on what appears to be going on, maybe i'm wrong and a lot of teams are interested in him, but I haven't heard any such information.

I think there's other dominos that have to fall before real interest in Encarnacion begins.

i gotta think that if Enc plays in a better hitter's park, 2003 would have been a HUGE year

 

but thats coming from one of Enc's biggest supporters

i gotta think that if Enc plays in a better hitter's park, 2003 would have been a HUGE year

 

but thats coming from one of Enc's biggest supporters

If the Marlins trade Enc to a team in a hitter's park, like they did with Wilson to Colorado, I think he will have a HUGE year in 2004.

 

And that is coming from basically a neutral observer.

i gotta think that if Enc plays in a better hitter's park, 2003 would have been a HUGE year

 

but thats coming from one of Enc's biggest supporters

If the Marlins trade Enc to a team in a hitter's park, like they did with Wilson to Colorado, I think he will have a HUGE year in 2004.

 

And that is coming from basically a neutral observer. Which would make at least the 4th of his 7 seasons that he would be projected as such.

 

I'll believe it when I see it...and I like the guy.

I don't understand why there isn't a very high level of interest in Encarnacion. A gold glove calibur corner outfielder with good power and major RBI potential, and there isn't serious interest from a lot of teams? It makes no sense to me, although i'm only going on what appears to be going on, maybe i'm wrong and a lot of teams are interested in him, but I haven't heard any such information.

 

It has to do with what he's believed to receive from arbitration. You know how arbitration works. Each side picks a number and the arbitrator picks one.

 

As long as a team has to go to arbitration with him no one will be interested. If the Marlins "trade" him, the acquiring team has to accept arbitration (or sign him before going). He had a good year, he is a fine ballplayer, he's probably be awarded in excess of $5 -5.5 million, which is, in this market, too much to pay for a guy with his skills.

 

Once he's non-tendered, cut loose by the Fish, and other teams are no longer obligated to go that route (arbitration), they can sign him at a more accpetable (lower) price.

 

It's actually in his best interest, if he wants to have a longer and ultimately more lucrative career, to accept being cut so he can sign on with someone for multi-years. On his own, he could probably get $12 million over three years.

I don't understand why there isn't a very high level of interest in Encarnacion. A gold glove calibur corner outfielder with good power and major RBI potential, and there isn't serious interest from a lot of teams? It makes no sense to me, although i'm only going on what appears to be going on, maybe i'm wrong and a lot of teams are interested in him, but I haven't heard any such information.

 

It has to do with what he's believed to receive from arbitration. You know how arbitration works. Each side picks a number and the arbitrator picks one.

 

As long as a team has to go to arbitration with him no one will be interested. If the Marlins "trade" him, the acquiring team has to accept arbitration (or sign him before going). He had a good year, he is a fine ballplayer, he's probably be awarded in excess of $5 -5.5 million, which is, in this market, too much to pay for a guy with his skills.

 

Once he's non-tendered, cut loose by the Fish, and other teams are no longer obligated to go that route (arbitration), they can sign him at a more accpetable (lower) price.

 

It's actually in his best interest, if he wants to have a longer and ultimately more lucrative career, to accept being cut so he can sign on with someone for multi-years. On his own, he could probably get $12 million over three years. You hit the nail on the head

One reason not to like him is his very low OBP at .313

I've come around big time on signing Luis for a few reasons:

 

(1) My argument for not wanting to pay too much for him was because his entire game is his speed which I thought was either in decline or the injured hip wouldn't allow him to make plays.

(2) The Marlins really had no other even DECENT options at 2B within or on the FA market (blah on reese, grudz, vina) so hes a great fit (3rd in win shares in NL)

(3) Since his BA, walks, and defense all remained above average in 2003 WITH his nagging hip, I'm expecting the Castillo of 2000 to emerge.

(4) We got him at a great discount because he was the best 2B FA on a market in which many teams sought a 2B.

 

In sum...the Marlins win.

 

I'm feeling very negative on the Lowell signing though. I'll give reasons later, but I hope we can flip him in the 2nd or 3rd year of his contract for prospects.

I've come around big time on signing Luis for a few reasons:

 

(1) My argument for not wanting to pay too much for him was because his entire game is his speed which I thought was either in decline or the injured hip wouldn't allow him to make plays.

(2) The Marlins really had no other even DECENT options at 2B within or on the FA market (blah on reese, grudz, vina) so hes a great fit (3rd in win shares in NL)

(3) Since his BA, walks, and defense all remained above average in 2003 WITH his nagging hip, I'm expecting the Castillo of 2000 to emerge.

(4) We got him at a great discount because he was the best 2B FA on a market in which many teams sought a 2B.

 

In sum...the Marlins win.

 

I'm feeling very negative on the Lowell signing though. I'll give reasons later, but I hope we can flip him in the 2nd or 3rd year of his contract for prospects.

I'm very interested in reading your reasons on why you don't feel good on signing Lowell.

OK...

 

(1) The C position has much more of an uncertainty (Castro mess) right now than 3B. We have a superstar in Cabrera wasting away in the OF when he could be playing a more difficult position at 3B while saving us Lowell's money. Having two ML quality 3B is a huge advantage and we should have tried to shop Lowell (and we still might do this anway) for a young OF/pitching/prospects/whatever. That way we save his money, replace him with someone who WILL be better, and get some good prospects. The way I see it we lock up an above avg 3B for a lot of money, when we have a great replacement already in the wings (for cheap). With this money saved we could sign Pudge to a reasonable contract and maintain our rotation without problems. Now its going to get interesting to say the least.

For a good example of what I'm talking about here, imagine we had both Choi and Lee on our roster. Would you trade the more expensive Lee and plug in a very cheap, productive Choi? Or would you keep both and move Choi to the OF? (lets say he can play it for the examples sake)

 

(2) To say Lowell had a career year in 2003 is an understatement. So from a bargaining standpoint we just bought high. And unfortunately I believe his numbers will come back to earth in 2004, leaving us with an overpriced, little above league average 3B.

 

(3) I think fans still think of wins as the best way to identify a team's success, so I still think we would have been better off letting Lowell go and giving Cabrera 3rd. If we had waited long enough Pudge would probably wind up taking that same deal (roughly Lowell's current deal) once he realized he's not getting 5/50 from anybody. Cabrera/Pudge is a more valuable combo than Cabrera/Lowell.

 

 

Those are just my opinions obviously...commence the attack.

One thing the Marlins must do if they are going to trade Encarnacion, is they have to wait until Vlad is signed. Then the demand for Encarnacion will go way up.