I wonder if the Marlins are taking notice of what is happening with the Shaq acquisition. All of a sudden, this city is all-Heat, all the time. Everyone is a Heat fan - and that is translating, most importantly, to the ticket office.

 

The media is all over this too - with good feeling. No one can deny the power of Shaq and his ability and the fact that now, the Heat as a team cant be denied and are instant contenders.

 

I wonder if the Marlins see this as a possibility for them, too. Arison and Loria, to me, have similar mentalities in regards to running their franchises. The thing that Loria lacks is a stadium, but both men want to run tip-top organizations.

 

But, if the fate of the Heat can be changed with one, huge acquisition, couldnt the Marlins be changed as well? Of course, it was probably one of the biggest deals in NBA history - the Babe Ruth kind - and probably, one of the dumbest for the Lakers.

 

I want the Marlins to take notice - if you pull the trigger on a deal as big as, or nearly as big as, the Shaq deal - it will pay off. This team needs juice. It needs a shot in the arm. I can sense that the fan base is becoming apathetic again and now that Shaq has arrived, the buzz has left the Marlins and gone to AAA and the Heat.

 

Also, the argument is made that you can and should, if you have the chance, give up a few very nice pieces for one great one. If there is an opportunity out there for the Marlins to acquire a great piece - a missing piece - then they should do it. Why? To not only lift this team, but to lift this franchise. If they want to get continued support for the future, they need to keep everyone's attention fixed on the Marlins' franchise.

Generally I agree but for two things.

 

The Heat have their own arena, the Marlins don't and with the worst lease in baseball (not to mention arbitration with the Canadian minority owners still out there) cannot afford to make the kind of acquisition you have.

 

Not to say you're wrong because I understand your motivation, this team clearly needs a big time jumpstart, but I fear the economic situation the Fish find themselves makes it impossible.

 

Secondly, I can't think of a baseball player, Roger Clemens included, that rises to the icon level that Shaq does. Not even Vlad G or Soriano or any other player in baseball is so well known as Shaq.

 

He is unique. He's the Mohammed Ali or Babe Ruth of the 21st century.

I do agree that there really is no baseball player of Shaq's status - which I suggested in my original post. I also agree that the economic situation that the Marlins are currently under prohibits, or impedes, their ability to make such an acquisition.

 

But I still feel that if you have the ability to do so - the Marlins should do it. Here is why (perhaps I should have stated this more so in my original post):

 

To help push the stadium deal FIRMLY into place by generating a buzz among the people that demonstrates to them that this franchise has a bright future. Acquiring a great talent would help that cause, of course, the logistics have to be factored in.

 

But it is clear to me now that the Marlins, as is, although they have enough talent to contend - need something more to make 'the magic' happen again and really assert this team's identity with the fans. The more casual fans are starting to become apathetic and eventhough the Marlins dont have a whole lot of financial strength right now - they will have even less if they start losing their newly minted fan corp.

Marlins don't plan O'Neal-size trade

 

By Greg Stoda, Palm Beach Post Staff Writer

Monday, July 12, 2004

 

 

 

MIAMI GARDENS -- And in South Florida sports relating to all things Shaquille O'Neal...

 

The Marlins will not investigate a trade for Barry Bonds, who is baseball's version of pro basketball's king, for whatever happens after the upcoming All-Star Game break. (Interestingly, Florida manager Jack McKeon kidded Sunday afternoon that his "NBA sources tell me that Miami gave up a lot" for O'Neal.)

 

Interesting, too, that McKeon, who once upon a time was known as Trader Jack during his days as general manager of the San Diego Padres, was managing Cincinnati four years ago when it made a big-name acquisition -- Ken Griffey Jr. -- that hasn't worked out very well for the Reds.

 

"He was maybe the best player in the game at the time," McKeon said, "and I was against it. We had a good, young, developing ballclub. But the emphasis went from the team to one guy all of a sudden."

 

Oh, there probably will be some reconfiguration of the Florida roster. The Marlins, despite their many struggles to this 45-43 point, are, after all, only 1 1/2 games behind National League East-leading Philadelphia.

 

"We don't need a blockbuster," said Florida's Jeff Conine, whose grand slam paced the Marlins to their 5-2 victory against the New York Mets in Pro Player Stadium on Sunday. "We've been playing pretty mediocre baseball for quite a while, but we're still close to the lead in our division."

 

But can the Marlins get to the playoffs in defense of their World Series championship working nothing more than deals perceived to be minor ones? Is a make-do philosophy going to be good enough?

 

Well, it is worth noting that Florida achieved much of its success last season after benefitting from trades for outfielder/first baseman Conine and closer Ugueth Urbina and from the free-agent signing of reliever Chad Fox.

 

Might a move or two along similar lines have the same effect this time around?

 

"I think it could," Conine said. "There's a lot to be said for doing things that way."

 

Nor does McKeon seem inclined to go for a big splash in the marketplace. The Marlins need more hitting and are deep in starting pitching, but McKeon doesn't sound as though he wants his front-office bosses to deal from that position.

 

"We can't afford to," McKeon said. "Hitters are at a premium, but I don't like the cost."

 

It's worth noting, too, that the Marlins were 49-46 and 13 games behind Atlanta in the NL East going into the All-Star Game last year, but recovered to finish 91-71 before going merrily on their post-season trek.

 

More good news for the Marlins is that the majority of their assignments -- 41 of the remaining 74 games -- after this week's four-day break are in their NL East neighborhood. Florida has been very good (22-13) against Philadelphia, Atlanta, Montreal and the Mets this season.

 

In all probability, however, the Marlins will have to win their division to gain playoff qualification. It's almost certain that it will require fewer wins to earn the title in the bunched-up East than it will to earn the National League's wild-card berth. Philadelphia, for example, is 46-41 right now while San Francisco (49-40) is at the front of the wild-card pack.

 

So, no, the Marlins won't seek any deal even approaching something O'Nealian.

 

"We don't have the kind of talent to do that, anyway," McKeon said.

 

He'll settle for whatever smaller upgrades Florida might try to make, which is easier to do with a World Series trophy handy as a blueprint for what's possible.

 

McKeon is enthusiastic, to be sure, about the Heat getting O'Neal, but he doesn't like the potential holes he sees in the lineup.

 

The Marlins, out of necessity and by design, will chase a championship in a different manner.

 

 

It would be amazing if they found a way to add an elite player into the mix, but outside of Jeter, ARod, Randy Johnson, and Barry Bonds there simply isn't anyone of the name value to generate the same level of excitement to the casual fan. Also, baseball is the only sport where a batter (not named Bonds) does not affect the game any more than any of his 8 other teammates.

 

Either way, Loria doesn't really want to/can't afford to. He got his ring last year, he's getting his stadium in all likelihood, so why the hell does he want to spend more money? Especially when he doesn't have a whole hell of a lot to begin with.

i'd rather just win....who cares if we don't have as many bandwagoners....as long as we don't blow our payroll on a big name dude, and just spend wisely.

 

Honestly, if we're the 5th most popular team in Miami, I wouldn't care. I don't root for the fans, I root for the team. As long as we have a place to play, and players on the field (in a competitive manner), I'm happy. I don't want what happened in Texas with A-Rod (1 good player, crappy other stuff). Let's just build our dynasty,not trade away for a big-namer so we can create a buzz in Miami.

Besides the fact the Heat have only 3 starters right now, and the only thing this deal has influenced is the ticket office, Shaq gets injured that team wins 20 games, but I just don't see anyone except Barry Bonds that could have such a great impact, and he is unattainable unless you want to give the giants the whole team.

The closest we could get to a baseball shaq is Randy Johnson but that would pretty much never happen.

I remember this past offseason there were rumors and articles that the marlins had interest in A-Rod and I think it was said that they were one of the few teams that he could go to.

 

Now that would have Generated alot of Buzz and Deplete our Farm System Totally

 

 

:plain

I remember this past offseason there were rumors and articles that the marlins had interest in A-Rod and I think it was said that they were one of the few teams that he could go to.

 

Now that would have Generated alot of Buzz and Deplete our Farm System Totally

 

 

:plain

461808[/snapback]

 

Yeah, according to the NY tabloids we were the #2 for ARod. Now finishing second means nothing, but this was done at a time when this team had a sense of urgency...we still didn't have the stadium.

 

I know I sound really negative, but if we didn't have the stadium pretty much locked up, we'd be loading up right now. As it is, Loria's pretty much content with mediocrity as long as he gets his stadium...damn it's frustrating.

One major key difference:

 

$$$$$$$

 

Loria doesn't have deep pocket Arison has.

Baseball is very different from Basketball in that adding 1 significant player in basekettball can really effect your wins-losses while baseball is different since its a team game. For example, Shaq is involved in every scoring chance the Heat has (for 32 mins anyways) where baseball Barry bonds has only 4 AB's in the game but if his teamates arent hitting then he cant make too much of a difference.

If fans are again becoming apathetic they probably weren't fans anyway. The trade of O'Neal should in no way place no pressure on the Marlins to do something stupid. Yes some changes are needed but a trade with the magnitude of a player of Shaq's prescence will ultimately break the franchise. The MArlins need to stay within their budget. This franchise needs to continue to put a competitive team on the field that the fans feel can challenge for a championship.

Baseball is very different from Basketball in that adding 1 significant player in basekettball can really effect your wins-losses while baseball is different since its a team game.

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So true.

"baseball is very different from Basketball in that adding 1 significant player in basekettball can really effect your wins-losses while baseball is different since its a team game."

 

 

well, pudge made a difference. and with him now, we'd be in 1st place.

I am glad to see people responding to this topic. Part of the problem, at least for me, is about the stadium. Are we getting it? What is the progress? I remember that we were expecting a formal presentation about the future plans of the stadium - back in May. We still havent seen that yet. And I wonder why...

 

I guess it is a good sign that we arent loading up on talent. Because that could be a barometer of desperation for the stadium. But at the same time, you can say that Loria does not want to throw any more money into a bucket with a hole in it. Dont throw good money after bad.

 

But let's face it, we dont really know what the future of this franchise is until we get a stadium locked down. I havent seen that yet. I think Loria is committed to putting a winner on the field - but it has to be within the parameters of the budget which is dictated by the market. Without the proper revenue streams, this team will continue to have a hard time functioning. You need the stadium - and getting a winning ballclub can help that cause. And at the current rate this team is playing, we are an above average team that will contend for the NL East. I just hope that is enough to keep the fans interested - and not you all. I am preaching to the choir here.

 

But make no mistake, we NEED those 'bandwagon' fans to help out this team. They get more attention from advertisers, networks and the media - which could always translate into positive media that would support your cause.

Well, we coulda done this a few months ago, and wouldn't have had to technically give anyone up.

 

Yes, Marlins2003, I'm still bitter. I'm gonna order a Vlad Angels jersey soon.

"baseball is very different from Basketball in that adding 1 significant player in basekettball can really effect your wins-losses while baseball is different since its a team game."

 

 

well, pudge made a difference. and with him now, we'd be in 1st place.

461874[/snapback]

 

No one player, not even the great Pudge, Vlad or Beltran, could help Cabrera and Conine's inability to hit in the clutch. Or have Willis give 5 innings more than hanlf the times he's started. Or have Pierre take a decent lead. Or the bullpen. Or McKeon's tendency to play the bench too often. And so on.

"baseball is very different from Basketball in that adding 1 significant player in basekettball can really effect your wins-losses while baseball is different since its a team game."

 

 

well, pudge made a difference. and with him now, we'd be in 1st place.

461874[/snapback]

 

No one player, not even the great Pudge, Vlad or Beltran, could help Cabrera and Conine's inability to hit in the clutch. Or have Willis give 5 innings more than hanlf the times he's started. Or have Pierre take a decent lead. Or the bullpen. Or McKeon's tendency to play the bench too often. And so on.

461971[/snapback]

 

Are you bagging on Cabrera?

 

If so.... :lol :lol :lol :lol

His RISP numbers speak for themselves.

 

EVERYONE on this team has struggled.

I would say that Barry Bonds would be the equivalent of a Shaq. There's no way it can be a starting pitcher like Randy Johnson because he can only beat you every 5th day. Bonds is in there every day and there has never been a hitter as feared as he is. Look at his walk totals. His intentional walks alone are higher than most teams...

 

Look at the percentage of walks vs hits and look at the numbers he still puts up. He's up there with the league leaders in homeruns with half the at bats....The only bad thing about baseball is that the opposition can take him out of the game by walking him all the time. But you can't deny the impact Bonds has in the lineup.

Of course, it was probably one of the biggest deals in NBA history - the Babe Ruth kind - and probably, one of the dumbest for the Lakers.

461751[/snapback]

 

No way, LA acquiring Kareem from Milwaukee, the Sixers acquiring Dr. J from the Nets for a mere $3 million, Jerry West trading Vlade Divac to Charlotte for the rights to draft Kobe Bryant, Sixers acquiring Moses Malone, Lakers trading scrubs to the Jazz for the #1 pick which was Magic Johnson, and the Celtics trading for the rights to draft Bill Russel who brought them 11 championships in 13 years: all much larger acquisitions than Miami trading their entire starting front court for Shaq, and unless Shaq brings Miami a championship, the Lakers signing Shaq as a free agent after his Orlando days was a far larger deal than the current one involving him.

well, its only 3 players, and only one of them could be considered a "great" player (odom) caron and grant are just average.

 

Shaq is great, bigger than great.