ok?

 

i'm talking about trades and any trade that directly leads to  a world series is worth it.

 

you bring up chad fox signing and beinfest getting beyond lucky.

 

marlins dont win without chad fox just like they dont win without urbina.

 

If any trade that leads to the World Series is worth it, why are you dismissing the Huizenga firesale trades? They directly led to the World Series too, no? 

 

 

I doubt we're talking about Urbrina at all if A-Gon didn't become a great player.

 

Because A-Gon became great, people bring up if it's a trade that should have been made. You then have people on both sides, one of which is going to talk up the trade as great.

 

Never once heard Craig Counsell brought up as one of the greatest trades the Marlins ever made. Deadline dead in 1997 and he scored the game winning run. But no one ever talks about it because it was Mark Hutton who was traded for him, and he was out of the majors two years later. Nor Darren Daulton. 1.121 OPS while starting 5 WS games and appearing in all 7. We gave up Billy McMillon for him. Who?

 

those 1997 trades were also phenominal and would have been worth whatever the cost was.  if they traded a future hall of famer for counsell or daulton, i wouldnt have given 1 fuck because it lead directly to a fucking world series.

 

i would think the fucking goal for a team is to win a world series. you have to give credit in 1997 and then 2003 for saying fuck whatever consequences, these players can help me get a fucking trophy.  

 

fuck it lets do it.

 

(now if they hadnt have won, they would have been stupid trades, but you would respect them for going for it, but would have been stupid due to not achieving said goal)

 

 

If any trade that leads to the World Series is worth it, why are you dismissing the Huizenga firesale trades? They directly led to the World Series too, no? 

 

Dombrowski built that 2003 team with his stellar trades.  what is your point?  when was it argued otherwise?

 

you seem to be ignoring 2/3 of what i've typed and seen urbina and your hate for relief pitchers even glossing over his contributions as insignificant, so whats the point?

 

 

Das thinks that the Giants signing Barry Zito was one of the best signings of all-time. Barry Zito was on the Giants World Series rosters. It was totally worth it.

 

 

Das thinks that the Giants signing Barry Zito was one of the best signings of all-time. Barry Zito was on the Giants World Series rosters. It was totally worth it.

 

you are a fucking idiot.  

 

 

you are a fucking idiot.  

 

Are all Cardinals fans retarded or is it just you?

 

I'm just following your outstanding logic in evaluating baseball moves.

 

 

Are all Cardinals fans retarded or is it just you?

 

I'm just following your outstanding logic in evaluating baseball moves.

 

so you are basically saying that the urbina trade was a fucking retarded trade and would have settled for a NLCS loss in 2003.

 

got it.

 

 

so you are basically saying that the urbina trade was a fucking retarded trade and would have settled for a NLCS loss in 2003.

 

got it.

 

That's not what I said. Try reading.

 

 

Uh ohhhhh scandalous!!!!

 

 

That's not what I said. Try reading.

 

ya and all i'm saying is that any trade that directly leads you to a world series victory automatically is a stellar trade.

 

as a result, since you dont seem to believe the urbina trade was a great trade and/or he wasnt important to winning a world series, you are therefore content with losing in the NLCS, because no urbina = no victory over cubs.

 

(and no bartman = no nlcs victory but i digress)

 

 

People really overestimate how important Urbina was to winning the World Series in '03. He was good in the regular season and helped us get into the playoffs, but he actually wasn't even that good in the playoffs.

 

It's weird to consider that trade a "good trade" in franchise history unless you're just going with the logic that every player acquired in '03 was a good trade. For whatever reason though, that move is brought up more than other moves that actually helped that team more to win a championship. It's just pretty weird, I think. And, all in all, considering how good Adrian Gonzalez turned out to be, it really doesn't belong on this list. It's not a loss because Urbina was a part of that '03 team, but it wasn't a win worth celebrating.

 

If the Marlins don't win the World Series that year (a crapshoot/Urbina wasn't necessarily the only reliever on the market who could've done what he did), everyone hates that trade now. 

 

thank you erick!!! Im not alone.

 

 

Never said otherwise. Just saying Urbina's trade doesn't belong on these lists.

 

Remember when we traded Mr. 6 fingers and Matt Clement and ended up with some guy by the name of Dontrelle Willis? I don't see that deal in this thread. People just remember the Urbina deal because it happened that year.

 

actually i called that deal. Read the thread

 

 

actually i called that deal. Read the thread

 

Erick is going to debate you on it anyway cause he can't be wrong.

 

J/K luv ya Erick

 

 

Atleast we can all agree on a few things. Lol

 

 

The_Punisher and I are on the same page. *hi five*

 

 

ya and all i'm saying is that any trade that directly leads you to a world series victory automatically is a stellar trade.

 

as a result, since you dont seem to believe the urbina trade was a great trade and/or he wasnt important to winning a world series, you are therefore content with losing in the NLCS, because no urbina = no victory over cubs.

 

(and no bartman = no nlcs victory but i digress)

 

My point is that I don't think that any trade that directly leads you to a World Series victory should automatically be considered "stellar."

 

If you feel that way, that's fine. I don't evaluate trades that way.

 

The debate we're having, however, is that based on your criteria, there were way better trades, but you've dismissed those trades because they were a part of Huizenga's firesale. I don't understand that because those trades directly led the franchise to a World Series, as well. Without the Brown/Lee deal (example from earlier in the thread...which I brought up specifically to prove a point as that was also not a lopsided stellar trade), there probably is no Urbina deal because we're not in the position to make such a deal. The Lee/Brown deal, however, is never mentioned in threads like this (at least I don't think anyone has mentioned it; apparently I've missed some deals being mentioned).

 

Not every move made by a World Series team is a good move because they won the World Series. The Giants didn't make a good decision to sign Barry Zito despite the fact that he played an important part in their World Series victories. It's just a simple-minded point of view. And I get the reason why you believe what you believe, but then don't discredit other moves that also directly led to that championship, as well. Hate Huizenga and firesales all you want, but just using the same logic, the Marlins don't win the '03 World Series without the firesale. 

 

 

Since someone brought up Bartman, let me bring up this old thought.  I don't know why so much credit is given to him for it.  The inning got out of hand due to Gonzalez's error.

 

 

Since someone brought up Bartman, let me bring up this old thought.  I don't know why so much credit is given to him for it.  The inning got out of hand due to Gonzalez's error.

 

WE AGREE!

 

 

WE AGREE!

 

Well now I can shut the site down. Thanks for the memories guys.

 

 

Also, Mike Mordecai is the only bad player in the history of baseball who will forever be great in my heart. His bases clearing 3B will always be one of my favorite moments in Marlins history. 

 

 

Also, Mike Mordecai is the only bad player in the history of baseball who will forever be great in my heart. His bases clearing 3B will always be one of my favorite moments in Marlins history. 

 

Don't forget his walkoff hit earlier in the season, MORDI MORDI MORDI

 

I was sitting Row 2 behind fish dugout for it, if you can find the video of him coming home you see me.

 

 

Don't forget his walkoff hit earlier in the season, MORDI MORDI MORDI

 

I was sitting Row 2 behind fish dugout for it, if you can find the video of him coming home you see me.

 

who would know? You didnt have an orange jersey on. I was at game 6 of the 1997 world series....and you would never know....

 

but alas, yes that was a good game august 11,2003 if i remember correctly against dodgers.

 

 

but alas, yes that was a good game august 11,2003 if i remember correctly against dodgers.

 

Sounds right, I invited a friend to go with me and she couldn't make it so I had to go with my uncle last minute.  It was still fun though

 

 

For what it's worth, I've really enjoyed the fact that Das called me a "fucking idiot" and I then called him "retarded" and it was just disregarded as normal behavior. That is why I like this board. 

 

 

Not every move made by a World Series team is a good move because they won the World Series. The Giants didn't make a good decision to sign Barry Zito despite the fact that he played an important part in their World Series victories. It's just a simple-minded point of view. And I get the reason why you believe what you believe, but then don't discredit other moves that also directly led to that championship, as well. Hate Huizenga and firesales all you want, but just using the same logic, the Marlins don't win the '03 World Series without the firesale. 

 

Zito helped them win 1 world series.  

 

You are right, the Marlins may or may not win in 2003 without the fire sale.  However, they could have won in 98, 99, 2000 et al without the fire sale.  So on one hand its great.  On the other hand, who knows.  Go hop in Doc Brown's time machine and lets play that alternative reality.

 

So I guess it is what it is.  The Huizenga firesale by far is worse than any of Jeffrey's firesales, as that truly was a firesale, I mean fuck they didnt even wait for the parade to be cleaned up before selling!  At least Jeffrey gave the 2004 team a chance to defend that title by and large.  He is just a lying sack of shit in general.

 

I'll say it again if you acquire a player in a world series winning year and that player directly plays a significant role in winning said world series, then its a good trade.  Who cares about the fucking cost if the end goal every year is the win the fucking world series.

 

I will never hate on any trade a team makes in a world series winning year because i like to win.  Sometimes you have to move assets that hurt, but if it leads to the #1 end goal, then who gives a fuck.

 

(also helps if you dont have a system full of abject failures so you can hopefully insulate yourself some,but thats a different argument)