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Let's Talk about Religion


Das Texan
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This thread is the result of a late night chat last night....

 

I know there is a God thread somewhere here, but I dont feel like rehashing what was said at that time, if you want to reference it, the title I believe is the God thread.

 

 

Here is the gist of this topic, its an all emcompassing topic, discussing the role of God, religion, icongraphy, etc (basically anything religious)

 

I'll let someone else really kick this off....

 

 

But I will start by expressing my personal faith. I am a Catholic. I dont like the Roman Catholic Church for many of the things that it belives and preaches in. However, my faith remains rooted in Catholicism based on the actual dogma of the faith and not necessarily what some 'man of the cloth' tells me.

 

 

Throw out any thoughts, questions, ideas, etc regarding anything religious. Expect more from me later today.

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i'm a confirmed catholic as well and like you I dont like many things about the organized religion ( in fact, I become more and more against ALL organized relgion everyday). I like the catholic church for it's community (even though I rarely go to church anymore). I also like the morals and characteristics the bible preeches, even though they aren't always practiced by the church itself.

 

With the dogma, I have my reservations. I believe there is a higher being, a god of some sort that without it there would be no life. But I dont know how much actual presence said God has on the physical world and i certainly dont think that our lives are written out for us. While I belive in fate I also believe that you can lead a horse to water but can NOT make it drink. I belive fate brings us to crossroads and decisions and we have to make the right ones to fulfill our destinies.

 

I certainly think that we have souls and there is something beyond the physical world that we can not see. If I believe this then it only makes sense that the soul has to go somewhere after our bodies die. I dont know if there is an actual heaven and hell but I do think that something happens to our "energy" after the body dies.

 

I dont think I need religion to be a good human or lead a good life, unfortunatley some people do rely on their religion and I think there lies the downfall of organized religion. People need a safety blanket and will do anything to protect it. That is one of the main reasons there have been so many wars fought in the name of religion or ideologies. Religions should be a source of mythology, a collection of stories that give you good morals and show you good ways to lead a life. I think that when relgions become to powerful and are taken to the extreme (fundamentalist) is when the problems arise, obviously. I really think the world would be better off without religion.

 

spirituality is what is important, not religion itself.....atleast, that's the way i think it should be. unfortunatley religion is too important for too many people and it is here to stay

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Guest Fritz

I grew up pretty non-religious. I believe in God, but I don't think he's as stupid as religious people the world over seem to think he is. He's omniscient, omnipotent, etc. so I don't think he gets bent out of shape over tits, profanity, premarital sex, etc. He probably isn't too keen on people that abuse kids, kill people, and rape individuals.

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For all Catholics here....

 

 

what is your thought of the Catholic Church especially what happens in Rome....also have you heard about some of the reforms the pope wants to do and if so what is your reaction to them?

 

 

Non-Catholics also are more than welcome to answer.

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I grew up pretty non-religious. I believe in God, but I don't think he's as stupid as religious people the world over seem to think he is. He's omniscient, omnipotent, etc. so I don't think he gets bent out of shape over tits, profanity, premarital sex, etc. He probably isn't too keen on people that abuse kids, kill people, and rape individuals.

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The thing about that is, you have shaped God around your values (and the values of most of society I hope) where as in religion, people's values are shaped around God. Just an observation, not a criticism. I didn't become a Christian until I was 15 and since then, many of my values have changed as well as how I view life.

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As a Catholic, I hate the Catholic Church. I'm a Catholic because I share the general beliefs that the church teaches. However, I don't believe anyone who doesn't automatically convert will burn in Hell for all of eternity. I also think its ridiculous for the church to decide what God's view on certain issues would be.

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I grew up pretty non-religious. I believe in God, but I don't think he's as stupid as religious people the world over seem to think he is. He's omniscient, omnipotent, etc. so I don't think he gets bent out of shape over tits, profanity, premarital sex, etc. He probably isn't too keen on people that abuse kids, kill people, and rape individuals.

869292[/snapback]

The thing about that is, you have shaped God around your values (and the values of most of society I hope) where as in religion, people's values are shaped around God. Just an observation, not a criticism. I didn't become a Christian until I was 15 and since then, many of my values have changed as well as how I view life.

869382[/snapback]

Then I guess the same thing could be said about the way you view God from your interpretation of whatever "holy" book you hold dear. I like Fritz's idea of God more than the one you probably hold.

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I grew up pretty non-religious. I believe in God, but I don't think he's as stupid as religious people the world over seem to think he is. He's omniscient, omnipotent, etc. so I don't think he gets bent out of shape over tits, profanity, premarital sex, etc. He probably isn't too keen on people that abuse kids, kill people, and rape individuals.

869292[/snapback]

The thing about that is, you have shaped God around your values (and the values of most of society I hope) where as in religion, people's values are shaped around God. Just an observation, not a criticism. I didn't become a Christian until I was 15 and since then, many of my values have changed as well as how I view life.

869382[/snapback]

Then I guess the same thing could be said about the way you view God from your interpretation of whatever "holy" book you hold dear. I like Fritz's idea of God more than the one you probably hold.

869500[/snapback]

I'm glad to hear you say that. :)

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I was raised Jewish, but I am an atheist. I am not saying that it is *impossible* for any god to exist, but I do find the concept rather unlikely and therefore do not believe that one does.

 

I think people have a mistaken idea of what an atheist is, which is why it has a negative connotation that goes along with it. All an atheist is, is a person who is not a theist (which is a person who believes in any, not just the Christian, god).

 

People also have a HUGE misunderstanding of what an "agnostic" is. The common idea of an agnostic is a person who doesn't know whether or not they believe in God. This person is an atheist. In order to be a theist, you have to positively assert that you believe in God. If you don't know whether you can positively assert that you believe in God, you are not a theist, therefore you are an a-theist ("a" being a prefix that means "without"-- atheism is "without theism"). When you can say "I believe in God" you then are a theist.

 

Furthermore, theism and atheism have to do with beliefs. A theist believes in God. An atheist doesn't believe in God. Agnosticism does not pertain to beliefs, but it instead pertains to knowledge. An agnostic does not have knowledge of whether or not God exists. Therefore, everyone is an agnostic. Nobody, whether they claim to or not, actually 100% *knows* of God's existence... they can believe, they can have faith, but they do not have *knowledge*. So you can be an agnostic atheist (a person who doesn't know whether God exists but doesn't believe that he does) or an agnostic theist (a person who doesn't know whether God exists but believes that he does).

 

I am always interested in religion threads. I am very open-minded in my views and love to hear people's opinions on the subject as well as explain answers to questions people have on my own. I do not bash or insult people's beliefs and just ask that they in turn do the same towards others.

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Agnostic. There's no scientific evidence for the proof of or against a Intelligent Design.

 

Anyways, it's like David Cross says, "The bible was written during a time when people were even dumber than they are today! Think about that." And I'm inclined to concur. Various inconsistencies and contradictions that are well-catalogued are contained within the book ("thou shalt not kill" and the vengeful God being just one; and what about the part that says it's okay to stone bad children?).

 

I like to hear opinions, just don't try and push it onto me. It's cool if you believe in God (not to the extent that you'd kill an abortion doctor), or don't believe in God. Just don't get all... weird.

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My faith's foundation is based on solely the words of Jesus Christ as written in the New Testament.

 

I am very weary of taking anything written by any of the Apostles as absolute fact. The only truth is in the red letters.

 

Even so the Bible has been translated and cut and pasted by the Catholic Church over the centuries, so as a thinking individual I must believe that what I see in the Bible is not everything that was written by the Apostles and by the men of the Old Testament. We all must be weary of this and remain open to the fact that we may learn new things about our faith after our life on Earth.

 

I happen to really enjoy the Baptist's style of running a church, hence why I go to a Baptist church. However I do not call myself a Baptist, I call myself a follower of Jesus Christ. The term Christian is used too loosely in this age, which is why I say 'follower of Jesus Christ.'

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What do people mean when they refer to organized religions? Like animist religions? Most religions are pretty ordered, (pantheon of gods/spirits, tennets, creation myths etc.)

 

I respect all religions and I don't think one is better or more truthful than the other. I can't refute someone who says a mighty spirit is behind the rising and setting of the sun or that a bread wafer is the body of Christ.

 

I like to think that in the afterlife we enter a plane that our chosen belief has promised us. If the person is athiest and truly believes in thier heart that there is nothing after death then he or she will fade away in oblivion.

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What do people mean when they refer to organized religions? Like animist religions? Most religions are pretty ordered, (pantheon of gods/spirits, tennets, creation myths etc.)

 

I respect all religions and I don't think one is better or more truthful than the other. I can't refute someone who says a mighty spirit is behind the rising and setting of the sun or that a bread wafer is the body of Christ.

 

I like to think that in the afterlife we enter a plane that our chosen belief has promised us. If the person is athiest and truly believes in thier heart that there is nothing after death then he or she will fade away in oblivion.

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Sums it up nicely. I also concur with your last paragraph. I'm not an atheist, but I surely do not wish to live forever, on earth or the afterlife. Eternal life is a curse.

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I went to catholic school from K-12th grade and now I am an atheist. Its not that catholicism is bad it just that you learn everything about the religion and then you come to an age when you just sit there and say I dont believe most of what they say. If I still believed in God and Jesus, I would be a catholic but I wouldn't hold the decrees of the vatican as absolute. The pope is still one of the holiest men in all the world but the idea that he is infallible is simply illogical. The church needs to go back and look at all of the changes made by prior popes and see which ones actually are for the better of the people practicing them.

 

I think religion can be beneficial to a society in teaching morals but I just dont like the idea of people being absolute in their notion that they are right and someone else is wrong. I think in terms of religion people should have there beliefs and talk about them but they shouldnt feel that their religion is better than another and that it is there job to convert the world.

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I went to catholic school from K-12th grade and now I am an atheist. Its not that catholicism is bad it just that you learn everything about the religion and then you come to an age when you just sit there and say I dont believe most of what they say. If I still believed in God and Jesus, I would be a catholic but I wouldn't hold the decrees of the vatican as absolute. The pope is still one of the holiest men in all the world but the idea that he is infallible is simply illogical. The church needs to go back and look at all of the changes made by prior popes and see which ones actually are for the better of the people practicing them.

 

I think religion can be beneficial to a society in teaching morals but I just dont like the idea of people being absolute in their notion that they are right and someone else is wrong. I think in terms of religion people should have there beliefs and talk about them but they shouldnt feel that their religion is better than another and that it is there job to convert the world.

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except that the pope isnt really infalliable, except in very specific instances. In fact the Pope has only preached infalliablly a handful of times in 2000 years.

 

Obviously your learning wasnt that great in Catholic school.

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I used to be a better Catholic, but I have really grown to dislike the church over the last few years.

 

I disagree with the church's official stances on abortion, contraception, and a few other topics.

 

I also feel that the Catholic Church could have helped to stem the tide of AIDS that has consumed Africa over the last two decades or so, if they had come out in support of contraception and safe sex. It really could have made a difference. Unfortunately, at this point, it's too late for this to have much of an effect.

 

The church doesn't believe in stem cell research, however, I do. I think that stem cell research can lead to major medical advances in the fight against currently uncurable diseases, such as diabetes, Alzheimer's Disease, cancers, AIDS, etc.

 

The idea that the church would rather just leave the door to all of that closed and let people die from these diseases, just disgusts me sometimes.

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  • 3 months later...

The Muslims believe pretty much the same things that Catholics do except they dont believe Jesus to be The Son of God. However they do think he is a great prophet. But they think there is one other prophet who they believe is greater than Jesus. Who is he and what makes him so special to the Muslims?

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The Muslims believe pretty much the same things that Catholics do except they dont believe Jesus to be The Son of God. However they do think he is a great prophet. But they think there is one other prophet who they believe is greater than Jesus. Who is he and what makes him so special to the Muslims?

 

 

Mohamed?

 

 

 

And for the record, believing Jesus was a great prophet but not the son of God is asinine. You can't accept part of Jesus's teachings/claims and reject some of it.

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why do you have to do that communion thing for....1st communion or whatever its called...obviously i havent done mine yet.

 

 

 

Communion is an instruction of Christ. It's purpose is for believers to continue to be accepting of Jesus's message and his spiritual gift. Think of it as a reminder/commemoration.

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The Muslims believe pretty much the same things that Catholics do except they dont believe Jesus to be The Son of God. However they do think he is a great prophet. But they think there is one other prophet who they believe is greater than Jesus. Who is he and what makes him so special to the Muslims?

 

 

Mohamed?

 

 

 

And for the record, believing Jesus was a great prophet but not the son of God is asinine. You can't accept part of Jesus's teachings/claims and reject some of it.

the islamic people from what i know believe jesus to be much like isaiah, jeremiah etc as being one of the great prophets. they hold mohammed in higher esteem than jesus as from what i understand they dont accept jesus to be the son of God. They are not a Christ based religion. Much like Judaism believe in Jesus but not as the son of God. They are still waiting for him.

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Off topic but whatever, I just finished reading "The Age of Reason". One of my favorite reads in quite some time, and although I still have to read "The American Crisis", I think it's my favorite work by Paine.

 

With that said, I don't subscribe to his believe in deism but still a facinating read.

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