mcwkm

Ummmm, havent you guys seen JPierre's member #?!?!? so hes been a member who didnt voice his irrational logic for a few years. your point? I was being sarcastic.... He has pointed out in multiple threads that he knows more than people assume he does.... because he has one the lowest member #s. i know i saw a few of those posts but i wanted to comment on it anyway

Ummmm, havent you guys seen JPierre's member #?!?!? so hes been a member who didnt voice his irrational logic for a few years. your point?

You guys don't understand what the minimum is huh? Like I said earlier, my argument was that he will be up for a chunk of this season one way or another. Interpret "CHUNK" or "SIGNIFICANT" however you want. El Penguino, MarlinsLou mentioned they want Maybin in the Minors all season. Thats fine. They interpreted this as what they would do, not what's going to happen. I mentioned what's going to happen. You guys are getting all worked up and I love the way the newbs just follow and get influenced by just a couple of voices on this board because of post #. It's hilarious actually. This is wrong. Like multiple have said. Zero reading comprehension. Or maybe it's intuition. Or common sense. You can interpret that however you want. The point is service time. The Marlins need to keep Maybin in the minors so they don't start his service clock to the point of starting his arbitration a year sooner and losing his club controlled rights. basically we want a cabrera situation rather than a willis. we do not want maybin's service clock to start this year and we do not want him in the super-2 category for arbitration reasons. we want to maximize the time maybin is with the marlins on competitive teams

You guys are getting all worked up and I love the way the newbs just follow and get influenced by just a couple of voices on this board because of post #. It's hilarious actually. maybe you dont realize it because you fail to accept logic in your life or was born without the ability to think rationally but the majority of the people posting against you have the same ideas about maybin because at this moment in time they are what would be best for the team and most of us despite getting screwed by the club over and over again still want what is best for the team

I agree up to a certain extent, but the truth is we got Maybin for this yr one way or the other. Maybe we bring him up in May or maybe right away, but he is our starting CF this season. And don't ever bring up Abercombie with Hanley's or Maybin's name in the same sentence ever in your life again. None of our Minor league prospects are sexy like an Andrew Miller. That's not a good thing. I think you're the one that doesn't understand the arbitration thing??? Creating a team that will peak at the same time?? They're all more or less the same age? We're already doing this. Holding back a player during a rebuilding year when we have lesser options is rather dumb don't you think? This timeline approach won't save you much with Maybin. He should get a significant amount of PT this season, one way or another. We went through this in '98 and '06. You're putting too much thought into arbitration for a rookie player right now. hey look maybe we bring him up in may or maybe right away and he should get a significant amount of PT this season. wow look what you can dig up looking back a few pages 200 at bats is not a significant amount of PT and the timeframe you mention him coming up would put him far above 200 at bats unless you envision him on the bench which lets look at the past when has beinfest kept a top prospect on the bench outside of september so youve got to completely different stances there call him up in may and the 200 at bats stance which is it

The point Lou is trying to make (an extremely good and accurate one) is that it makes no sense to start Maybin in the bigs in terms of contract status and team level of competition. It does more good to the team to put a Ross or a Carroll or Amezaga out in CF for the time being since the Marlins aren't competing this year. It only improves his confidence and game, extending is tenure for when the team actually needs him. He is 20 years old for christ sake and struggled in his limited ABs last season. There is no reason to start him in CF opening day. Your extremely crass mode of discourse is very consistent with your complete lack of knowledge of the game. I understand that... But that's not a good enough reason to hold him back right now. Cameron Maybin WILL get 200+ AB's this season. 20 years old or not, arbitration 3 years from now or not, he will get 200+ AB's. Do you disagree about that? You guys beat around the bush and don't get to the point. Are you retarded? Every single person here thinks Maybin gets 200 at bats this year. If he comes up in April, or if he comes up in July, he'll get his at bats Not one single person has argued that... I think Are you retarded? That's the only point I brought up. Everybody seems to think I'm predicting he will get 600 ab's? You guys are outta control. youve said multiple times that he will be called up by may and that would mean he would either be benched which would serve no point or have way more than 200 at bats. learn some basic logic

Carroll can play CF, as can Cody Ross So you're saying these are better options than Maybin? at this point, probably I mean if Cam goes all Hanley on us and blows up as a rook, that would be sweet but he prob needs some at bats in AA anyway Cody is more than capable, and I'm intrigued by Carroll i would like to see what carroll can do too if he does well we just found our left fielder for 09 if he plays like crud what did we lose nothing Carroll is a joke. .849 ops in 100abs in carolina and .958 ops in 318 abs with the topes last season ya he is a joke ramp brett was drafted as a third baseman any chance we see him return there next season? Please, let's not talk about Carroll here... He has no future... with anybody. Yea, an outfielder with good power and can play all 3 outfield spots at age 24 has no future with anybody!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!111 is that a no on the third base ramp?

isnt he still with the Brewers? i think so but i'm not positive why i asked. he dominated lefties last year in his role with the brewers

He would be a nice guy to take a flier on but lets not go overboard with how he has performed for New York. 19 starts, 111 IP, and a 92 ERA+ He has also only had one good, complete season in his career. Lucky for him it happened at the perfect time. I don't think anybody is expecting him to turn sh*t into gold. But our rotation right now is nothing but questionmarks. He's atleast better than Byung-yun Kim, Chris Seddon, Daniel Barone, list goes on and on. Pavano ANY DAY over freaking Kim. kim not on the DL anyday over pavano on the DL

200 ABs is not starting him on opening day or even at the all-star break. What's your point? He could very well get 200 or so ABs this season (certainly not 600), but even then I wouldn't have a problem if he doesn't even get called up at all. There is no reason to rush him to the major league level. My point is, which you are now twisting your argument around - that Maybin will get a significant amount of PT at the major league level. I started with 200, but he can very well get 4-500. I understand he is probably not ready right now. Regardless, we have a hole in CF. We're rebuilding, and Maybin is on the brink of being ready. The most I can see him in the minors, is until May... The most. Your argument of arbitration does not hold value in this case. Unlike you - I would have a problem if he isn't called up at all. He is a phenom. Phenoms get called up at early ages. You don't waste somebody's youth in the minor league level if you don't have to. He got called up last season for a small stint - and he should get called up this year as well, which he will if he doesn't start right away. if hes in the majors and not productive, he still would be considered ready right? unless hes dominate in spring which is not the best to judge a player but its all weve got he should start in the minors keep his confidence up hone his skills and be called up later on in the season

Carroll can play CF, as can Cody Ross So you're saying these are better options than Maybin? at this point, probably I mean if Cam goes all Hanley on us and blows up as a rook, that would be sweet but he prob needs some at bats in AA anyway Cody is more than capable, and I'm intrigued by Carroll i would like to see what carroll can do too if he does well we just found our left fielder for 09 if he plays like crud what did we lose nothing Carroll is a joke. .849 ops in 100abs in carolina and .958 ops in 318 abs with the topes last season ya he is a joke ramp brett was drafted as a third baseman any chance we see him return there next season?

If you guys think Cody Ross is going to hit 30 hrs, you've got some issues. I can't believe all you guys think Cameron Maybin is not going to get a good amount of playing time this season at the MLB level. That's what you guys are saying here. it's not that we believe he is not going to get a good amount of playing time this season in the majors, its that we believe he should start the year in the minors

Carroll can play CF, as can Cody Ross So you're saying these are better options than Maybin? at this point, probably I mean if Cam goes all Hanley on us and blows up as a rook, that would be sweet but he prob needs some at bats in AA anyway Cody is more than capable, and I'm intrigued by Carroll i would like to see what carroll can do too if he does well we just found our left fielder for 09 if he plays like crud what did we lose nothing And if he does well, Willingham to first and Jacobs out the door for a nice little peice could always work... exactly or if we like the left handed bat at first we can keep jacobs. not starting maybin can open up more doors then starting maybin and could ultimately lead to a far superior team

Amezaga was a real good defensive CF and with a good arm too, just sayin' I watched both Amezaga and Abercrombie in CF a lot at the games I saw in person, and I can honestly say that Amezaga doesn't really get good reads on the ball which is why he made so many highlight reel catches. Abercrombie caught balls in stride that Amezaga had to die for. I think Amezaga's defense, while not atrocious by any means, was a little overrated. i remember abercrombie running into hammer alot and then watching the ball drop in between them. he improved though can't deny it

whats joe dillon's contract status he put in a good year after that disaster in japan

Carroll can play CF, as can Cody Ross So you're saying these are better options than Maybin? at this point, probably I mean if Cam goes all Hanley on us and blows up as a rook, that would be sweet but he prob needs some at bats in AA anyway Cody is more than capable, and I'm intrigued by Carroll i would like to see what carroll can do too if he does well we just found our left fielder for 09 if he plays like crud what did we lose nothing

Pavano accepted assignment to the minor leagues. hes originally from ct so he is closer to home staying with the yankees and that may be what's important to him

if we sign lofton at $4 mill he would take up most likely over 30% of the on field payroll. that would be sad

First of all, I know how arbitration works son. Second of all, I'm not new by any means. I've been reading these forums for the past couple of years as a lurker and I've posted way back when, even when this forum didn't exist and there was only the MLB Marlins forum (when it was good). People here can atest to that. I've tons of arbitration work back in the day, when we used to have real conversations back in 02 and all. Don't ever bring that newbie sh*t to me. Third, I know it doesn't go by age. Duh. I'm saying we're fielding a team that's close together in age and will peak as a team in age, as in contending together as a team with age? Much like the 03 team did? Or did you forget? Your statement of holding back Maybin now, when we have only LESSER options, as I noted before is borderline retarded. Maybin should and WILL get a great amount of AB's at the MLB level this season. That's a fact. We basically have no other option but to run him out there. And what's more ridiculous is saying save him for when we are in contention? What the hell is that about? You don't purposely save rookies for when you are contending? You develop rookies during rebuilding years. Let them work under less pressure and get their kinks out. That was the beauty of the '98 team and you can even throw in the '06 team in there. Derek Lee, AJ Burnettl, Castillo and countless of others didn't just start mashing right away. But age is irrelevant which you are not grasping. It's service time. It's making the team peak at the same time and you have to combine this on a salary threshold where you can afford the entire team by mixing the guys with multi-million dollar contracts with club controlled players. Try and realize how important this is for the Marlins. You specifically cite 03. Because the Marlins did not have a combination of veterans and huge rookie performers that year. Putting Maybin out opening day is dumb when you can stick him in AA for 3 months and it won't hurt his development because of where he is as a player. You speak as if he won't "work out the kinks" unless he is at the MLB level. That is wrong. Also you are arguing for playing Maybin 3 additional months in a non contending 2008 versus having him under club control for an additional season (Where you would think the Marlins will be very good in the future). That's pretty idiotic. You want to have control over your players for as long as possible. I mean that is obvious. There really is no benefit to playing Maybin right away in 2008 for these reasons. This is also why you'd hope the Marlins let Volstad and G. Hernandez throw in AA/AAA for the first 2+ months of the season so you don't get them started either. Who cares we have no CF on the roster. It's about systematically planning for the future. You're not grasping this. Maybe you can think about it in terms of Cabrera and Dontrelle. They were brought up mid year. Their pre-free agency years were basically 04-09. Yet we had them for worthwhile MLB service time in 03. This is what they need to do with Maybin/Volstad/Gaby this year so we have their club controlled rights for 09-11 and overall through 2014. Basically why let them hit arbitration in 2011 when it isn't a big deal to use them right now or not. That is way more important than hitting the ground running in 2008 just because you don't want to see Amezaga/Cody in centerfield for 3 more months or whatever. It's about building for the future. It's the much better course of action. Dude, I see you're the guy in the board that likes to see arguments go absolutely NOWHERE. I said "peak" as a team as in COMPETETIVE wise man. God! Is that so hard to grasp???? When players are more or less the same age, they enter their primes more or less the same age?? This is not hard. Another thing, you fail to answer my question that I ask you for the 4th time: Do we have any better option right now than to play Maybin? He is pretty much ready (just about), and we pretty much don't have a choice. You're putting wayyyyyyy too much emphasis on a rookie player and arbitration. Way too much emphasis on that. You're thinking 3 years from now. This club doesn't think like that. We think year to year dude. If we CAN help it, like in Miguel's case where we waited a little and we could afford to do that (that was a veteran team), then you hold out a few weeks to gain an extra year in arbitration. That's the only time you hold a rookie back.. But yea, go ahead, just ramble for the 3rd time about putting Maybin in AAA/AA again without addressing anything I just said and bore us all. maybe you don't get this but some players develop at different ages. meaning the peak at different ages. not every players prime year is when he is between 27-29. as for maybin there is no reason to waste his service time when he would be learning the same skills at double-a as he would in the majors. he has no reason to be on the big club when he is our best prospect and we have no chance to compete next year. if we were ready to compete and he was the best option we had he would be starting but there is no reason to cause mental damage when hes hitting .150 over the course of a season when he could be hitting .300 and developing the same skills at the same rate

just think of the mermaids

Yeah it's just that, when you hit 26, you're really no longer a prospect. It's not that he's "old", it's just that he's not young. And when you don't have a good minor league year until you're 25, that just sets off red-flags. I do like his eye though, 13.4% walk percent last year, which could be valueable at 2B...and he has played 19 games at SS and one at 2B so it's not like moving him around would be groundbreaking. matt and owens? some players develop slower than others

Gaby Sanchez will be at 3B I see we are starting the virtual splooge fest over Gaby Sanchez again. Id almost forgot about it. Go with Lee Mitchell. And NNY...Mitchell aint that old. 25(ish) right? mitchell born Born: April 21, 1982 so hes 25 will turn 26 in the beginning of the season lets see hope gaby can play defense or hope mitchell's 07 season wasnt a fluke idk if those stats are right but 11 erros at third in 30 games in 05 does not impress and those 3 years batting under .260 from 04-06 makes you really wonder i must say i am glad there are other options because a guy who never hit above a ball and a guy who is prime candidate for a fluke season in 07 would not be good for entering the season.

I realize that people keep talking about this because it was mentioned more officially, but does anyone here that Uggla would be a better 3B than Hanley? My vote would be to move Hanley to 3B and split time w/ Amezaga & Andino at SS. I suggest it mainly because we do already have those two, who are primarily SS as opposed to needing to acquire/develop another 3B or 2B (or convert someone from another position). The only conversion involved here (Hanley to 3B) would be smoother than any of the others IMO. Plus I think the chances of us signing anyone with decent experience to fill the spot is close to zero, for the same reason we need to even have this discussion. heres the breakdown of games played at third according to thebaseballcube.com hanley 3 games amezaga 56 games andino 0 games uggla 228 uggla has spent the most time there in his career and if you shift him amezaga has spent more than enough time at second. if andino is starting i would like to see him at short all ive heard is his defense has been MLB caliber since hes been drafted

Yeah, Hanley's pretty much the man. Over the course of many at bats that man is the man no matter where you put him in the lineup. I know I may get killed for saying this, but I thought Hanley was a better hitter than Miggy last season. In fact, I'll go so far as predict that he'll be the best all around hitter in all of baseball within 2-3 years. I just hope we buy out a few years of his arbitration at least. i hope we offer him a huge 15 year deal once a stadium deal is done but i know its not going to happen

the only thing that made me hate andino was the whole dogging it in AFL but besides that i think he is the classic shortstop built for defense with speed not power. i haven't seen him play enough to judge his defense but from what i read his errors in the minors are just because he trys to hard which makes me wonder what was going on in the AFL