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Here's a funny aside relating to FanFest. I was in Tampa yesterday on a work related matter and I saw the ad in the St. Petersburg Times for Rays FanFest (which is this Saturday). If you want to get a wristband to be eligible to get autographs, you have to pay $20.00. No wristband, no autographs. Season ticket holders automatically get wristbands! Hey, at least the long lines for Marlins autographs was free!

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Coghlan is representing the Marlins. His job is to sign autographs, not to promote his religious beliefs. It would be equally ridiculous if he wrote some quote about evolution being true and intelligent design being false.

 

As the fan with the signed baseball, do you have the right to demand he redo it? No, not really. But religion is not an appropriate topic for a member of a baseball team at FanFest to broach with a stranger, whether it be in conversation or an autograph.

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Here's a funny aside relating to FanFest. I was in Tampa yesterday on a work related matter and I saw the ad in the St. Petersburg Times for Rays FanFest (which is this Saturday). If you want to get a wristband to be eligible to get autographs, you have to pay $20.00. No wristband, no autographs. Season ticket holders automatically get wristbands! Hey, at least the long lines for Marlins autographs was free!

 

Wow, having fans has really gone to their heads.

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Here's a funny aside relating to FanFest. I was in Tampa yesterday on a work related matter and I saw the ad in the St. Petersburg Times for Rays FanFest (which is this Saturday). If you want to get a wristband to be eligible to get autographs, you have to pay $20.00. No wristband, no autographs. Season ticket holders automatically get wristbands! Hey, at least the long lines for Marlins autographs was free!

 

Wow, having fans has really gone to their heads.

 

YEah, it's pretty funny that way. Considering my relative position to the Rays compared to the Marlins, I've obviously been to more Rays Fan Fests than Marlins (what's equally funny is that even though I have been a Marlins fan since Day 1, I've actually not made it down for one! This was the first year it looked like we were finally going to make it down only to have my hopes dashed).

 

They didn't start the charging for auto wristbands thing until last year (because of their 08 WS success, obviously). There were easily double the people there last year than the previous two, and a lot of people buying the wristbands. What sucks about the setup is that they either schedule the best players in the same line (which is untenable, to say the least, since season ticket holders also get in an hour earlier than everyone else w/ those wristbands) or they stagger them throught the various lines throughout the day (which is also untenable since most people get in line ahead of time for the upcomign star, but don't move for the current player...really sucks if you actually want to get the player that is signing at the moment).

 

I would like to say that the $20 is technically a donation and completely goes to charity (this year, Haiti relief), so it's not entirely a bad practice. However, if you're going to drop that kind of cash for somethign every other team doesn't charge for in their FanFests, there should be some guarantees that you're going to get at least one bigger player. Either they should pass out tickets, or just not announce who's going to be in what line at what time. That at least gives everyone a fair chance and makes the lines much for manageable. For this reason, I decided not to go this year because my $40 last year (my wife and I) got us only a bunch of relief pitchers and non-roster ST invitees.

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Here's a funny aside relating to FanFest. I was in Tampa yesterday on a work related matter and I saw the ad in the St. Petersburg Times for Rays FanFest (which is this Saturday). If you want to get a wristband to be eligible to get autographs, you have to pay $20.00. No wristband, no autographs. Season ticket holders automatically get wristbands! Hey, at least the long lines for Marlins autographs was free!

 

Wow, having fans has really gone to their heads.

 

YEah, it's pretty funny that way. Considering my relative position to the Rays compared to the Marlins, I've obviously been to more Rays Fan Fests than Marlins (what's equally funny is that even though I have been a Marlins fan since Day 1, I've actually not made it down for one! This was the first year it looked like we were finally going to make it down only to have my hopes dashed).

 

They didn't start the charging for auto wristbands thing until last year (because of their 08 WS success, obviously). There were easily double the people there last year than the previous two, and a lot of people buying the wristbands. What sucks about the setup is that they either schedule the best players in the same line (which is untenable, to say the least, since season ticket holders also get in an hour earlier than everyone else w/ those wristbands) or they stagger them throught the various lines throughout the day (which is also untenable since most people get in line ahead of time for the upcomign star, but don't move for the current player...really sucks if you actually want to get the player that is signing at the moment).

 

I would like to say that the $20 is technically a donation and completely goes to charity (this year, Haiti relief), so it's not entirely a bad practice. However, if you're going to drop that kind of cash for somethign every other team doesn't charge for in their FanFests, there should be some guarantees that you're going to get at least one bigger player. Either they should pass out tickets, or just not announce who's going to be in what line at what time. That at least gives everyone a fair chance and makes the lines much for manageable. For this reason, I decided not to go this year because my $40 last year (my wife and I) got us only a bunch of relief pitchers and non-roster ST invitees.

when was rays fanfest?

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Coghlan is representing the Marlins. His job is to sign autographs, not to promote his religious beliefs. It would be equally ridiculous if he wrote some quote about evolution being true and intelligent design being false.

 

As the fan with the signed baseball, do you have the right to demand he redo it? No, not really. But religion is not an appropriate topic for a member of a baseball team at FanFest to broach with a stranger, whether it be in conversation or an autograph.

 

 

 

Why is it wrong? I don't see it as proselytizing.

Obviously, that bible verse is very important to HIM, and it's part of his autograph.

 

If people don't like it...don't ask for his autograph. He has the right to sign however he likes.

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Here's a funny aside relating to FanFest. I was in Tampa yesterday on a work related matter and I saw the ad in the St. Petersburg Times for Rays FanFest (which is this Saturday). If you want to get a wristband to be eligible to get autographs, you have to pay $20.00. No wristband, no autographs. Season ticket holders automatically get wristbands! Hey, at least the long lines for Marlins autographs was free!

 

Wow, having fans has really gone to their heads.

 

YEah, it's pretty funny that way. Considering my relative position to the Rays compared to the Marlins, I've obviously been to more Rays Fan Fests than Marlins (what's equally funny is that even though I have been a Marlins fan since Day 1, I've actually not made it down for one! This was the first year it looked like we were finally going to make it down only to have my hopes dashed).

 

They didn't start the charging for auto wristbands thing until last year (because of their 08 WS success, obviously). There were easily double the people there last year than the previous two, and a lot of people buying the wristbands. What sucks about the setup is that they either schedule the best players in the same line (which is untenable, to say the least, since season ticket holders also get in an hour earlier than everyone else w/ those wristbands) or they stagger them throught the various lines throughout the day (which is also untenable since most people get in line ahead of time for the upcomign star, but don't move for the current player...really sucks if you actually want to get the player that is signing at the moment).

 

I would like to say that the $20 is technically a donation and completely goes to charity (this year, Haiti relief), so it's not entirely a bad practice. However, if you're going to drop that kind of cash for somethign every other team doesn't charge for in their FanFests, there should be some guarantees that you're going to get at least one bigger player. Either they should pass out tickets, or just not announce who's going to be in what line at what time. That at least gives everyone a fair chance and makes the lines much for manageable. For this reason, I decided not to go this year because my $40 last year (my wife and I) got us only a bunch of relief pitchers and non-roster ST invitees.

when was rays fanfest?

 

This past Saturday.

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Coghlan is representing the Marlins. His job is to sign autographs, not to promote his religious beliefs. It would be equally ridiculous if he wrote some quote about evolution being true and intelligent design being false.

 

As the fan with the signed baseball, do you have the right to demand he redo it? No, not really. But religion is not an appropriate topic for a member of a baseball team at FanFest to broach with a stranger, whether it be in conversation or an autograph.

 

 

 

Why is it wrong? I don't see it as proselytizing.

Obviously, that bible verse is very important to HIM, and it's part of his autograph.

 

If people don't like it...don't ask for his autograph. He has the right to sign however he likes.

Why is this such an issue-because it is religion. If abortion, pro or con, was "very important to him" then would you want him to sign his name and follow it by "ban baby killers". I think that would be a starting point. How would management view that. How would you view that-depending on your point of view, especially if you only expected his name on your ball.

I have commented on this and then not responded to even a personal attacks on me for an objective view. If I don't want his sig with a biblical reference, you are right, just don't ask for it-BUT-at a fan fest there are certain expectations and if I am unaware that his baseball signature will have it, then your comment is wrong. That is the point. His beliefs are respected but people did not know that to get his sig comes with a condition. I still do not think that a parent should have to expect that their 5 year child will get anything other than a baseball signature without religious promotion. That is NOT the correct thing to do. Respectfully, he may ask if the person would be ok if puts in a bible reference rather than just doing it. It is mutual respect.

As to the remark that I probably don't agree with him and that is why I am against it, that person who wrote it misses the point and always will. I do not even know what the scripture says and I may fully agree with it. But I do not have to read it to have the opinion I have. The point is that many people fully agree with him as to his beliefs , but at the same time would not agree with him using the fanfest to express those views,especially if it was unexpected. That is all this is about. It is not denying one his right to his religious beliefs.

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Why is this such an issue-because it is religion. If abortion, pro or con, was "very important to him" then would you want him to sign his name and follow it by "ban baby killers". I think that would be a starting point. How would management view that. How would you view that-depending on your point of view, especially if you only expected his name on your ball.

I have commented on this and then not responded to even a personal attacks on me for an objective view. If I don't want his sig with a biblical reference, you are right, just don't ask for it-BUT-at a fan fest there are certain expectations and if I am unaware that his baseball signature will have it, then your comment is wrong. That is the point. His beliefs are respected but people did not know that to get his sig comes with a condition. I still do not think that a parent should have to expect that their 5 year child will get anything other than a baseball signature without religious promotion. That is NOT the correct thing to do. Respectfully, he may ask if the person would be ok if puts in a bible reference rather than just doing it. It is mutual respect.

As to the remark that I probably don't agree with him and that is why I am against it, that person who wrote it misses the point and always will. I do not even know what the scripture says and I may fully agree with it. But I do not have to read it to have the opinion I have. The point is that many people fully agree with him as to his beliefs , but at the same time would not agree with him using the fanfest to express those views,especially if it was unexpected. That is all this is about. It is not denying one his right to his religious beliefs.

 

 

Anotherrealfan- I'm assuming the "person" you're referring to would be me. I've read through my post several times trying to find out where I personally attacked you or your views (which clearly ARE NOT objective); are we really to a point in this country where disagreeing with someone on a message board is considered libel? I did not state you disagreed with Cogs putting on a religous message because that message didn't match with your beliefs like you said above; I simply asked if his views aligned with yours, would you still have a problem? Your post said you respected his beliefs, but he did not respect yours; however, clearly you don't respect his beliefs as you're decrying him for professing his faith which is protected by the US Constitution.

 

The First Ammendment guarantees the free exercise of religion, both public and private. The only restrictions apply to the State establishing a State religion (or favoring/recognizing one faith over another) and to the denial of the right of religous belief/worship (except where the practice of that faith conflicts with other governing laws, ie polygamy or human ritual sacrafice). Saying the man cannot write a religous inscription on an autograph is violating not only Freedom of Religion, but the 1st Ammendment protection of Freedom of Speach regardless of whether you feel the message or the vehicle/venue for the message is appropriate.

 

You and others have mentioned that he shouldn't be doing this because he's representing the Marlins at Fanfest. While it's reasonable not to expect a religous inscription at a pre-season event, per Employment law, the Marlins couldn't restrict this practice even if they wanted to- it would be considered Religous Discrimination. In addition, Contractually each player is required to attend FanFest, but as far as I know, they are not required to sign autographs. If that is the case, they are acting as an Independent Contractor/Entrepenuer in signing autographs. The transaction is between the fan and the player, not the fan and the Marlins, so they have NO say.

 

Trust me, I do "get it." I quietly practice my faith, letting my actions and the way I live my life be the reflection of that faith. I do not like Bible Thumpers, bikers or whoever wants to impose their will over others as the "truth" or "one way." However, real respect is realizing this great country grants them the right to do that while granting me the right to crumble their pamphlet in the garbage can or slamming my front door on them mid-spiel. If this inscription is truly bothering you as much as it seems to be, I go back to my original post: obscure the passage with more Sharpie. Or get rid of it and replace with another Cogs auto sans inscription (ebay has plenty to choose from, some as low as a $1).

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The discussion of the First Amendment has very little to do with this. And although I'm not yet a lawyer (so I don't know the law in and out - maybe "..." can chime in), I think the Marlins are allowed to tell their employees not to breach the topic of religion with fans. That's not religious discrimination; that's just saying to avoid the topic altogether.

 

And they are still at the Marlins' event and in the Marlins' stadium. They are acting much more as representatives of the team than they are as independent contractors. There is no contractual exchange of good and services, so there are no Independent Contractors or Entrepreneurs. If your definition were accurate, it would seem that if I walk by you and ask for a high-five, then you are an independent contractor in giving me that high-five.

 

I agree that the fan doesn't have a say, as in that they don't have a right to demand a particular autograph in a particular fashion. I still find it overall inappropriate.

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